Scientology

[Teejay]

In my opinion religions are bullshit, however nearly all of them are well intended, even Mormonism. However Scientology is not one of them, it was created by L Ron Hubbard as a money making enterprise. The only reason I can see Scientology is legally a religion (that does not have to pay tax) is because a lot of Hollywood celebrities are members of the Church of Scientology 

I do advocate at least stripping the tax free status from the Church of Scientology and force them to pay all taxes they owe the government.

[Pyraxis]

An interesting scientology true account - this woman posted on a discussion board I used to be a member of.

The following is an account of my life in Scientology, a group I was involved in from December 1970 to August of 1976 -- about 5 years and 9 months. From 1973 to 1975 I lived aboard the Flagship Apollo ("Flag"), the home of L. Ron Hubbard, the founder of Dianetics and Scientology. On Flag, I trained to be an auditor (a Scientology counselor). My life on Flag was a continual roller-coaster of ups and downs. One day I would receive a personal commendation from Hubbard and be held up as an example of what a Flag auditor should be and then, just months later, Hubbard would take away all my certificates and send me to the RPF (Scientology's prison camp) for an auditing error I did not even commit. On Flag as auditors, we were under continuous pressure to be perfect, the standard of perfection being the whim of L. Ron Hubbard.

Many people, no doubt, have read horror stories about what occurred on Flag and I can personally attest to the fact that they are true. This might lead one to wonder why a person would join such a group in the first place. How could anyone put up with such abuse? In writing this testimony, I hope to give people some insight into this question. The fact is that I didn't join Scientology to be ordered around and abused and I don't know anyone who did. The group I thought I joined, as an idealistic eighteen-year-old, bore little resemblance to what Scientology actually was and still is. (continued)

[El]

I read a good deal of it.  Fucking horrifying.

[Scrapheap]

It's interesting that Scientology and Fundamentalist Christianity use the same brain-washing techniques.

[Litigious]

The nazis and communists in principle do too. Or did.

[Pyraxis]

Brainwashing is brainwashing - the psyche works the same way, no matter what belief system is used as a carrier, so they all have methods in common.

[Nomaken]

I'd prefer to seperate a series of principles and ideas from those who choose to interpret those ideas in such a way as to hurt people.  I think scientology itself, just any other religion is in itself harmless.  It is as harmful as the silmarillion.  And it bothers me when assholes repeatedly give a harmless superstition a bad name.  I don't know why scientology is so prone to produce and be represented by assholes, maybe something about it is inherently flawed and prone to cause that, but I'd like to believe it is the people, not the ideas which are potentially harmful.

I do think their beliefs are idiotic and rediculous, but the idea that there is an invisible man who watches everything you do every minute of every day, who will send you to hell for doing anything wrong, but loves you, isn't that much better.  I'd like to believe that since scientology is relatively new, and we haven't broken their spirits as a whole (like we have the other religions) that that is why they think they can get away with opressing us.

Essentially, I am cool with scientology, but not people who use it to hurt people, a standard I apply to every religion.

[Scrapheap]

The nazis and communists in principle do too. Or did.

Brainwashing is brainwashing - the psyche works the same way, no matter what belief system is used as a carrier, so they all have methods in common.

 

[Calandale]

In my opinion religions are bullshit, however nearly all of them are well intended, even Mormonism. However Scientology is not one of them, it was created by L Ron Hubbard as a money making enterprise.

Actually, as I understand it, it was created as a wager, and turned into
a money-making organization. Like Heinlein, I suspect that Hubbard
more or less believed that he was giving good advice too.

I do advocate at least stripping the tax free status from the Church of Scientology and force them to pay all taxes they owe the government.

Who's to say what religions are worthy of some special status? As long
as believers think that they are following a religion, it seems enough.
I think that ALL religions should have to pay taxes, unless they can
achieve tax-free status some other way (if that's to be allowable).
Any restrictions otherwise appear to violate the establishment clause,
in the US. Most other countries have rules which allow for a different
line of thinking though.

[McGiver]

should native american indians have the right to smoke peyote in th parking lot of a grocery store?

[Calandale]

should native american indians have the right to smoke peyote in th parking lot of a grocery store?

EVERYONE should.

But given the religious issue, why not? The real purpose of the drug laws
needs to be spelled out, in order to understand why they shouldn't
be allowed it. Though, perhaps, given the laws, it shouldn't be allowed
unless there is some reason for the particular location. Otherwise, one
could argue that Christians should be allowed to drink the wine of communion
anywhere.

[Scrapheap]

should native american indians have the right to smoke peyote in th parking lot of a grocery store?

EVERYONE should.

But given the religious issue, why not? The real purpose of the drug laws
needs to be spelled out, in order to understand why they shouldn't
be allowed it. Though, perhaps, given the laws, it shouldn't be allowed
unless there is some reason for the particular location. Otherwise, one
could argue that Christians should be allowed to drink the wine of communion
anywhere.

The push to outlaw pot was funded by the post-prohibition alcohol industry who felt that pot had cut too heavily into their marketshare. They funded the propoganda film "Refer Madness".

Since pot was popular in the Black jazz movement and with mexican imigrants, there were racist ovetones to the banning of pot as well.

[Callaway]

An interesting scientology true account - this woman posted on a discussion board I used to be a member of.

The following is an account of my life in Scientology, a group I was involved in from December 1970 to August of 1976 -- about 5 years and 9 months. From 1973 to 1975 I lived aboard the Flagship Apollo ("Flag"), the home of L. Ron Hubbard, the founder of Dianetics and Scientology. On Flag, I trained to be an auditor (a Scientology counselor). My life on Flag was a continual roller-coaster of ups and downs. One day I would receive a personal commendation from Hubbard and be held up as an example of what a Flag auditor should be and then, just months later, Hubbard would take away all my certificates and send me to the RPF (Scientology's prison camp) for an auditing error I did not even commit. On Flag as auditors, we were under continuous pressure to be perfect, the standard of perfection being the whim of L. Ron Hubbard.

Many people, no doubt, have read horror stories about what occurred on Flag and I can personally attest to the fact that they are true. This might lead one to wonder why a person would join such a group in the first place. How could anyone put up with such abuse? In writing this testimony, I hope to give people some insight into this question. The fact is that I didn't join Scientology to be ordered around and abused and I don't know anyone who did. The group I thought I joined, as an idealistic eighteen-year-old, bore little resemblance to what Scientology actually was and still is. (continued)

WOW!  That was interesting reading, Pyraxis.

[Pyraxis]

  That's why I posted it. I find this kind of thing fascinating.

[Pyraxis]

Another thing that I found fascinating was that she had also been a recent staunch defender of EFT (energy field therapy), which is a highly dubious alternate medicine plan where it's believed you can cure all trauma faster than therapy by simply tapping on various parts of the body. I knew that people tended to repeat the cycle of abusive relationships by dating abusers who were just like their parents, but I hadn't seen that cycle applied to the field of philosophy/religion before. EFT has its own pseudo-cult following, nothing so bad as scientology (as far as I know) but a lot of the patterns of claims are the same.

There was also a man on this group who had been raised in a fanatical and abusive Mormon family. He described how when he was younger, he was a major public defender of Mormonism. How anytime someone even mentioned the word, or some aspect of Mormon beliefs, he would get a huge adrenalin high and immediately have to defend it, or else. Because the abuse was so closely tied to the beliefs that even thinking about denying the beliefs was tantamount to admitting that what people had done to him was abuse.

And then of course there are the Christian priests who are major activists against gay sex, and then eventually it comes to light that they've been having secret gay relationships all along.

Which means so much of these huge public debates over hot-button issues trace back to individual psychology. The gaps can't be bridged by arguing about the issue alone - you have to figure out why people believe what they do, before you have any hope of changing their minds.

Interesting applications when you consider how to approach the terrorism question.