WADR, Odeon, you don't live in the US and so you don't totally know how things are here. Since Bush took office, we've gone from being a reasonably strong country with a reasonably strong economy to a country scared of its own shadow and an economy shot through with holes. And I don't see any indication that Obama will change things for the better, at least not soon. He's not willing to end the War on Drugs, or even legalize marijuana (which would help the economy immeasurably if sold legally and taxed); he hasn't said if he'll revoke the sunset provisions of the Patriot Act, and he seems to think government is the solution to the economy. A New New Deal will only prolong the current depression by taking more $ out of the hands of taxpayers and businessmen, which means the former will be unable to purchase more goods and services and the latter will have to cut jobs and put less money into R & D.
So, until I see more signs that Amerika is regaining its spirit, I'm going to march in the street and keep my powder dry. If that makes me mad, then throw me into the mental health system and fill me full of Thorazine. Won't change a damn thing.
I'm not saying you are mad. I'm saying Lit is. I didn't mean to offend you in any way, Wandrew, and apologise if I did.
Lit, however, is mad, and about the last person here I would trust with a weapon of any kind.
I didn't think you were calling me mad, Odeon. But it seems like every time Lit raises a point you either say "He's nuts" or "There's other ways" and then you don't explain yourself. Obviously I don't agree with Lit a lot of the time: his theories about Muslims are garbage and his admiration of Nazi Germany and its leaders is asinine. But I believe he IS right about the US turning into a police state, because I've seen and read about it with my own eyes.
I don't much like the idea of a violent revolution either, but I have never seen voting make significant changes. Lots of people opposed Iraq War II; that didn't stop it. Lots of people think pot should be legal; it isn't. Lots of Americans (and at least one brave Brit who died last week) thought Bush/Cheney should have been impeached and/or hauled before the World Court for crimes against humanity; the cowardly Democrat-led Congress took impeachment off the table, first thing. I've gotten tired of fighting for rights I should have had long ago. I've got a lot on my plate and don't have the time I used to have. So if it takes violence to convince these twits that we mean business, then so be it.
I don't disagree with you and Lit--the US is more of a police state these days than it used to be. I suppose the Patriot Act is to blame for part of it but there is more.
See, I don't think that Lit is wrong about everything. Of course he isn't. But he doesn't stop there. His solution is always to shoot the police and anyone with any kind of power, and that's just mad.
Problem is, we're running out of alternatives. Cops in the US are running amok. There are literally hundreds of reports of them shooting dogs and most of the time the dogs in question were either running away or saying "ooh a new friend!" And even if the dogs were attacking, there are better ways to handle an attacking dog than to shoot it dead: mace, trank guns, etc. And there's hundreds of reports of innocent civilians being killed, and each time the public complains and the cops in question go back on duty after being briefly suspended with pay. Which just goes to show that, in this country, if you're a cop and you shoot a dog or a person, by and large you get off. If you're a civilian and you do the same, by and large you go to jail.
I agree that the Patriot Act is not the whole problem; a number of bills that preceded it--just as the Anti-Terrorism Act signed by Clinton--helped lay the groundwork for it. And like the Patriot Act, it was rushed through Congress before anyone had a chance to really read it. This whole thing really started with the War on Drugs, which opened the door for no-knock warrants, wiretaps, etc. As William S Burroughs said, "Drug laws are a pretext to extend police powers." So when Bush came along with the PA and the War on Some Terrorists, he had a nice solid foundation to build on--thanks in part, BTW, to "democratic" leaders like Johnson and Clinton, as well as Reagan and George I.
I REALLY hate to say this, but maybe if public officials had to fear physical injury as well as verbal wrath, they MIGHT act in a less fascist manner. It's easy to ignore letters, phone calls and e-mails; not so easy to ignore machine guns.