Malaysia jet crashes in east Ukraine conflict zone

[bodie]

Is it a coincidence that the Home Secretary announces a full, judge led, independent enquiry into the death of Litvinenko today.  They say the timing is just a coincidence, but i doubt it.  There is a lot of anger at Russia at the moment.

How long has it been since then? That's quite a wait.

He died in 2006.  November i think.  so yes,  an enquiry on this level would normally have been done by now.

[Semicolon]

Is it a coincidence that the Home Secretary announces a full, judge led, independent enquiry into the death of Litvinenko today.  They say the timing is just a coincidence, but i doubt it.  There is a lot of anger at Russia at the moment.

How long has it been since then? That's quite a wait.

He died in 2006.  November i think.  so yes,  an enquiry on this level would normally have been done by now.

He must have been using the NHS.

The question should be why it wasn't done before now.

[bodie]

Poisoned with polonium and then a bed on the nhs?  dastardly rotten luck.  Poor bloke. 

[sg1008]

I read something in the paper about this today which seemed to indicate that the US advisors want to hold Putin accountable and blame him almost entirely, but that international pressure is pending European reaction, because apparently Europe is addicted to Russian oil.

So I guess its up to the EU what happens with the investigation. Australia and USA seem to have no qualms about it.

[bodie]

I think the British Gov are hypocrites to push for sanctions.  There have been many a dirty ruble washed in London.  Wealthy Russians own 10% of London property!  And if we are going to talk about supplies of weapons... i think Britain have much blood on hands too.

I have not seen any definitive proof that connects Russia to MH17.  Whatever happened to being innocent until proven guilty? 

[odeon]

I think the British Gov are hypocrites to push for sanctions.  There have been many a dirty ruble washed in London.  Wealthy Russians own 10% of London property!  And if we are going to talk about supplies of weapons... i think Britain have much blood on hands too.

I have not seen any definitive proof that connects Russia to MH17.  Whatever happened to being innocent until proven guilty? 

Aren't the 'mericans saying that there is proof?

[bodie]

No, the latest of their intelligence reports says the missile was fired from an area in East Ukraine held by the separatists but they have found nothing that links the Russians directly.

If you are going to impose a punishment on a country then i don't think hearsay, or what folk 'think' probably went on is grounds to do so.  There needs to be some kind of definitive proof, the kind that you would need to present in a court of law.

If there is nothing to link Russia to the murders of the passengers on MH17 then there is no case.    The EU could return to its train of thought about some half hearted watery sanctions they were mulling over because of Russian actions prior to MH17.   The truth, the blunt truth is that no one really cared that much about Ukraine prior to this event.  Not enough to really hurt Russia.  Too much gas going to Germany. 

[odeon]

Fair enough. I do agree with you that they are innocent until proven guilty.

[bodie]

If 'guilt by association' is fair then i would like to ask Mr Cameron about all the British Commonwealth countries who still outlaw gays and still marry off 12 year old girls,  etc etc.

..and about the £35billion arms we export to Moscow, etc. etc. 

Sorry, it doesn't take much to piss me off about the current gov. 

[odeon]

I bet Mr Cameron would tell you it's not the same thing at all.

[bodie]

Undoubtedly.  Like it wasn't the same when he wanted to arm Syrian Rebels.  Or the arms America sold the IRA,  allegedly.

He enjoys a good game of 'lets pick who the terrorists are from the freedom fighters'.   He is such a hypocrite.

[odeon]

Be as it may, I do hope those responsible are brought to justice.

[bodie]

So do I.  It was murder.  But do you consider that to be the operator of the equipment, the one who told him to, or whoever supplied that equipment? It is a big question.

[odeon]

The operator but especially the one who gave the order. Possibly also the one who provided the weapons, depending on when.

[bodie]

I agree about the one who gave the order.   Not so sure about the supplier,  but maybe.   Although they were not used in the way the supplier thought they would be.