Author Topic: Post what you are thinking right now, part two  (Read 284378 times)

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Offline Queen Victoria

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3495 on: July 03, 2012, 04:38:14 PM »
Thinking I should appoint Peter to the Assassin Cabinet.
You'll find my resignation on your desk tomorrow.  :thumbdn:

but your appointment as the Royal Armourer is visible, his is behind the scenes and will never be acknowledged. 
A good monarch is a treasure. A good politician is an oxymoron.

My brain is both uninhibited and uninhabited.

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Offline Peter

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3496 on: July 03, 2012, 05:29:20 PM »
I could kill people with my newt toxins, some of which are unknown to science and might not show up on any test.

  I'm thinking how very nice Peter is and how very much I like him.  :angel:
I'm thinking how Peter should hope nobody close to him dies of newt toxins now because that post would be used against him in court.

I'll try to keep people from licking my newts.  Maybe I should carry a medical card that says I have an occupational exposure to newt toxins, so that the doctors have a starting point when I'm found lying on the ground and foaming at the mouth.

Here's an example of a poisoning incident from one of the species that I keep:

OK folks, bear with me here as I am really, really sick at the moment.

In between trips to empty my bucket, I'll key you in on what is going on.

My senior thesis is on (as some of you know/guessed/etc) Neurergus kaiseri, specifically the nature of the toxins they generate in their skin.


I have been collecting samples of their dermal secretions using a TAS and carefully learning how to prepare and process said samples. (Measure twice, cut once.) As I am new to this sort of thing, I have screwed up the first few samples.

So earlier, just after dinner, I decided to harvest a few more as I can use the lab all day tomorrow thanks to classes being out for the holiday.

Anyway I wear those poly gloves, like restaurants are supposed to use, when handling these guys. Given my personal experiences in the past with these critters, whatever the secrete is nasty stuff. Just a whiff of it can give one a headache for hours.


So, as I reached in to grab a specimen, I snagged my glove on a rock and tore it. No big deal I thought.


In addition to being a biochemist in training, I work with my hands. A lot.

Needless to say my hands are always covered with cuts, nicks, scrapes, and minor burns. Right where the glove tore is where I cut myself making microscope slides this morning.


DO NOT GET NEURERGUS KAISERI TOXIN IN A WOUND!

Right now I have no use of my right hand. The exposed area is swollen up. I am sweating, vomiting, and...umm..."volcanoing" from the other end (if you get my drift...). Pupils are dilated, heart rate is up. I am dizzy as all get out...and I have the mother of all headaches.


My wife noticed me staggering around and called poison control. In between bouts of vomiting, I laughed out loud.


"He got poisoned by a WHAT!?!?"

Now, imagine a journalist trying to explain to a poison control operator that her wannabe science geek husband is sick as a dog because of a rare species no one normal has ever heard of...

"Johnny, what is the poison?"

"Angelita, BWWWAAAAARRRRRRFFFFF, I...don't...know...yet..."

"Well they need to know."

"So do I. How do you think I got into this BWARRRRRRRRRRFFFFF mess?"


Anyway, you can imagine the conversation. It was hysterical, save for the abdominal cramps I am experiencing.

"They say they do'nt know what to do for you."

"No <double expletive deleted>, Angi. This is why I asked you to not bother calling them. I'll get through this and if I don't make sure my notes get to the right people."

"But I thought you were experimenting to find out what that stuff is."

"I am dear BWARRRRRRRRFFFF but I can't very well get results if it kills me first."

"It can KILL you!?!?!?"

"Sure, why not. I do not know of a single case of kaiseri poisoning other than my own. In other words, it will be an interesting result if it does kill me. Make sure they do an extra good tox screen and then include the results when you turn over my notes."

"You really are an <expletive deleted>. Why couldn't you be into something harmless, like rocks or poop?"


This is when I retreated back to my lair and decided to warn you all. They are brightly colored for a reason folks. It means "Don't mess with me or you will pay, dude."

The odds of you being exposed to the kind of dose I have at the moment is slim, but do not risk it...trust me on this one.

I have to go empty my bucket again...

Quote
I'm still alive.

I admit it was a very, very long night and I wished many, many times I was dead.

I suspect part of the problem is that I am a very fair skinned red-head- common lawn fertilizers make me ill. The swelling has gone down, and my hand works again, but the cut is in ugly shape. The swelling made it worse. I had to resort to saline and methanol irrigation. I then irrigated my self with ethanol, in the form of double distilled, charred oak aged solution.


I did finally stop vomiting, but ended up with tunnel vision until a few hours ago. Still a bit shaky now, but this is probably more from lack of sleep than anything else. The dehydration was pretty severe, but that was nothing a few hours in the tub with a gallon of gatorade couldn't fix.
The stomach cramps were the worst part. Ever had fold-you-in-half type cramps? Me either, until last night. Thankfully, I do not have any teeth left to break from keeping my mouth shut instead of screaming.

The effects came and went in waves. I would be feeling better, things settle down and then WHAM ! right back to hell.

The only other time I have been this sick was due to a rattlesnake bite years ago, and this made snakebite fun...


I use the TAS method of collection. This involves a specially purpose built unit called a Transductal Amphibian Simulator. To make it simple it is basically a low power 5 volt contact taser.

It provides a very small short bandwidth electric shock and is pretty much the standard for amphibian toxin collection. Before anyone starts getting out a hammer and nails for my crucifixion, be advised I test it on my self prior to each use. The specimen gets a jolt which results in the desired defensive effect. The resulting secretions are then swabbed up with a small square of Kimwipe. The advantage to this method is that it does not require the old standard- skinning the specimen alive. After a sample is collected, I carefully observe the specimen for an hour just to make sure everything is alright. I only collect a sample once a month at most.

Once swabbed up, the toxins can be extracted with anhydrous methanol. The resulting samples can also either be stored in methanol and/or lypholized. There is also a method for prepping samples for storage/transport/testing in distilled water with acetic acid as a preservative. This is the part I haven't got right yet.


I too expected a low TTX range similar to the Triturus complex, however initial results are showing some very interesting bioactive peptides in addition. I have to get more extensive testing done and currently I am on a waiting list for two different labs (no respect for undergrads...).

I am also culturing bacteria from the skin. This is merely to determine if there is a symbiotic process going on like in Taricha. The possibility may exist as a small tissue sample from a deceased specimen showed that bacteria do live in the tiny nodules of this species dorsal side. However, I admit it was more about an intensive necropsy at the time given the rarity of freshly dead specimens for study.

Currently, I am on a "stop work safety shut down". Feel free to read that as the wife has threatened to prepare my skin for toxin analysis the old fashioned way. Also, There is tail fanning happening so I will not disturb them until after egg season is over...and we all know that is more important than empty threats from my feisty Hispanic chica.

The aftermath:

Quote
Frankly, the wound in question was nothing major, but is now pretty disgusting. I really don't feel it would be appropriate to post a picture of it. The resulting swelling caused it to tear a bit more, and as expected, the reduced circulation killed some off tissue around the edges. I had to debride it and treat it with neosporin as I do not want a nasty infection. In other words, it is really gross!

I have never worked with any Salamndra or any of the others you list, save for tarichas. With my one taricha I have never handled him or anything in his tank with anything other than tongs and nets. Given my difficulties with various chemical exposures, I am a bit paranoid of the little guy.

Quote
Sounds like a peptide/ alkaloid mix eh? Going to start back up with analyisis here in a few days.

Ever heard of a loss of hot/cold detection in the affected region? I have two fingers that can sense neither.

Quote
Also note the nerve damage to my fingers has thus far proven permanent, however the wound in question has long since healed as left absolutely no trace or scarring. Which I find odd as a wound that size on my hand should have scarred up like crazy.

And another couple of incidents:

Quote
I tell people frequently that bright colors rarely lie. I wash my hands before and after handling any of my amphibians, including the A. tigrinum, and that toxin is fairly mild compared to your subject. Years and years ago I handled some A. laterale and carelessly pulled a few pine needles out of my mouth after falling. Within 30 seconds I had numbness that spread from the 'touch points' and ended up feeling like I just came home from the dentist. Numbness, tingling and awkward drooling lasted about a half-hour, even after rinsing my mouth out thoroughly. I had only handled a couple of individuals for this effect to occur. I was glad I didn't swallow anything, since I could have had some respiratory problems from it. It's easy sometimes to forget the beautiful colors that appeal to us are there for a reason, not just for our fancy.

Quote
I TTXed myself one time with a Taricha. I was giving her injections for an abscess, and had some random cuts around my fingernails (like I always do). Didn't think nothing of it until I couldn't move my arm. It was much like the reaction I get to a tetanus shot; arm wouldn't move, but still had feeling. I had the worst case of 'arm went to sleep but now it's waking up' pins and needles in my entire life. I felt like I wanted to cut my arm off. It didn't cause vomiting, but I felt pretty bad overall.
Quote
14:10 - Moarskrillex42: She said something about knowing why I wanted to move to Glasgow when she came in. She plopped down on my bed and told me to go ahead and open it for her.

14:11 - Peter5930: So, she thought I was your lover and that I was sending you a box full of sex toys, and that you wanted to move to Glasgow to be with me?

Offline Bastet

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3497 on: July 03, 2012, 05:31:25 PM »
Link
:kitten: OBSESSIVE AILUROPHILE :kitten:


It is far better for people to hate you for doing the right thing than for people to love you for doing the wrong thing. Never ever forget that.

Offline Peter

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Quote
14:10 - Moarskrillex42: She said something about knowing why I wanted to move to Glasgow when she came in. She plopped down on my bed and told me to go ahead and open it for her.

14:11 - Peter5930: So, she thought I was your lover and that I was sending you a box full of sex toys, and that you wanted to move to Glasgow to be with me?

Offline Bastet

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3499 on: July 03, 2012, 06:53:33 PM »
Link is my kitten. He's a good boy.
:kitten: OBSESSIVE AILUROPHILE :kitten:


It is far better for people to hate you for doing the right thing than for people to love you for doing the wrong thing. Never ever forget that.

Offline MissKitty

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3500 on: July 03, 2012, 07:29:46 PM »
I don't feel like training the new people tomorrow.
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Offline odeon

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3501 on: July 03, 2012, 11:25:58 PM »
Wondering why Bodie's having problems with Project Honeypot.

Your project pisspot just doesn't like me! and can kiss my
fat ass :-*

 :-[

I'll be damned if I understand why, though. I've not given up but I've been busy working.
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Offline odeon

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3502 on: July 03, 2012, 11:27:34 PM »
I don't feel like training the new people tomorrow.

Tell them that most grown-ups are housebroken already. :zoinks:
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."

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Offline Callaway

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3503 on: July 03, 2012, 11:45:50 PM »
I could kill people with my newt toxins, some of which are unknown to science and might not show up on any test.

  I'm thinking how very nice Peter is and how very much I like him.  :angel:
I'm thinking how Peter should hope nobody close to him dies of newt toxins now because that post would be used against him in court.

I'll try to keep people from licking my newts.  Maybe I should carry a medical card that says I have an occupational exposure to newt toxins, so that the doctors have a starting point when I'm found lying on the ground and foaming at the mouth.

Here's an example of a poisoning incident from one of the species that I keep:

OK folks, bear with me here as I am really, really sick at the moment.

In between trips to empty my bucket, I'll key you in on what is going on.

My senior thesis is on (as some of you know/guessed/etc) Neurergus kaiseri, specifically the nature of the toxins they generate in their skin.


I have been collecting samples of their dermal secretions using a TAS and carefully learning how to prepare and process said samples. (Measure twice, cut once.) As I am new to this sort of thing, I have screwed up the first few samples.

So earlier, just after dinner, I decided to harvest a few more as I can use the lab all day tomorrow thanks to classes being out for the holiday.

Anyway I wear those poly gloves, like restaurants are supposed to use, when handling these guys. Given my personal experiences in the past with these critters, whatever the secrete is nasty stuff. Just a whiff of it can give one a headache for hours.


So, as I reached in to grab a specimen, I snagged my glove on a rock and tore it. No big deal I thought.


In addition to being a biochemist in training, I work with my hands. A lot.

Needless to say my hands are always covered with cuts, nicks, scrapes, and minor burns. Right where the glove tore is where I cut myself making microscope slides this morning.


DO NOT GET NEURERGUS KAISERI TOXIN IN A WOUND!

Right now I have no use of my right hand. The exposed area is swollen up. I am sweating, vomiting, and...umm..."volcanoing" from the other end (if you get my drift...). Pupils are dilated, heart rate is up. I am dizzy as all get out...and I have the mother of all headaches.


My wife noticed me staggering around and called poison control. In between bouts of vomiting, I laughed out loud.


"He got poisoned by a WHAT!?!?"

Now, imagine a journalist trying to explain to a poison control operator that her wannabe science geek husband is sick as a dog because of a rare species no one normal has ever heard of...

"Johnny, what is the poison?"

"Angelita, BWWWAAAAARRRRRRFFFFF, I...don't...know...yet..."

"Well they need to know."

"So do I. How do you think I got into this BWARRRRRRRRRRFFFFF mess?"


Anyway, you can imagine the conversation. It was hysterical, save for the abdominal cramps I am experiencing.

"They say they do'nt know what to do for you."

"No <double expletive deleted>, Angi. This is why I asked you to not bother calling them. I'll get through this and if I don't make sure my notes get to the right people."

"But I thought you were experimenting to find out what that stuff is."

"I am dear BWARRRRRRRRFFFF but I can't very well get results if it kills me first."

"It can KILL you!?!?!?"

"Sure, why not. I do not know of a single case of kaiseri poisoning other than my own. In other words, it will be an interesting result if it does kill me. Make sure they do an extra good tox screen and then include the results when you turn over my notes."

"You really are an <expletive deleted>. Why couldn't you be into something harmless, like rocks or poop?"


This is when I retreated back to my lair and decided to warn you all. They are brightly colored for a reason folks. It means "Don't mess with me or you will pay, dude."

The odds of you being exposed to the kind of dose I have at the moment is slim, but do not risk it...trust me on this one.

I have to go empty my bucket again...

Quote
I'm still alive.

I admit it was a very, very long night and I wished many, many times I was dead.

I suspect part of the problem is that I am a very fair skinned red-head- common lawn fertilizers make me ill. The swelling has gone down, and my hand works again, but the cut is in ugly shape. The swelling made it worse. I had to resort to saline and methanol irrigation. I then irrigated my self with ethanol, in the form of double distilled, charred oak aged solution.


I did finally stop vomiting, but ended up with tunnel vision until a few hours ago. Still a bit shaky now, but this is probably more from lack of sleep than anything else. The dehydration was pretty severe, but that was nothing a few hours in the tub with a gallon of gatorade couldn't fix.
The stomach cramps were the worst part. Ever had fold-you-in-half type cramps? Me either, until last night. Thankfully, I do not have any teeth left to break from keeping my mouth shut instead of screaming.

The effects came and went in waves. I would be feeling better, things settle down and then WHAM ! right back to hell.

The only other time I have been this sick was due to a rattlesnake bite years ago, and this made snakebite fun...


I use the TAS method of collection. This involves a specially purpose built unit called a Transductal Amphibian Simulator. To make it simple it is basically a low power 5 volt contact taser.

It provides a very small short bandwidth electric shock and is pretty much the standard for amphibian toxin collection. Before anyone starts getting out a hammer and nails for my crucifixion, be advised I test it on my self prior to each use. The specimen gets a jolt which results in the desired defensive effect. The resulting secretions are then swabbed up with a small square of Kimwipe. The advantage to this method is that it does not require the old standard- skinning the specimen alive. After a sample is collected, I carefully observe the specimen for an hour just to make sure everything is alright. I only collect a sample once a month at most.

Once swabbed up, the toxins can be extracted with anhydrous methanol. The resulting samples can also either be stored in methanol and/or lypholized. There is also a method for prepping samples for storage/transport/testing in distilled water with acetic acid as a preservative. This is the part I haven't got right yet.


I too expected a low TTX range similar to the Triturus complex, however initial results are showing some very interesting bioactive peptides in addition. I have to get more extensive testing done and currently I am on a waiting list for two different labs (no respect for undergrads...).

I am also culturing bacteria from the skin. This is merely to determine if there is a symbiotic process going on like in Taricha. The possibility may exist as a small tissue sample from a deceased specimen showed that bacteria do live in the tiny nodules of this species dorsal side. However, I admit it was more about an intensive necropsy at the time given the rarity of freshly dead specimens for study.

Currently, I am on a "stop work safety shut down". Feel free to read that as the wife has threatened to prepare my skin for toxin analysis the old fashioned way. Also, There is tail fanning happening so I will not disturb them until after egg season is over...and we all know that is more important than empty threats from my feisty Hispanic chica.

The aftermath:

Quote
Frankly, the wound in question was nothing major, but is now pretty disgusting. I really don't feel it would be appropriate to post a picture of it. The resulting swelling caused it to tear a bit more, and as expected, the reduced circulation killed some off tissue around the edges. I had to debride it and treat it with neosporin as I do not want a nasty infection. In other words, it is really gross!

I have never worked with any Salamndra or any of the others you list, save for tarichas. With my one taricha I have never handled him or anything in his tank with anything other than tongs and nets. Given my difficulties with various chemical exposures, I am a bit paranoid of the little guy.

Quote
Sounds like a peptide/ alkaloid mix eh? Going to start back up with analyisis here in a few days.

Ever heard of a loss of hot/cold detection in the affected region? I have two fingers that can sense neither.

Quote
Also note the nerve damage to my fingers has thus far proven permanent, however the wound in question has long since healed as left absolutely no trace or scarring. Which I find odd as a wound that size on my hand should have scarred up like crazy.

And another couple of incidents:

Quote
I tell people frequently that bright colors rarely lie. I wash my hands before and after handling any of my amphibians, including the A. tigrinum, and that toxin is fairly mild compared to your subject. Years and years ago I handled some A. laterale and carelessly pulled a few pine needles out of my mouth after falling. Within 30 seconds I had numbness that spread from the 'touch points' and ended up feeling like I just came home from the dentist. Numbness, tingling and awkward drooling lasted about a half-hour, even after rinsing my mouth out thoroughly. I had only handled a couple of individuals for this effect to occur. I was glad I didn't swallow anything, since I could have had some respiratory problems from it. It's easy sometimes to forget the beautiful colors that appeal to us are there for a reason, not just for our fancy.

Quote
I TTXed myself one time with a Taricha. I was giving her injections for an abscess, and had some random cuts around my fingernails (like I always do). Didn't think nothing of it until I couldn't move my arm. It was much like the reaction I get to a tetanus shot; arm wouldn't move, but still had feeling. I had the worst case of 'arm went to sleep but now it's waking up' pins and needles in my entire life. I felt like I wanted to cut my arm off. It didn't cause vomiting, but I felt pretty bad overall.

I read most of those when I followed your link before and found them interesting.  I wondered if you have ever had any ill effects yourself?

Offline Bastet

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3504 on: July 03, 2012, 11:53:30 PM »
prison rape
:kitten: OBSESSIVE AILUROPHILE :kitten:


It is far better for people to hate you for doing the right thing than for people to love you for doing the wrong thing. Never ever forget that.

Offline Peter

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3505 on: July 04, 2012, 12:00:02 AM »
I read most of those when I followed your link before and found them interesting.  I wondered if you have ever had any ill effects yourself?

Nope, not had any problems with toxins.  Maybe it's because my animals like me; they only secrete toxins when they feel threatened.  I also don't handle them much.  I have a couple of Taricha granulosa, which are the most poisonous species of newt as far as anyone knows, but I seem to have avoided tetrodotoxin poisoning from them so far.
Quote
14:10 - Moarskrillex42: She said something about knowing why I wanted to move to Glasgow when she came in. She plopped down on my bed and told me to go ahead and open it for her.

14:11 - Peter5930: So, she thought I was your lover and that I was sending you a box full of sex toys, and that you wanted to move to Glasgow to be with me?

Offline lutra

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3506 on: July 04, 2012, 03:47:16 AM »
How much I'm satisfied with my Toshiba laptop. Quite decent piece of machinery, I'd say.
Solum certum nihil esse certi et homine nihil miserius aut superbius.

Offline MissKitty

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3507 on: July 04, 2012, 06:55:48 AM »
I don't feel like training the new people tomorrow.

Tell them that most grown-ups are housebroken already. :zoinks:

If any of them pee on the floor, they're getting the boot. :laugh:
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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3508 on: July 04, 2012, 11:04:15 AM »
Thinking I should appoint Peter to the Assassin Cabinet.
You'll find my resignation on your desk tomorrow.  :thumbdn:

but your appointment as the Royal Armourer is visible, his is behind the scenes and will never be acknowledged.
The Armory is MINE!  :pee:

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Re: Post what you are thinking right now, part two
« Reply #3509 on: July 04, 2012, 11:05:38 AM »
The kitten I had pulled from my store has Feline Infectious Peritonitis. It's going to kill him so I think he'll be put down in the next few days. Just 9 weeks old.  :(
:hug: That sucks.