I hope Les has another heart attack soon

[GalileoAce]

He also claims I haven't presented any evidence... :lol:

It's all about implanting false memories by evil psychologists. That's why you have to make sure there is no gaps in either you tin foil hat or your tin foil underpants.

Also you may want to wear tin foil sneaker, you might stand on some gay thought patterns while you are at it.

Some guys did a scientific study on tin foils hats and showed they did fuck all in blocking out anything, but actually increased the reception to a specific band of radio waves.  

That's what they want you to think.

:lol:

[Alex179]

  I don't care what they identify themselves as, if I see a woman, I call the person a she, and if I see a man, I call the person he. 

Yeah because everybody walks round with their penis/vagina on show 24-7

Gender identity and gender roles/stereotypes are two different things. I think I am probably one of the most androgynous people I know when it comes to personality. I definitely don't fit into either gender role very well anyway.

As for why go int a men's toilet if you don't need to pee in a urinal, try and think about what could happen if a man (yes, someone perceived to be a man, regardless of what's in his pants) continually went into a women's bathroom. Good idea? No, didn't think so. Trans guys don't use men's toilets because they think it's some great thing to be able to piss in them, they use them because they want to be inconspicuous like anyone else. They want to pee without making a big song and dance about it.

They shouldn't assume you are a man just because you don't dress like a woman.    You look very feminine in the face to me Soph, so I doubt that I would mistake you for a man.    It is pretty easy to tell when someone is a M2F tran usually too.   I don't care so much in the restroom as long you aren't taking forever while pissing in the stall (which has seats I wouldn't want to sit on anyways).    I have seen a cross dressing dude pissing in a urinal before in downtown Orlando, it looked pretty funny.

You can choose to dress however you want.    For me it like using the Handicapped stall when you don't need to, as far as pissing in the urinal and not using the stalls all the time.    You would be the only guy that uses the stall all the time, which is a pain in the ass if you are a guy going into the restroom and you absolutely have to take a crap and there is some other dude in there taking a piss.    I mean, he could have just as easily used one of the several urinals available which are not being used by anyone else, but instead he has to take up the only stall.   That is how I view the men's restroom part of the entire thing, because that is the only place where this would really come to be a problem (and a locker room of course could be).

Really the only place I could see that being a problem is in public restrooms.   Locker rooms are private and people should at least be wise enough where to go and not to go at the gym.

[GalileoAce]

It is pretty easy to tell when someone is a M2F tran usually too.

I could make you eat those words. I mean not me personally...But others. But I is tired so I might see about doing something about this issue tomorrow. If I can be bothered.

[Christopher McCandless]

*smiles and nods at Hadron* Unless you're willing to present actual evidence to back up your claims I think we're done.

I don't need to, your the one claiming something exists without any evidence whatsoever.

You're*

I've presented plenty of evidence. Evidence that has citations, and further reading with verifiable research backing it up. You've presented... Well just your word.

And I'm not the only one claiming. You are also.

Present me a peer-reviewed legitimate scientific research article and then we might have something to discuss. Oh I forget, they don't exist, I wonder why

[Alex179]

I identify people by sex, and not gender.   I mean, why go into the men's bathroom if you can't pee in the urinal (while standing)?

What do you do when you go to the toilet?
"Hey! Everyone! I'm peeing in the urinal! It's awesome! YEAH!"

Most people go to the toilets to..well go to the toilet.  I use mens toilets (considering I'd probably be arrested for using a womens given my appearence), and I haven't used a urinal since I was a child. And if the toilet is clean (which they rarely are) I'd even sit. :: shrugs ::

I don't care what they identify themselves as, if I see a woman, I call the person a she, and if I see a man, I call the person he.   Gender is all about gender roles, which is all societal conditioning.   Biological gender = sex.   Gender is garbage anyways, the entire concept that is.

So someone born a man who passes well as a woman is a woman to you? Fair enough, I can accept that...to a degree.

I usually do not talk when I am taking a piss in the urinal, it makes me uncomfortable haha.    I don't take a shit in public restroom unless it is an absolute emergency.   That is the only way you would see me in a stall.    That makes it even lamer that there is a dude taking forever while taking a piss in the stall (usually only one or two in a restroom), when he could just as easily be pissing in one of of several available urinals.    When someone is bothering to take a shit in a public restroom they usually have to REALLY take a shit.   Making them wait while you use a stall is kinda rude imo.   They could have a diarrhea disaster right there.

I don't sit on a toilet without putting a good deal of toilet paper or the sanitary toilet paper on the seat.   Ugh, sitting on toilets that I don't clean myself disgusts me.   I don't trust janitors in public places to keep the restrooms clean.   I am a major clean freak about my restroom though.   I probably overuse bleach if anything.

[Phlexor]

I piss using the stalls because I need my privacy. Plus who takes that long to take a piss?

[Alex179]

It is pretty easy to tell when someone is a M2F tran usually too.

I could make you eat those words. I mean not me personally...But others. But I is tired so I might see about doing something about this issue tomorrow. If I can be bothered.

I mean in person, photographs make it much easier to deceive people.    Jeez, we all have seen what lighting, camera angles, etc can do.    You can tell by how much makeup they wear in addition to their muscularity.   I have seen real women that look more like men than a M2F though, because they were basically female bodybuilders.

[Alex179]

I piss using the stalls because I need my privacy. Plus who takes that long to take a piss?

Most people don't take long at all, but I have seen exceptions unfortunately.   I like a divider between urinals, the huge trough thing is just gross to me haha.   I was just saying that is one of the few places where you might run into problems with a tran person.

[Phlexor]

I piss using the stalls because I need my privacy. Plus who takes that long to take a piss?

Most people don't take long at all, but I have seen exceptions unfortunately.   I like a divider between urinals, the huge trough thing is just gross to me haha.   I was just saying that is one of the few places where you might run into problems with a tran person.

The huge trough is so wrong, too much splash back, too noisey, less than zero privacy. 

[Adam]

I wasn't talking about me personally alex, although it's interesting that you keep bringing it back to me. What is your problem with me being a guy? Are you insecure about your masculinity or something? I don't use public toilets full stop, so that particular issue is irrelevant to me

Anyway, yes I have a very feminine face. Half the time IRL I am referred to as "son" "he" etc though. Do you really look at other guys in bathrooms that much anyway? Look them in the eye and have a think about what they have in their pants? If I were you I would just go in, do my thing and get out. Why concern yourself with the other guys in there?

I wouldn't be so quick to assume you can spot a transgendered person so easily btw.

[Blasted]

Funny how this thread has evolved  

Also, Alex you've been an awfully twatty lately    I bet if I showed you some pics of both ftms and mtfs you wouldn't be able to tell for 3/4 of them.

[Callaway]

It is pretty easy to tell when someone is a M2F tran usually too.

I could make you eat those words. I mean not me personally...But others. But I is tired so I might see about doing something about this issue tomorrow. If I can be bothered.

I think I'm pretty good at telling the difference between M2F trans and women who were born female, assuming I can see the person's Adam's Apple.

[Alex179]

You two are really being defensive.   I am just saying that is the only possible place where a problem would arise.   All it has to do is with me having to take a shit and someone taking up the only stall in the restroom.   I don't see any other possible places for me to have any issues with a tran person.   It would either be the restroom or the locker room, which both should be a given.

Where was I referring to Soph specifically other than saying I wouldn't view Soph as a man in person?   I just think you look feminine, always have.    Why is that an insult to you?   Do you really want to look manly or something?   You look like a young woman that dresses like a guy to me.   I can't blame you at all for that.   Dressing like a woman would be a shitload of work and it isn't worth it.   If I was a chick, I would dress like a dude too.   Way more comfortable and less bullshit to put up with haha.

You were saying that chicks would freak out if they saw you in the women's room.   I wouldn't even react if I saw you going in to take a piss in the men's room.   I do my thing and leave.   The only times I notice anything is when I have to wait on someone (like when I absolutely have to use a stall and it is being occupied by someone).    I don't notice people in the restroom unless I have to wait in line and they are taking too long.   Then I start to wonder "WTF is taking this person so long?".   That is about the extent of my bathroom interactions, they rely on me being impatient... just like how I am at a store or anywhere else where there is a possibility of waiting in line.  

I have not been twatty at all, but you sure have been a bit defensive and reactive.  I don't look people in the eye outside of the restroom, why would I do it when I am trying to go take a piss?   It seems like you are just trying to pick a fight Soph, that is all.

[Alex179]

It is pretty easy to tell when someone is a M2F tran usually too.

I could make you eat those words. I mean not me personally...But others. But I is tired so I might see about doing something about this issue tomorrow. If I can be bothered.

I think I'm pretty good at telling the difference between M2F trans and women who were born female, assuming I can see the person's Adam's Apple.

When I worked at AOL there were 4 different M2F trans working there and all of them were obvious to me.    The Adam's Apple is indeed one of the dead giveaways.   M2F trannys have to do a shitload of work just to look somewhat like a woman.   

F2M trannies on the other hand get to be slackers like us men normally do.   That I can understand.   Fuck wearing makeup and shit haha.   Also if you are a woman that can grow a moustache that is a bonus, as you don't even have to worry about shaving your face, nevermind shaving your arms or legs.   Low maintenance ftw!

[Blasted]

You're an arse