Iran

[Gopher Gary]

I'm trolling in a troll thread, zeg. 

But yeah, it's easy to think of another culture as "devoid" of certain things - because we're told it's banned there.

Like secret nuclear arms programs? 

[odeon]

Where's the fun in having a secret nuclear arms programme if you don't drink?

[ZEGH8578]

Iran can't have a secret nuclear program, because if they have one, we would all be staring right at it, so it wouldn't be secret :0 0:

I still say North Korea is a good gauge to go by, when it comes to the pinnacle of fanatical government - with their hands on nuclear weapons: Nothing bad happens, it's a deterent. In Iran's case, it is to deter Israel, which most likely has several nukes.
With a one-on-one situation, we can then look at India and Pakistan, both whom have been quite direct in their rethorics including nukes, and who have also gone through several armed confrontations, including open war, while being nuclear powers, without resorting to nuclear attacks. Again - sworn enemies, full ability to launch and withstand, still showing restraint.

Nuclear weapons are a "dead man's switch", they're a guarantee against an overwhelming attack. Nuclear powers today are very varied, from at-constant-war powers like USA, corrupt holes like Russia, communist superpower China, poor dirthole India, fanatical little North Korea, they all keep the exact same passive strategy with their nukes.

[Jack]

they all keep the exact same passive strategy with their nukes.

Not exactly. Treaty agreements within the last twenty years also include terms against detonation for testing, which non-treaty members have no reason to adhere, and haven't. Authorized nuclear state passive strategy is also based in treaty agreements to not initiate nuclear force, but rather only in retaliation to nuclear strike, or defending allies in retaliation to nuclear strike.

[Jack]

I still say North Korea is a good gauge to go by, when it comes to the pinnacle of fanatical government - with their hands on nuclear weapons: Nothing bad happens, it's a deterent.

World government conspiracy and global control initiatives within the UN is a favorite topic, and it's annoying to discuss it within conversational guidelines of childish idealism of how the world isn't fair, and equally annoying to discuss it based on emotional rights of trust, and equally annoying when nuclear arms discussions are confined to discussions of war. It putrefies my interest in the topic. It's pointless leaving out the UK and France when listing nuclear states of the world. What government isn't a corrupt hole? Every nuclear state has stained the planet with arms testing, using test grounds convenient only to them and keeping detonations hidden from the general public. Every nuclear power has displayed reasons for mistrust with their own misconduct in the practice of using nuclear arms. Yes, something bad happens.

[Gopher Gary]

it's annoying

 

[Jack]

Am I the only one who thinks Iran will benefit more from the lifting of UN sanctions than the right to produce weapons grade uranium? The only one who thinks Iran doesn't need nuclear arms when they have an ally in Russia? The only one who sees this as a progressive step toward Iran's positive relations with the entire world? Am I the only one seeing history being made? 

[Gopher Gary]

I am very disappointment with the lack of funny jokes available for this topic. It seems the only ones with anything funny to say are the citizens of Iran. They're saying things like, I went to the grocery store and there's still no whiskey, what kind of deal is that? Should I still say down with America in my prayers? Make sure everyone knows this is only a nuclear issue and people shouldn't start walking around wearing only their tops and shorts. Those freaking Iranians are hilarious. It's a shame they don't have their own memes.

[Gopher Gary]

I'd like to see some political cartoons from other countries on this topic. Anyone have any? 

[odeon]

Am I the only one who thinks Iran will benefit more from the lifting of UN sanctions than the right to produce weapons grade uranium? The only one who thinks Iran doesn't need nuclear arms when they have an ally in Russia? The only one who sees this as a progressive step toward Iran's positive relations with the entire world? Am I the only one seeing history being made? 

No, you're not the only one.

['andersom']

Am I the only one who thinks Iran will benefit more from the lifting of UN sanctions than the right to produce weapons grade uranium? The only one who thinks Iran doesn't need nuclear arms when they have an ally in Russia? The only one who sees this as a progressive step toward Iran's positive relations with the entire world? Am I the only one seeing history being made?

Nope, you are not the only one.

[ZEGH8578]

Am I the only one who thinks Iran will benefit more from the lifting of UN sanctions than the right to produce weapons grade uranium? The only one who thinks Iran doesn't need nuclear arms when they have an ally in Russia? The only one who sees this as a progressive step toward Iran's positive relations with the entire world? Am I the only one seeing history being made?

You're probably the only one getting so aggitated about it...

Outside America, we only need to know that America has nukes, and then the rest feels a bit irrelevant. You mentioned France after I mentioned North Korea, China, India, Russia and the US?
As if France is in any way more of a nuclear risk than those five?
I know EXACTLY what the nuclear powers are - in order of number of nuclear warheads:
USA
Russia
China
France
Britain
Israel
Pakistan
India
North Korea

So chill. My point was - none of them have started a nuclear war. The only one who has ever used bombs against others in war is the US - twice. The only one who has killed people with nuclear testing is the US - once.

I'm saying none of these countries, as varied as they are, have started a nuclear war - so if we go by experience, I don't understand why people think Iran will BOOM start a nuclear holocaust just-because. North Korea IS a good gauge to go by - MUCH better than France, because France doesn't have a "sworn enemy" to destroy. NK does. Relax, and don't be so nitpicky. Of course nuclear testing is "a bad thing", it kills like a billion beetles and earth-worms.

[Jack]

Discussing world nuclear disarmament initiatives with people who are advocating a new nuclear state doesn't promote any level of chill, so no. It's not even possible to know how many people have died as a result of nuclear testing fallout, so to minimalize it to bugs and worms is too flippant to inspire a mature response.

[Jack]

No, you're not the only one.

Nope, you are not the only one.

[ZEGH8578]

Discussing world nuclear disarmament initiatives with people who are advocating a new nuclear state doesn't promote any level of chill, so no. It's not even possible to know how many people have died as a result of nuclear testing fallout, so to minimalize it to bugs and worms is too flippant to inspire a mature response.

I'm not promoting
I'm just saying, look... let's be honest. It doesn't get much worse than USA with nukes, a country at war all the time - and one who has used nukes twice. Dislike it all you like.
If that's not the best example, then it doesn't get much worse than North Korea with nukes.

Iran is neither more powerful than USA, or more reckless than North Korea. I'm just saying that IF Iran aquires nuclear weapons, the world will not enter some "new stage" of risk or danger.
I'm not saying Iran *should*, when I explain that Iran arms up in order to meet Israel - I'm *not* giving them "the right" - I am offering a reasoning behind "they won't start a nuclear war" - they aren't aquiring nukes to nuke America, for example - as many Americans did think when it came to North Korea "omg can they reach California", their main priority is using it as a dead-man switch, and their 2nd priority is using it against South Korea. China against Taiwan. India and Pakistan each others, and Iran Israel.

I'm not advocating "more nukes", that would be completely unreasonable...

There's a middle ground though. Allowing Iran to exist alongside US and North Korea, and do what they do, is not necesarily the worst thing in the universe.