2012 - a retrospective

[TheoK]

Fortes este, Papiliones! 

[odeon]

MLA created a thread where he posted 4 graphs, highlighting how much less active the site now was. He also labeled the thread "A retrospective." It appeared that he was looking for people to discuss the situation, and to look at why the site is faring so badly these days.

As someone who was a very active member of the site, but who now feels it has lost its way, I thought I was in a good position to explain why the site has lost its appeal to me.
I politely gave my opinions on the matter, and now, because yourself, and Les disagree with my opinions, you have spent the next 6 pages hassling me about my opinion.

This is exactly the kind of behavior that I was alluding to in my first couple of posts on this subject. It feels like nobody is allowed to voice an opinion that you and Les disagree with. If I have an opinion that you guys dislike, you appear to just want to hound, and hound away, pushing me to explain every word of what I've said.

But you haven't voiced any actual opinions beyond saying that you want to mix with young people, eventually qualifying it with that no, you don't mean *age-wise*.

And that's it. No explanations, no suggestions, no defining of what makes someone old or young if it isn't age, nothing about what the site should be about, no hints beyond yelling THE SITE IS DYING, THE SITE IS DYING (which incidentally doesn't make it so).

And it's more than a little confusing. And when I don't accept what I find flawed theories at face values, you retort with "this is exactly the kind of behaviour  I was talking about".

No you weren't. We did ask wtf you were on about, and quite politely too, but this is what we get as an answer, not something constructive or even remotely illuminating.

Now, I'm sure you'll put this down as another example of the grumpies clique fighting down the youth, but I really would like you to at least explain that young/old thing. If it isn't about age, then what *is* it about?

And "hassling"? Oh please.

[odeon]

There's no need to play dumb Les. You know Im not suggesting that young people are leaving because of the grumpies. Im suggesting that some of the younger people are leaving, or not sticking around, because there are so few people of their own age, who they might actually want to hang out with.
There is a big difference between what Im saying, and the opinions that you are trying your hardest to ascribe to me.

Age as in physical years? I'm confused.

['Butterflies']

Fortes este, Papiliones! 

Fortitudinis a facie tyrannidis

 

[TheoK]

Butterflies means that she wants biologically young people and young-at-heart people like me

[TheoK]

Fortes este, Papiliones! 

Fortitudinis a facie tyrannidis

 

Sic semper tyrannis! 

[Al Swearegen]

Eris left because of Pig, not because of people her own age?
Scrap left because of trying to make some bullshit point about moderation, not people not being his age?
Binty had some issue and meltdown over you or Adam i think? That is how I remember. Wasn't about people being his age or not
EBM is a seasonal poster due to his work which makes internet unavailable to him? Nothing to do with people his own age
Adam is still posting here, as is Schleed.

I have no idea what you are saying about people leaving because of the age of people on here.

[Queen Victoria]

Okay, from the Grumpiest of the Grumpies:

As far as not being able to post an opinion that Les and odeon do not agree with - This is Intensity.  Aren't we supposed to challenge (or embrace) ideas with passion?  With argument?  With just general bull headedness?  You're able to post and anyone is able to answer. 

As far as drama - I'm not a fan of the treatment Meadow, Penty, Richard, etc. get/got sometimes.  Arguments that I'm not actively involved in scare me, always did, always will.  Yes, I will on the very rare occasion post something that contributes to the argument.  This is something I've always felt, so it's not a Grup vs Only (Grownups vs Onlies, from an old Star Trek episode) thing.

Do I like seeing nudes?  Reading about constipation?  guns?  nudes?  Nope, but I'll either skip the posts, make a joke about them or check on them periodically since so many of the threads go off track and end up somewhere else.  It's my choice to avoid them.

I'll never be young, probably never like the music of the moment or the TV series of the moment, but then, who knows? I've got some good tips from Onlies.  Do we need younger members?  IMHO we need members who can be themselves.  If you can't join at any age and find a spot for yourself, then you might not be Intense.

And BTW, I realize that my QV role playing with CBC is probably wearing on the membership.  We've cut it back considerably recently.

Over and Out.  I've finished making a doddering old fool of myself for now.  And no, I'm not leaving, although, no one has asked.
 

[Al Swearegen]

Okay, from the Grumpiest of the Grumpies:

As far as not being able to post an opinion that Les and odeon do not agree with - This is Intensity.  Aren't we supposed to challenge (or embrace) ideas with passion?  With argument?  With just general bull headedness?  You're able to post and anyone is able to answer. 

As far as drama - I'm not a fan of the treatment Meadow, Penty, Richard, etc. get/got sometimes.  Arguments that I'm not actively involved in scare me, always did, always will.  Yes, I will on the very rare occasion post something that contributes to the argument.  This is something I've always felt, so it's not a Grup vs Only (Grownups vs Onlies, from an old Star Trek episode) thing.

Do I like seeing nudes?  Reading about constipation?  guns?  nudes?  Nope, but I'll either skip the posts, make a joke about them or check on them periodically since so many of the threads go off track and end up somewhere else.  It's my choice to avoid them.

I'll never be young, probably never like the music of the moment or the TV series of the moment, but then, who knows? I've got some good tips from Onlies.  Do we need younger members?  IMHO we need members who can be themselves.  If you can't join at any age and find a spot for yourself, then you might not be Intense.

And BTW, I realize that my QV role playing with CBC is probably wearing on the membership.  We've cut it back considerably recently.

Over and Out.  I've finished making a doddering old fool of myself for now.  And no, I'm not leaving, although, no one has asked.

Very wise, milady

[Queen Victoria]

Okay, from the Grumpiest of the Grumpies:

As far as not being able to post an opinion that Les and odeon do not agree with - This is Intensity.  Aren't we supposed to challenge (or embrace) ideas with passion?  With argument?  With just general bull headedness?  You're able to post and anyone is able to answer. 

As far as drama - I'm not a fan of the treatment Meadow, Penty, Richard, etc. get/got sometimes.  Arguments that I'm not actively involved in scare me, always did, always will.  Yes, I will on the very rare occasion post something that contributes to the argument.  This is something I've always felt, so it's not a Grup vs Only (Grownups vs Onlies, from an old Star Trek episode) thing.

Do I like seeing nudes?  Reading about constipation?  guns?  nudes?  Nope, but I'll either skip the posts, make a joke about them or check on them periodically since so many of the threads go off track and end up somewhere else.  It's my choice to avoid them.

I'll never be young, probably never like the music of the moment or the TV series of the moment, but then, who knows? I've got some good tips from Onlies.  Do we need younger members?  IMHO we need members who can be themselves.  If you can't join at any age and find a spot for yourself, then you might not be Intense.

And BTW, I realize that my QV role playing with CBC is probably wearing on the membership.  We've cut it back considerably recently.

Over and Out.  I've finished making a doddering old fool of myself for now.  And no, I'm not leaving, although, no one has asked.

Very wise, milady

Uh, what part was wise?  My last 5 sentences?

[Al Swearegen]

Okay, from the Grumpiest of the Grumpies:

As far as not being able to post an opinion that Les and odeon do not agree with - This is Intensity.  Aren't we supposed to challenge (or embrace) ideas with passion?  With argument?  With just general bull headedness?  You're able to post and anyone is able to answer. 

As far as drama - I'm not a fan of the treatment Meadow, Penty, Richard, etc. get/got sometimes.  Arguments that I'm not actively involved in scare me, always did, always will.  Yes, I will on the very rare occasion post something that contributes to the argument.  This is something I've always felt, so it's not a Grup vs Only (Grownups vs Onlies, from an old Star Trek episode) thing.

Do I like seeing nudes?  Reading about constipation?  guns?  nudes?  Nope, but I'll either skip the posts, make a joke about them or check on them periodically since so many of the threads go off track and end up somewhere else.  It's my choice to avoid them.

I'll never be young, probably never like the music of the moment or the TV series of the moment, but then, who knows? I've got some good tips from Onlies.  Do we need younger members?  IMHO we need members who can be themselves.  If you can't join at any age and find a spot for yourself, then you might not be Intense.

And BTW, I realize that my QV role playing with CBC is probably wearing on the membership.  We've cut it back considerably recently.

Over and Out.  I've finished making a doddering old fool of myself for now.  And no, I'm not leaving, although, no one has asked.

Very wise, milady

Uh, what part was wise?  My last 5 sentences?

Your summation of this place and what it is or isn't and such.

['Butterflies']

Okay, from the Grumpiest of the Grumpies:

As far as not being able to post an opinion that Les and odeon do not agree with - This is Intensity.  Aren't we supposed to challenge (or embrace) ideas with passion?  With argument?  With just general bull headedness?  You're able to post and anyone is able to answer. 

As far as drama - I'm not a fan of the treatment Meadow, Penty, Richard, etc. get/got sometimes.  Arguments that I'm not actively involved in scare me, always did, always will.  Yes, I will on the very rare occasion post something that contributes to the argument.  This is something I've always felt, so it's not a Grup vs Only (Grownups vs Onlies, from an old Star Trek episode) thing.

Do I like seeing nudes?  Reading about constipation?  guns?  nudes?  Nope, but I'll either skip the posts, make a joke about them or check on them periodically since so many of the threads go off track and end up somewhere else.  It's my choice to avoid them.

I'll never be young, probably never like the music of the moment or the TV series of the moment, but then, who knows? I've got some good tips from Onlies.  Do we need younger members?  IMHO we need members who can be themselves.  If you can't join at any age and find a spot for yourself, then you might not be Intense.

And BTW, I realize that my QV role playing with CBC is probably wearing on the membership.  We've cut it back considerably recently.

Over and Out.  I've finished making a doddering old fool of myself for now.  And no, I'm not leaving, although, no one has asked.

I was going to reply to Odeons post, but its hard to explain my point to him, so I'll reply to this instead.

It seemed that Odeon and Les were being purposely dumb, but if you've misunderstood me, then I mustnt be explaining myself well at all.

I do not dislike the old people here. Yes, there is at least one I dislike, but that has nothing to do with age. Many of you are among my favorite members. I have never had a problem with your role-playing. I have always enjoyed sharing a board with you, and most of the other older people.
However, much as I like a lot of the older people, I also need some more people of a similar age to myself, whether biological, or emotionally.

And I think you're right. Im just not intense enough for this place anymore.

['Butterflies']

Eris left because of Pig, not because of people her own age?
Scrap left because of trying to make some bullshit point about moderation, not people not being his age?
Binty had some issue and meltdown over you or Adam i think? That is how I remember. Wasn't about people being his age or not
EBM is a seasonal poster due to his work which makes internet unavailable to him? Nothing to do with people his own age
Adam is still posting here, as is Schleed.

I have no idea what you are saying about people leaving because of the age of people on here.

They all had their own reasons for leaving. I think the site is a hell of a lot poorer without them.

['Butterflies']

MLA created a thread where he posted 4 graphs, highlighting how much less active the site now was. He also labeled the thread "A retrospective." It appeared that he was looking for people to discuss the situation, and to look at why the site is faring so badly these days.

As someone who was a very active member of the site, but who now feels it has lost its way, I thought I was in a good position to explain why the site has lost its appeal to me.
I politely gave my opinions on the matter, and now, because yourself, and Les disagree with my opinions, you have spent the next 6 pages hassling me about my opinion.

This is exactly the kind of behavior that I was alluding to in my first couple of posts on this subject. It feels like nobody is allowed to voice an opinion that you and Les disagree with. If I have an opinion that you guys dislike, you appear to just want to hound, and hound away, pushing me to explain every word of what I've said.

But you haven't voiced any actual opinions beyond saying that you want to mix with young people, eventually qualifying it with that no, you don't mean *age-wise*.

And that's it. No explanations, no suggestions, no defining of what makes someone old or young if it isn't age, nothing about what the site should be about, no hints beyond yelling THE SITE IS DYING, THE SITE IS DYING (which incidentally doesn't make it so).

And it's more than a little confusing. And when I don't accept what I find flawed theories at face values, you retort with "this is exactly the kind of behaviour  I was talking about".

No you weren't. We did ask wtf you were on about, and quite politely too, but this is what we get as an answer, not something constructive or even remotely illuminating.

Now, I'm sure you'll put this down as another example of the grumpies clique fighting down the youth, but I really would like you to at least explain that young/old thing. If it isn't about age, then what *is* it about?

And "hassling"? Oh please.

I suppose its hard to fully explain what Im saying without using people as examples, which is kinda rude. I'll try my best, but without naming names.

Im gonna go out on a limb here and trust that youre genuinely confused by my comments, and not just looking to fight me. Im struggling to think of how to explain this to you, and I might not do a good job.



This board seems to me to be about socializing. We come on here to hang out with our mates. As much as I like many of the older members, I need to have people that are younger as well.
To use your pub analogy, when you were 22, its unlikely youd have been a regular in a pub where all the punters were miles older than you. You might have liked a lot of them, and seen them as friends, but if it didnt have at least a decent amount of people your own age, its unlikely youd be a regular. At least, thats how I feel, and most people I know tend to hang out with people of roughly their own age, more than people of wildly different ages.

[Queen Victoria]

Okay, from the Grumpiest of the Grumpies:

As far as not being able to post an opinion that Les and odeon do not agree with - This is Intensity.  Aren't we supposed to challenge (or embrace) ideas with passion?  With argument?  With just general bull headedness?  You're able to post and anyone is able to answer. 

As far as drama - I'm not a fan of the treatment Meadow, Penty, Richard, etc. get/got sometimes.  Arguments that I'm not actively involved in scare me, always did, always will.  Yes, I will on the very rare occasion post something that contributes to the argument.  This is something I've always felt, so it's not a Grup vs Only (Grownups vs Onlies, from an old Star Trek episode) thing.

Do I like seeing nudes?  Reading about constipation?  guns?  nudes?  Nope, but I'll either skip the posts, make a joke about them or check on them periodically since so many of the threads go off track and end up somewhere else.  It's my choice to avoid them.

I'll never be young, probably never like the music of the moment or the TV series of the moment, but then, who knows? I've got some good tips from Onlies.  Do we need younger members?  IMHO we need members who can be themselves.  If you can't join at any age and find a spot for yourself, then you might not be Intense.

And BTW, I realize that my QV role playing with CBC is probably wearing on the membership.  We've cut it back considerably recently.

Over and Out.  I've finished making a doddering old fool of myself for now.  And no, I'm not leaving, although, no one has asked.

I was going to reply to Odeons post, but its hard to explain my point to him, so I'll reply to this instead.

It seemed that Odeon and Les were being purposely dumb, but if you've misunderstood me, then I mustnt be explaining myself well at all.

I do not dislike the old people here. Yes, there is at least one I dislike, but that has nothing to do with age. Many of you are among my favorite members. I have never had a problem with your role-playing. I have always enjoyed sharing a board with you, and most of the other older people.
However, much as I like a lot of the older people, I also need some more people of a similar age to myself, whether biological, or emotionally.

And I think you're right. Im just not intense enough for this place anymore.

YIKES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  I didn't mean to imply that you should leave.  I like your generally cheery (DO NOT FIX THIS TO CHEESY) attitude and playfulness.  If we go back to posting nudes, will you stay?