Genderless Children

[Adam]

we do not need to advertise everyone's sexual organs throughout their lives. it will still happen.

I'm not sure what you mean by advertising sexual organs.  What I thougt you were referencing was callings girls "she" and boys "he" and dressing them like girls or boys.

What I mean by advertising someone's sexual organs (ok, an extreme and sensationalist way of putting it, I apologise ) is the fact that it's somehow "everyone's knowledge" what sex some other person is. It should be no one else's business. I don't personally even think it should be on a birth certificate, but definitely not on job application forms (with certain exceptions obviously) or credit cards (with the Mr/Mrs/Ms titles)

Whether a kid dresses as a girl or a boy should be up to them imo. Until they're a couple years old ans starying to identify with things themselves, I'm not sure which way you go... I guess fairly gender-neutral clothes, although those are generally very boyish.

As for pronouns, that is difficult, and I probably am aware of that more than most people lol
I dunno how these parents would refer to their child... I can't imagine they'd appreciate "it."
Like I said, this is in an IDEAL world. imo, an ideal world would have commonly-used gender neutral pronouns. In english.

[midlifeaspie]

I understand what you are saying now.  Certainly a valid opinion 

[Adam]

I also admit this is clearly influenced a lot by my own situation, as I am sick of people meeting me, assuming I am a regular guy, and then being told by other people that I am a girl

It actually changes how people are with you and how people see you, a lot more than most people realise

I don't believe it should be anyone's business whether I have a penis or vagina. it's no secret, but I do resent the way people view it as something they're entitled to know. Unless you're my doctor or my girlfriend, mind your own.

[Adam]

I understand what you are saying now.  Certainly a valid opinion  

Thanks.

I just wanna repeat, I wouldn't raise my kid this way if I had one. And I''m not in any way saying any parents here are raising their kids wrongly by dressing them as a boy/girl etc

I also recognise that almost everyone who is born male grows up to be a man, or a woman if born female. I just think that would remain the same whether they were raised that way or not. With the exception of a minority who are in denial, like GA. And I think that could only be a good thing for them and for society

[bodie]

I was determined that the urchin would have a mix of toys for girls and boys.

He owns several dolls.  When he wouldn't talk i paid a lot of money for one
talking interactive doll.

He has a toy kitchen with cooker, toaster, etc

The portable dvd player he has was ten quid cheaper in pink -
 - so he has a pink one!

But, you know what?  the minute he sees thomas, or trucks, cars, fire
engines all the other toys are put down!

He is only four and has picked up the following phrase at nursery
"boys have winkeys and girls don't"  "Girls have boobies and boy's don't"

in fact he is constantly referring to his winkey at the moment and i don't
know how to address it?

I don't think the family in the article are doing the right thing really.  That kind
of innocence can't last long.

[Icequeen]

I think maybe they have good intentions, but as this child gets older and enters preschool, this is going to be hard to do. Society still expects a label, and that's probably not going to change anytime soon.  

I screamed every time my mom put me in a dress and was a habitual "stripper" when I figured out how to take stuff off, I hate the color pink, and I loved cars & trucks before I could even talk.  But I've never felt anything other than female.

I remember going to a sale and wanting to choke the living crap out of this mother when she smacked her 3-4 yr old son for wanting a doll, then give him the "daddy says, girls play with dolls, boys don't" lecture.  

My son had dolls, stuffed animals, cars, etc.    

I had cars, trucks, toy guns, and dolls when I was little, and a dirt bike when I got older.  

I never believed in limiting someone to certain things because of their gender, I feel when you limit (especially a child) like that you limit them from developing as an individual, period.  

    

[midlifeaspie]

We are buying my son a doll next weekend to get him used to the proper way to act around a baby.

[Queen Victoria]

I would have been happy for the Princess Royal to have played with any toys when she was an infant toddler.  Her entertainment was Little Mermaid, ad nauseum.

She had a masculine look about her, particularly when she lost her newborn hair and the baby hair was growing in.  When people asked, "What's his name?"  I merely replied, "Levi" and let it go.

['andersom']

I would have been happy for the Princess Royal to have played with any toys when she was an infant toddler.  Her entertainment was Little Mermaid, ad nauseum.

She had a masculine look about her, particularly when she lost her newborn hair and the baby hair was growing in.  When people asked, "What's his name?"  I merely replied, "Levi" and let it go.

My Mum did not cut the hair of my youngest brother till he was three. It had taken so long for him to get hair that she just couldn't get herself to cutting it. But, when some men working on the house commented on her cute little daughter the fate of the hair of my brother was sealed....

He now is the first in the family to go bald. 

[Adam]

I was a "tomboy" when I was a kid. I was into both girly and boyish things though. I had dolls, but I also had Action Man (my favourite toy was an Action Man red car that fired missiles lol) and was obsessed with football. I have always been fairly in-between when it comes to interests and personality. I do feminine thinngs and masculine thigns.

When I was in secondary school was when gender stereotypes really started to bother me though and I tried to force myself to be a "girl"

maybe because girls and boys are more separated in secondary school? different uniforms and different classes for PE (usually)

I just think kids should be treated as individuals, ergardelss of whether they're male or female. The males will still mostly grow into men, and the females will still mostly grow into women, just without feeling like they have to, and without the embarrassment of not fitting in with the "other boys" or "other girls"

['andersom']

I was a "tomboy" when I was a kid. I was into both girly and boyish things though. I had dolls, but I also had Action Man (my favourite toy was an Action Man red car that fired missiles lol) and was obsessed with football. I have always been fairly in-between when it comes to interests and personality. I do feminine thinngs and masculine thigns.

When I was in secondary school was when gender stereotypes really started to bother me though and I tried to force myself to be a "girl"

maybe because girls and boys are more separated in secondary school? different uniforms and different classes for PE (usually)

I just think kids should be treated as individuals, ergardelss of whether they're male or female. The males will still mostly grow into men, and the females will still mostly grow into women, just without feeling like they have to, and without the embarrassment of not fitting in with the "other boys" or "other girls"

I agree with that. I'm glad that the kids at the school of my oldest have got the same PE clothes for boys and girls. And no uniform for other classes. I did not really mind the separate classes for PE when I was a teenager. No awkward questions of boys when having periods and stuff. But, when it was possible, I did prefer mixed classes for PE. They were a bit more fun. (Apart from 90% of the girls being afraid of mice, that was a nice thing to play with.  )

[Osensitive1]

Doesn't strike as harmful so going with meh.

[Adam]

I was a "tomboy" when I was a kid. I was into both girly and boyish things though. I had dolls, but I also had Action Man (my favourite toy was an Action Man red car that fired missiles lol) and was obsessed with football. I have always been fairly in-between when it comes to interests and personality. I do feminine thinngs and masculine thigns.

When I was in secondary school was when gender stereotypes really started to bother me though and I tried to force myself to be a "girl"

maybe because girls and boys are more separated in secondary school? different uniforms and different classes for PE (usually)

I just think kids should be treated as individuals, ergardelss of whether they're male or female. The males will still mostly grow into men, and the females will still mostly grow into women, just without feeling like they have to, and without the embarrassment of not fitting in with the "other boys" or "other girls"

I agree with that. I'm glad that the kids at the school of my oldest have got the same PE clothes for boys and girls. And no uniform for other classes. I did not really mind the separate classes for PE when I was a teenager. No awkward questions of boys when having periods and stuff. But, when it was possible, I did prefer mixed classes for PE. They were a bit more fun. (Apart from 90% of the girls being afraid of mice, that was a nice thing to play with.  )

Yeah I understand the PE stuff really, although apart from changing rooms and showers I don't think it's is 100% necessary

But apart from physical stuff, I don't think boys and girls should be separated at all

Some poeple think they work better when separated, but I think the negative effects (while maybe not as obvious in the classroom) far outweigh any short term positives. There must be better ways of helping kids learn better

['andersom']

I was a "tomboy" when I was a kid. I was into both girly and boyish things though. I had dolls, but I also had Action Man (my favourite toy was an Action Man red car that fired missiles lol) and was obsessed with football. I have always been fairly in-between when it comes to interests and personality. I do feminine thinngs and masculine thigns.

When I was in secondary school was when gender stereotypes really started to bother me though and I tried to force myself to be a "girl"

maybe because girls and boys are more separated in secondary school? different uniforms and different classes for PE (usually)

I just think kids should be treated as individuals, ergardelss of whether they're male or female. The males will still mostly grow into men, and the females will still mostly grow into women, just without feeling like they have to, and without the embarrassment of not fitting in with the "other boys" or "other girls"

I agree with that. I'm glad that the kids at the school of my oldest have got the same PE clothes for boys and girls. And no uniform for other classes. I did not really mind the separate classes for PE when I was a teenager. No awkward questions of boys when having periods and stuff. But, when it was possible, I did prefer mixed classes for PE. They were a bit more fun. (Apart from 90% of the girls being afraid of mice, that was a nice thing to play with.  )

Yeah I understand the PE stuff really, although apart from changing rooms and showers I don't think it's is 100% necessary

But apart from physical stuff, I don't think boys and girls should be separated at all

Some poeple think they work better when separated, but I think the negative effects (while maybe not as obvious in the classroom) far outweigh any short term positives. There must be better ways of helping kids learn better

I knew a man, as a kid he went to a boys school, then to seminary. The only women he had ever seen were either family or old nuns. Then he had to work in a parish, and the first thing that happened was him getting totally confused, and head over heels in love. Poor man. He did get out of priesthood.

Separated classes are not preparing kids for life IMO.

[Adam]

I agree. My mum is strongly against my brotheers goign to a same sex school

It kinda sucks here as the three schools in my area are:

One mixed grammar (which is where I went, so she doesn't want him going there and having a similar experience)
One boys only
One girls only

So it looks like he is gonna have to travel out of the area. I hope he doesn't end up going to my old school anyway. And the boys school has quite a bad reputation, altho improving