INTENSITY²
Start here => What's your crime? Basic Discussion => Topic started by: Adam on November 28, 2009, 04:59:00 AM
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andd dies
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I hope not.
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I hope not.
Same.
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Soph, you and bint marry the fucking cunt already. :eyelash:
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Hey not outside the realms of possibility. Though more likely I will get early bowel cancer. Runs in the family. (You like that pun...or lost on you :-\) That is what recently nailed my Mother. Then of course is the skin cancer. One recently out of my neck and there is an unslighly lump on my shoulder blade that looks suspiciously like another melanoma. Will check it out eventually.
Better off putting good money on them rather than the heart attack thing.
See how helpful I am?
Now shut up Soph and take another photo of your stupid dog before it gets too old to look energetic ;)
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wow les that's really adult of you. :thumbup:
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Doing massive meltdowns over your mother pressing light switches isn't exactly "adult", Milla. :hahaha:
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wow les that's really adult of you. :thumbup:
Thanks Milla.
I thought it best to provide her with better ammunition. Between showering, photographing the dog and spamming the forum, she can pray for something MORE likely to kill me in the short term. I am a Sweetheart
Do appreciate the endorsement though :plus:
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andd dies
Hey not outside the realms of possibility. Though more likely I will get early bowel cancer. Runs in the family. (You like that pun...or lost on you :-\) That is what recently nailed my Mother. Then of course is the skin cancer. One recently out of my neck and there is an unslighly lump on my shoulder blade that looks suspiciously like another melanoma. Will check it out eventually.
Better off putting good money on them rather than the heart attack thing.
See how helpful I am?
Now shut up Soph and take another photo of your stupid dog before it gets too old to look energetic ;)
wow les that's really adult of you. :thumbup:
Good point Milla. This thread started off on such a positive note before Sir_Les took the low road by insulting Sophs dog. ::) You appear to be missing the point that this whole thread pissing contest has had lowball atacks by both sides. :duh: What the hell was I thinking? You're not really a disinterested observer are you? Reinforcements to Gallipoli. :thumbup:
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Good point Milla. This thread started off on such a positive note before Sir_Les took the low road by insulting Sophs dog. ::) You appear to be missing the point that this whole thread has had lowball atacks by both sides. :duh: What the hell was I thinking? You're not really a disinterested observer are you? Reinforcements to Gallipoli. :thumbup:
He started making low personal attacks on ZOMG first.
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:blah: Poor Bint. Poor victimised, "never in the wrong" Bint.
Need a hug?
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Oh I can admit I'm wrong. I did many a time in this argument.
Don't project here my little ugly thicko ;)
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And hoping les has another heart attack and dies soon is as cool as talking about Lily dying. :thumbdn:
this is giving me a fucking headache. It's like drama puked all over the board.
:facepalm2:
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At least I'm attacking HIM, and not making disgusting little posts about a dog.
I would never have said anything like if he hadn't been asking for it all along. tbh I don't give a shit if he dies or not.
His posts about Lily are worse than anything I could say to HIM
Maybe he should start attacking ME again instead of my dog
No, he can't do that anymore because he's realised that personal attacks on me alone aren't gonne win anything
And stfu PPK - Les was the one with all the personal attacks. I sat back for fucking ages and never made any sick attacks on him personally though and no one gave him shit for what he did, did they? Now all of a sudden I give him some back (although nothing manipulative like his were) and everyone's all SHOCK, HORROR!
whatever. Les is a filthy little scrotum and nothing Ive said to him (including this thread) is as nasty and disgusting as the things he's said to me and Bint
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Everyone is acting in poor taste here the sooner its over the better
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I'll admit this thread and the looking like a paedo comment are bad taste.
But tbh he needs a dose of his own medicine. I was gettong bored of acting like an adult arguing with a child here. It's much more entertaining to act like a child back.
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Everyone is acting in poor taste here the sooner its over the better
It could have ended much quicker you know. We sure as hell didn't prolong this or make it mean and vindictive in the first place.
Although I do agree, it is getting tiring and I would prefer it to be over really.
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At least I'm attacking HIM, and not making disgusting little posts about a dog.
I would never have said anything like if he hadn't been asking for it all along. tbh I don't give a shit if he dies or not.
His posts about Lily are worse than anything I could say to HIM
Maybe he should start attacking ME again instead of my dog
No, he can't do that anymore because he's realised that personal attacks on me alone aren't gonne win anything
And stfu PPK - Les was the one with all the personal attacks. I sat back for fucking ages and never made any sick attacks on him personally though and no one gave him shit for what he did, did they? Now all of a sudden I give him some back (although nothing manipulative like his were) and everyone's all SHOCK, HORROR!
whatever. Les is a filthy little scrotum and nothing Ive said to him (including this thread) is as nasty and disgusting as the things he's said to me and Bint
Fuck you are full of shit. I'm not attacking you anywhere as much as Les is, but you chose it upon yourself to make remarks about my wife, who has done nothing to you. She's a member here, why don't attack her directly, if you have the balls.
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At least I'm attacking HIM, and not making disgusting little posts about a dog.
I would never have said anything like if he hadn't been asking for it all along. tbh I don't give a shit if he dies or not.
His posts about Lily are worse than anything I could say to HIM
Maybe he should start attacking ME again instead of my dog
No, he can't do that anymore because he's realised that personal attacks on me alone aren't gonne win anything
And stfu PPK - Les was the one with all the personal attacks. I sat back for fucking ages and never made any sick attacks on him personally though and no one gave him shit for what he did, did they? Now all of a sudden I give him some back (although nothing manipulative like his were) and everyone's all SHOCK, HORROR!
whatever. Les is a filthy little scrotum and nothing Ive said to him (including this thread) is as nasty and disgusting as the things he's said to me and Bint
Fuck you are full of shit. I'm not attacking you anywhere as much as Les is, but you chose it upon yourself to make remarks about my wife, who has done nothing to you. She's a member here, why don't attack her directly, if you have the balls.
In fact if I remember right Phlex was just strongly promoting his ethical position that humans are better than animals and then you started wailing in on Tigergirl (His wife). I am sure that was somehow justifiable in your mind though.
As to posts directed at me....
http://www.intensitysquared.com/index.php/topic,12634.0/topicseen.html
Direct comments here Soph and stop spamming this crap over the forum. Parts, CG and others don't want to see it
Soph's callout.
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At least I'm attacking HIM, and not making disgusting little posts about a dog.
I would never have said anything like if he hadn't been asking for it all along. tbh I don't give a shit if he dies or not.
His posts about Lily are worse than anything I could say to HIM
Maybe he should start attacking ME again instead of my dog
No, he can't do that anymore because he's realised that personal attacks on me alone aren't gonne win anything
And stfu PPK - Les was the one with all the personal attacks. I sat back for fucking ages and never made any sick attacks on him personally though and no one gave him shit for what he did, did they? Now all of a sudden I give him some back (although nothing manipulative like his were) and everyone's all SHOCK, HORROR!
whatever. Les is a filthy little scrotum and nothing Ive said to him (including this thread) is as nasty and disgusting as the things he's said to me and Bint
Fuck you are full of shit. I'm not attacking you anywhere as much as Les is, but you chose it upon yourself to make remarks about my wife, who has done nothing to you. She's a member here, why don't attack her directly, if you have the balls.
In fact if I remember right Phlex was just strongly promoting his ethical position that humans are better than animals and then you started wailing in on Tigergirl (His wife). I am sure that was somehow justifiable in your mind though.
As to posts directed at me....
http://www.intensitysquared.com/index.php/topic,12634.0/topicseen.html
Direct comments here Soph and stop spamming this crap over the forum. Parts, CG and others don't want to see it
Soph's callout.
I did comment that at least I can get a woman, insinuating that I have a realistic view of life, unlike some dreamy eyed emo who has unrealistc expectations for a partner then cries that they can't get a chick. Boo fucking hoo. Sounds like all those lonely dudes on WP people like to complain about. And if it's meant as a joke, then the koke got old a long time ago.
The thing is, I made a comment about her, not her pet/partner/child/parent/whatever.
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Reinforcements to Gallipoli. :thumbup:
:lol: :plus:
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:wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker: :wanker:
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I made a comment about her, not her pet/partner.
Yes Phlex I see that.
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And stfu PPK -
WTF if I don't you confused split tail? :finger: I was just pointing out to Milla that this thread did not start off on such high fucking moral ground. I did not call you for personal attacks because the personal attacks were already going both ways.
Les was the one with all the personal attacks. I sat back for fucking ages and never made any sick attacks on him personally though and no one gave him shit for what he did, did they? Now all of a sudden I give him some back (although nothing manipulative like his were) and everyone's all SHOCK, HORROR!
And by the time this thread started the personal attacks were going both ways and other then pointing that out to Milla in the below quote you don't see me condemning you for the same tactics that Sir_Les was using. I was pointing out to Milla that this thread started with a personal attack. Where did I express horror?
Good point Milla. This thread started off on such a positive note before Sir_Les took the low road by insulting Sophs dog. ::) You appear to be missing the point that this whole thread pissing contest has had lowball atacks by both sides. :duh: What the hell was I thinking? You're not really a disinterested observer are you? Reinforcements to Gallipoli. :thumbup:
Furthermore, as others have noted, you did initiate personal attacks on Phlexor when he had not attacked you personally.
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Hoping someone dies much worse than making fun of a dead pet. Pets can be replaced easily. The average lifespan of a dog or cat is rather short. We all have pets die, and while it sucks, it pales in comparison to wishing death upon another human being (at least doing it seriously). That is why I usually opt to wish death upon people, because they deserve to die.
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Or a live pet for that matter. Doesn't matter though. I doubt I will have another heart attack any time soon and if I do, I am pretty sure it will knock me but won't kill me. Greater risk of Cancer TBH. The heart attack thing did not really really bother me. Hell tit for tat just gives me an excuse to fire something equally as horrid or worse their way.
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okay, stop saying that I don't want to see the drama, Les. :green:
Here's the thing. Drama can be entertaining to begin with. I've been involved in my fair share in other places. But when it gets nasty, I tend to just wander off until it passes. Soph knows I love him to bits. I do feel protective of him when shots are taken at the things he cares most about or about things that are deeply personal like being transgendered and his OCD. None of which do i think are cool to attack.
That being said, I was equally disturbed by the heart attack and paedo comments and he knows that. So I'm not picking sides. I'm just going to fuck off until the majority of it passes. I can see both sides of the coin and no one is going to win. There's been some pretty crappy attacks made on both sides and I don't see a recovery from it.
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cg I left it fo ages without getting really personal with him after he;d been making those personal attacks right from hte start on zomg. So tbh I see nothing wrong with me finally reacting to it and stooping to his level. Yeah, it's dumb. But I don't care really.
Alex, you are an idiot if you think pets can be replaced easily. IMO what he said was worse as he was attacking someone else, my pets. All I'm doing is attacking him. If he'd said the same thing to me (that he hopes I die), I wouldn't have been in the slightest bit bothered as it would be aimed at me. Attack my dog though and you're a fucking low-life scum.
Yeah the paedo comment was low. I was gonna apologise for that yesyterday morning when I got on as I regretted saying that. But then I saw the rest of the shit and lies he was coming out with and changed my mind. It's not like I said he WAS a paedo though. I said he looked like one. And tbh I think that about a lot of people I see in the street. When they have that creepy old pervert look about them. So I said it. Just like he's said plenty of times what he thinks about my looks and Bint's looks.
Phlexor I don't even know what your wife looks like. If she's with you though then she's probably not the kinda woman I'd be attracted to. But I know I could get a gf if I had different standards when it comes to physical attraction. And I know she's a member on here. I see no reason to go after her though as I don't have a problem with her. I'm just saying what I think - you made a comment about me not getting women, so I responded - in all honesty I do believe I COULD get a woman as hot as any women you could get. I'm sorry if that upsets you, but I'm not gonna lie. That's what I think. I've never seen a picture of your wife so I dunno if she's fat or ugly. But I do think I could get a gf with the same level of physical attractiveness (to me) as any you could get
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Huh?
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So you say you have no idea what she looks like, but then make some sort of educated guess as to the type of woman I could get or who would be interested in me, then you claim you could get the same type of woman.
And mind you, this is all based on physical appearance, not personality.
If that is all that matters to you, good luck to you.
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Who says only physical appearance matters to me? I'd want both if I was gonna have a relationship with someone. I've remained friends with girls IRL who wanted more than friendship. I don't see any reason for more though if it;s just her personality I like. I need both for a girlfriend.
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So what you're trying to tell me is that you want to be lonely?
What are the odds of someone meeting you criteria? Who also happens to find you attractive?
So its someone who has looks, personality, and doesn't mind someone who is transgendered mentally and is into your looks and personality.
I know someone personally who is as picky/fussy as you and also on the spectrum. He's 38 and lonely.
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There have actually been quite a few online. I'm not THAT fussy when it comes to looks. I find a lot of women attractive.
I'm not lonely though. But even if I was, I'd rather be lonely than be with a woman I don't particularly wanna be with, just so I'm not on my own. I dn't want a relationship that badly.
But yeh, it's certainly possible with women I've met online. So if I put the effort in (which I could do if I ever really wanted a gf badly), I'm sure it could work IRL too
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andd dies
Regardless of what personal attacks Les has made on you, that's pretty damn low, Soph. And childish.
You say you want a woman. This is a prime example of the kind of thing that's NOT going to get you one.
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It was in answer to various posts Sir Les made about Lily dying. Soph was provoked. He did stoop low with this but it was to a level Sir Les has already set.
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Would people please call Soph by her biologocal gender so I don't get confused? is that too much to ask??
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Is it to much to ask to call him by what he identifies as? ::)
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cg I left it fo ages without getting really personal with him after he;d been making those personal attacks right from hte start on zomg. So tbh I see nothing wrong with me finally reacting to it and stooping to his level. Yeah, it's dumb. But I don't care really.
Alex, you are an idiot if you think pets can be replaced easily. IMO what he said was worse as he was attacking someone else, my pets. All I'm doing is attacking him. If he'd said the same thing to me (that he hopes I die), I wouldn't have been in the slightest bit bothered as it would be aimed at me. Attack my dog though and you're a fucking low-life scum.
Yeah the paedo comment was low. I was gonna apologise for that yesyterday morning when I got on as I regretted saying that. But then I saw the rest of the shit and lies he was coming out with and changed my mind. It's not like I said he WAS a paedo though. I said he looked like one. And tbh I think that about a lot of people I see in the street. When they have that creepy old pervert look about them. So I said it. Just like he's said plenty of times what he thinks about my looks and Bint's looks.
Phlexor I don't even know what your wife looks like. If she's with you though then she's probably not the kinda woman I'd be attracted to. But I know I could get a gf if I had different standards when it comes to physical attraction. And I know she's a member on here. I see no reason to go after her though as I don't have a problem with her. I'm just saying what I think - you made a comment about me not getting women, so I responded - in all honesty I do believe I COULD get a woman as hot as any women you could get. I'm sorry if that upsets you, but I'm not gonna lie. That's what I think. I've never seen a picture of your wife so I dunno if she's fat or ugly. But I do think I could get a gf with the same level of physical attractiveness (to me) as any you could get
This right you seem to think you have not to be offended comes from where exactly?
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Would people please call Soph by her biologocal gender so I don't get confused? is that too much to ask??
Exactly.
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Fuck off Hadron ;)
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Is it to much to ask to call him by what he identifies as? ::)
I think PPK's description is the most accurate, Gender confused split-tail.
"He" either implies a penis or elevated testosterone levels, niether of which Soph has. :police:
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The only confusion about his gender comes from you lot. He on the other hand is very secure with both his gender and sexuality :zoinks:
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The only confusion about his gender comes from you lot. He on the other hand is very secure with both his gender and sexuality :zoinks:
Which explains why it has never been laid?? ::) :facepalm2:
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Could you be anymore of a dickhead ::)
Really, are concepts of being transgendered and pansexual such difficult to understand? Or is this place teeming with morons?
I think the latter :thumbup:
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Could you be anymore of a dickhead ::)
Really, are concepts of being transgendered and pansexual such difficult to understand? Or is this place teeming with morons?
I think the latter :thumbup:
Goodness they are very easy to understand - and very easy for sane people to reject.
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Could you be anymore of a dickhead ::)
Really, are concepts of being transgendered and pansexual such difficult to understand? Or is this place teeming with morons?
I think the latter :thumbup:
Oh yes, it's the entire world of 6 billion people who have it wrong and you 2, and those who agree with you, are right. Jesustapdancingchrist could you muster any more of a martyr complex?? It isn't Soph's transgender and your pansexuality that's annoying the fuck out of people, it's the gigantic chip on your shoulders that you have about it. Quit whining about the fact that people "don't understand transgenders" when it's Soph who doesn't seem to understand her own sexuality as evidenced by the fact that she's never been laid. :police:
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Could you be anymore of a dickhead ::)
Really, are concepts of being transgendered and pansexual such difficult to understand? Or is this place teeming with morons?
I think the latter :thumbup:
Goodness they are very easy to understand - and very easy for sane people to reject.
:agreed:
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And if soph was "secure" about it, then why does she do a major shitfit when people take the piss? I don't cry because people point out I'm a fat bastard, for example.
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I see transphobia is rife here.
Nice :thumbup:
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I see transphobia is rife here.
Nice :thumbup:
Yes, resort to ad-hominems when you can't make a cogent argument. :thumbup:
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Further arguing is pointless here. You have your set of beliefs which I doubt you'd change even if I provided you with the most concise set of arguments. There is no point in arguing with close-minded people ;)
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Get over it, if soph wasn't a cunt about it (victim complex etc.) then maybe i'd not take the piss. "transphobia" my arse.
Close minded is in all sides. There is no point trying to go the moral highground, especially when you had a thing for fucking zoophilia once. Jesus christ. :thumbup:
EDIT: Would love to tell your parents about that one, I still have the logs. :zoinks:
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I hope Sir les wins the lottery
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So far, the cunts here are you.
As for zoophilia, sure I watched a couple of clips on BeastTube, that's what you get when you hang around Calandale too much :zoinks: Although I fail to see what this has in common with the argument at hand. You are running out of arguments m'deah ;)
I must have been really fucked in the head to start this whole drama over something as insignificant as you.
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I AM insignificant, I've never denied it. However, you're making me look significant.
I am pointing out that you try this moral highground bullshit yet you're just as bad as the rest of us. We're all hypocrites, close minded morons and dickheads. Get over yourself.
As for myself, so far I've only been light heartily joining in the fun because you guessed it- I'm bored. I got all my assignments done so what else can I do? :orly:
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I have never implied I'm perfect, far from it. I highlight all my faults way too often here actually.
I know deep down you feel bad about being a shit friend.
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Further arguing is pointless here. You have your set of beliefs which I doubt you'd change even if I provided you with the most concise set of arguments. There is no point in arguing with close-minded people ;)
You are being like a bible basher who starts from the Bible to prove some "facts" to us Atheists.
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Further arguing is pointless here. You have your set of beliefs which I doubt you'd change even if I provided you with the most concise set of arguments. There is no point in arguing with close-minded people ;)
You are being like a bible basher who starts from the Bible to prove some "facts" to us Atheists.
Fuck off Hadron ;)
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I have never implied I'm perfect, far from it. I highlight all my faults way too often here actually.
I know deep down you feel bad about being a shit friend.
Nope.
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Further arguing is pointless here. You have your set of beliefs which I doubt you'd change even if I provided you with the most concise set of arguments. There is no point in arguing with close-minded people ;)
No, it's just painfully obvious that Soph is sexually confused. Perhaps after she's been laid 50 times or more, maybe she can comment on her own sexuality BASED ON ACTUAL FUCKING EXPERIENCE instead of just talikg out of her ass.
The fact is, Soph does not posses, nor has the desire to posses, a cock. She will never know what it's like to have a dick, and spend every waking moment of your life, searching for a hole to stick it in. That's what it means to be male. She niether understands this, nor has the desire to understand. Therefore she doesn't rate to be called a "he". :police:
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Is it to much to ask to call him by what he identifies as? ::)
Yes. Next.
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Further arguing is pointless here. You have your set of beliefs which I doubt you'd change even if I provided you with the most concise set of arguments. There is no point in arguing with close-minded people ;)
It would have been nice of you to produce at least one argument. Coherence would be an added bonus.
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Further arguing is pointless here. You have your set of beliefs which I doubt you'd change even if I provided you with the most concise set of arguments. There is no point in arguing with close-minded people ;)
No, it's just painfully obvious that Soph is sexually confused. Perhaps after she's been laid 50 times or more, maybe she can comment on her own sexuality BASED ON ACTUAL FUCKING EXPERIENCE instead of just talikg out of her ass.
The fact is, Soph does not posses, nor has the desire to posses, a cock. She will never know what it's like to have a dick, and spend every waking moment of your life, searching for a hole to stick it in. That's what it means to be male. She niether understands this, nor has the desire to understand. Therefore she doesn't rate to be called a "he". :police:
Aww, I know what it is. You feel your masculinity is at stake here. Would calling Soph by the male pronoun make you feel less like a man? :eyelash:
Is it to much to ask to call him by what he identifies as? ::)
Yes. Next.
Fuck off odeon ;)
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She's not a man. Her wanting to be identified as one does not make her one.
Oh, and fuck off, Bint. ;)
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Don't worry you big manly men, calling Soph a he would not make your penises shrink OR fall off :zoinks:
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Would calling Soph by the male pronoun make you feel less like a man? :eyelash:
Not in the slightest. Calling Soph a "he" doesn't magically attach a dick to her pelvis, nor does it produce the neurophysical changes to the brain caused by eleveted testosterone levels.
Soph is a self-deluded bull-dyke. Plain and simple truth. :police:
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(http://www.megawank.com/pics/picturepost/gay-blowjob+-1858.jpg)
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Don't worry you big manly men, calling Soph a he would not make your penises shrink OR fall off :zoinks:
Nor would calling her "it".
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(http://www.asstoying.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/12/34.jpg)
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It, then.
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(http://www.his-first-facial.net/gay-blowjob-video/gay-blowjob-video-07.jpg)
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She's not a man. Her wanting to be identified as one does not make her one.
Oh, and fuck off, Bint. ;)
I would say a lack of testicular fortitude is the main problem here...
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She's not a man. Her wanting to be identified as one does not make her one.
Oh, and fuck off, Bint. ;)
I would say a lack of testicular fortitude is the main problem here...
Not sure it's the main problem but it is one of them.
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(http://www.planetclimax.com/pics_add/freesites/gay-sex+-82-18.jpg)
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She's not a man. Her wanting to be identified as one does not make her one.
Oh, and fuck off, Bint. ;)
I would say a lack of testicular fortitude is the main problem here...
Not sure it's the main problem but it is one of them.
Oh - I forgot lack of cock. Silly me.
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(http://gaysexresorts.net/gaycaps/free_gay_sex.jpg)
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She's not a man. Her wanting to be identified as one does not make her one.
Oh, and fuck off, Bint. ;)
I would say a lack of testicular fortitude is the main problem here...
Not sure it's the main problem but it is one of them.
Oh - I forgot lack of cock. Silly me.
Some people are cunts in more ways than one.
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She's not a man. Her wanting to be identified as one does not make her one.
Oh, and fuck off, Bint. ;)
I would say a lack of testicular fortitude is the main problem here...
Not sure it's the main problem but it is one of them.
Oh - I forgot lack of cock. Silly me.
Some people are cunts in more ways than one.
Gash man.
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(http://www.planetclimax.com/pics/paysites/his-first-gay-sex-gallery+-1052-5.jpg)
Odeon is that you on the left there? :zombiefuck:
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Most of the pictures you post are invisible to me B. I just get a message where I can see it. And can't be arsed to go there.
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(http://www.gaysextwinks.org/promo/cute_boy_gay_sex-twink.jpg)
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
:pinkbeat:
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Most of the pictures you post are invisible to me B. I just get a message where I can see it. And can't be arsed to go there.
She's been unable to produce a single coherent argument so she's posting gay porn instead. I very much doubt there's actually anything to see but it amuses me that she thinks it'll provoke more than a yawn.
:yawn:
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A "coherent" argument is staring you in the face dickhead ;)
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lol ur mum
*posts gay porn*
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I agree with you CG. There's a whole spectrum in gender. From fully male to fully female, and all there in between. The need to identify with one gender, just because of the genitals you are born with is absurd. The whole idea to identify people by their genitals is. The need to identify with one gender, regardless of what genitals you are born with is absurd.
I loved the word genderbending that was around 20 years ago.
I don't know what it is to be TG.
I only know what it is to be attracted to someone regardless of the gender. Liking the gender when I am attracted though.
Yes, transgender bashing is stupid. But I think the whole fight here has gone stupid.
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I agree Hyke, on all points.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
It's not about bashing transgendered people, CG, it's about bashing *people* who behave like cunts. Surely you're not saying that transgenderdness (if there is such a word; Firefox is marking it as wrong) is untouchable in a way that, say, hoping for someone to die is not?
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A "coherent" argument is staring you in the face dickhead ;)
I'm in awe by your brilliance, then.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
How the fuck is it a cop out?
It takes great courage to be a transgendered person, even or perhaps especially in this society. I wouldn't expect you to know what courage is Hadron though. You, who constantly tries to mask his AS.
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A "coherent" argument is staring you in the face dickhead ;)
I'm in awe by your brilliance, then.
Fuck off odeon 8)
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
Hey, there is a whole thread about this already. And you won't change your mind about that, no matter what. So, I feel no need to react on your post more than I do here now.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
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A "coherent" argument is staring you in the face dickhead ;)
I'm in awe by your brilliance, then.
Fuck off odeon 8)
Fuck off, Bint. We could do this for a while.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
It's not about bashing transgendered people, CG, it's about bashing *people* who behave like cunts. Surely you're not saying that transgenderdness (if there is such a word; Firefox is marking it as wrong) is untouchable in a way that, say, hoping for someone to die is not?
Actually, I do believe that some topics should be untouchable when it comes to bashing. Genderbending bashing and racist comments aren't cool in my books at all. That is merely my opinion. I've already told Les that I didn't think some of his comments were cool, and I've told Soph that Les dying and calling him a peado wasn't cool either. So I'm not choosing sides, I'm calling them both out on some shitty behaviour.
But now it has turned into a lot of people going after Soph's sexuality and I'd venture to say that most don't know the effect that that carries. they've both been called out on things that cross the line and I think it should hold true for others.
No, I don't expect this place to be all sunshine and roses. Wouldn't be I2 if it was. But I'm the same person I am on here, as I am IRL, and I stand up for things that I don't feel are right. Gender bashing isn't cool. It's a really shitty thing to do. Just like some of the things Bint and Les and Soph have said have been shitty.
And to Hadron ~ You're clueless so I'm not even going to go there with you.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
It's not about bashing transgendered people, CG, it's about bashing *people* who behave like cunts. Surely you're not saying that transgenderdness (if there is such a word; Firefox is marking it as wrong) is untouchable in a way that, say, hoping for someone to die is not?
You don't seem to realise that your and Scrapheap's transphobic comments are not just about Soph. They touch any transgendered person. Like TheOtherWindow for example or GA. Imagine (although that's perhaps asking way too much of you ::) ) how a transgendered person would feel reading it. However just because it's trans people, you feel you have a right to mock them. You would never mock a black person though would you? Cause that's just wrong isn't it?
You fucking hypocrite ;)
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
It's not about bashing transgendered people, CG, it's about bashing *people* who behave like cunts. Surely you're not saying that transgenderdness (if there is such a word; Firefox is marking it as wrong) is untouchable in a way that, say, hoping for someone to die is not?
Actually, I do believe that some topics should be untouchable when it comes to bashing. Genderbending bashing and racist comments aren't cool in my books at all. That is merely my opinion. I've already told Les that I didn't think some of his comments were cool, and I've told Soph that Les dying and calling him a peado wasn't cool either. So I'm not choosing sides, I'm calling them both out on some shitty behaviour.
But now it has turned into a lot of people going after Soph's sexuality and I'd venture to say that most don't know the effect that that carries. they've both been called out on things that cross the line and I think it should hold true for others.
No, I don't expect this place to be all sunshine and roses. Wouldn't be I2 if it was. But I'm the same person I am on here, as I am IRL, and I stand up for things that I don't feel are right. Gender bashing isn't cool. It's a really shitty thing to do. Just like some of the things Bint and Les and Soph have said have been shitty.
And to Hadron ~ You're clueless so I'm not even going to go there with you.
Fair enough. I respect your opinion even though I don't completely agree. :plus:
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
It's not about bashing transgendered people, CG, it's about bashing *people* who behave like cunts. Surely you're not saying that transgenderdness (if there is such a word; Firefox is marking it as wrong) is untouchable in a way that, say, hoping for someone to die is not?
You don't seem to realise that your and Scrapheap's transphobic comments are not just about Soph. They touch any transgendered person. Like TheOtherWindow for example or GA. Imagine (although that's perhaps asking way too much of you ::) ) how a transgendered person would feel reading it. However just because it's trans people, you feel you have a right to mock them. You would never mock a black person though would you? Cause that's just wrong isn't it?
You fucking hypocrite ;)
Fair enough, but can you imagine how someone whose relative died of a heart attack would feel reading the OP in this thread?
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
How the fuck is it a cop out?
It takes great courage to be a transgendered person, even or perhaps especially in this society. I wouldn't expect you to know what courage is Hadron though. You, who constantly tries to mask his AS.
Courage only occurs when you are actually fighting for a legitimate cause.
By the way, I dont make a massive effort to mask AS or anything, if I were then I would not have been setting up and getting involved with all the stuff that I have been doing recently.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
It's not about bashing transgendered people, CG, it's about bashing *people* who behave like cunts. Surely you're not saying that transgenderdness (if there is such a word; Firefox is marking it as wrong) is untouchable in a way that, say, hoping for someone to die is not?
You don't seem to realise that your and Scrapheap's transphobic comments are not just about Soph. They touch any transgendered person. Like TheOtherWindow for example or GA. Imagine (although that's perhaps asking way too much of you ::) ) how a transgendered person would feel reading it. However just because it's trans people, you feel you have a right to mock them. You would never mock a black person though would you? Cause that's just wrong isn't it?
You fucking hypocrite ;)
Fair enough, but can you imagine how someone whose relative died of a heart attack would feel reading the OP in this thread?
Oh for God's sake, that thread was made after a series of low attacks from Sir Les. He first wrote a really fucked up post mocking Soph for being transgendered on ZOMG.
Soph has apologised numerous times for that thread, Sir Les hasn't apologised for jack.
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I agree with the gender spectrum thing aswell, but when it comes to people like soph:
Why bother crying over someone because they disagree?
Why be a self-righteous, overly PC, victim complexing cunt about it? (yes, calling out soph for her bullshit instantly makes you "transphobic")
Why make *everyone* tolerate you?
WHY even bother by what what you're called?
If someone addressed me as "she", I wouldn't give a fuck. If I was transgender and someone called me a "he", I'd still not give a fuck. I realise that people are going to be intolerant regardless, that I can't make all people "accept" me. I'd rather worry about the more important things than my own gender orientation anyway, like getting a stable life and education with a good income.
If soph was alright as a person and not a complete tit, then I wouldn't give a fuck if she's trans. Same for if a person who was black/fat/ginger etc., if they were decent as people then I'd not give a fuck. Otherwise, I will take the piss.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
It's not about bashing transgendered people, CG, it's about bashing *people* who behave like cunts. Surely you're not saying that transgenderdness (if there is such a word; Firefox is marking it as wrong) is untouchable in a way that, say, hoping for someone to die is not?
Actually, I do believe that some topics should be untouchable when it comes to bashing. Genderbending bashing and racist comments aren't cool in my books at all. That is merely my opinion. I've already told Les that I didn't think some of his comments were cool, and I've told Soph that Les dying and calling him a peado wasn't cool either. So I'm not choosing sides, I'm calling them both out on some shitty behaviour.
But now it has turned into a lot of people going after Soph's sexuality and I'd venture to say that most don't know the effect that that carries. they've both been called out on things that cross the line and I think it should hold true for others.
No, I don't expect this place to be all sunshine and roses. Wouldn't be I2 if it was. But I'm the same person I am on here, as I am IRL, and I stand up for things that I don't feel are right. Gender bashing isn't cool. It's a really shitty thing to do. Just like some of the things Bint and Les and Soph have said have been shitty.
And to Hadron ~ You're clueless so I'm not even going to go there with you.
Fair enough. I respect your opinion even though I don't completely agree. :plus:
okay, I like you again now. I was about to take my tonka toys and go home. ;)
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::)
No one cares Shleed, piss off.
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This is the only post I'm gonna make in any of these trans arguments (at least this week)
I am frequently called She and don;t make anything of it. Most male members on here and zomg refer to me as She and I don't think I;ve ever asked them to do otherwise myself. I never even mentioned which pronoun I preferred until Milla asked me once last year. People can call me whatever they like. I don't think I'm above being offended and I don't want to be either. I am comfortable with my gender and sexuality (although how did sexuality come into this?). I'd have to be to be able to put up with being trans IRL. I don't cry about pronouns. What does bother me though is what I personally view as transphobia or trans-bashing. Not becuase it's aimed at me, but because it's aimed (whether intentionally or not) at ALL trans people. It bothers me in the same way that homophobia or racism would bother me.
Anyway, people can think of me as male, female or anything in between. But please don't use this as an excuse and say it's just attacking me, because it isn't. Either attack me for being ME, or attack trans people openly. Have the "balls" to do that at least (pun intended).
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
It's not about bashing transgendered people, CG, it's about bashing *people* who behave like cunts. Surely you're not saying that transgenderdness (if there is such a word; Firefox is marking it as wrong) is untouchable in a way that, say, hoping for someone to die is not?
You don't seem to realise that your and Scrapheap's transphobic comments are not just about Soph. They touch any transgendered person. Like TheOtherWindow for example or GA. Imagine (although that's perhaps asking way too much of you ::) ) how a transgendered person would feel reading it. However just because it's trans people, you feel you have a right to mock them. You would never mock a black person though would you? Cause that's just wrong isn't it?
You fucking hypocrite ;)
Soph is a "she" because of a biological setup, and so, btw, is GA (don't know about TOW cos I've not paid enough attention to him/her). I'm fairly sure they covered the basics of that topic where you went to school so if you want to disagree with the definition, you need to start name-calling others, starting with your teachers and moving on to the evil society in general, all those bad people who choose to go with that same basic definition Scrap and I did. That's the extent of my comments and that is what I meant. Now, Soph could become a "he" with a combination of meds and surgery, but right now she's not.
I'm interested in how not accepting your ad hoc definition of what a "he" is equals bashing all the TGs (and gays and pansexuals and blacks and pill-popping adolescents, etc, etc, etc) as a group. Logic isn't your strongest point, is it?
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
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I agree with the gender spectrum thing aswell, but when it comes to people like soph:
Why bother crying over someone because they disagree?
Why be a self-righteous, overly PC, victim complexing cunt about it? (yes, calling out soph for her bullshit instantly makes you "transphobic")
Why make *everyone* tolerate you?
WHY even bother by what what you're called?
If someone addressed me as "she", I wouldn't give a fuck. If I was transgender and someone called me a "he", I'd still not give a fuck. I realise that people are going to be intolerant regardless, that I can't make all people "accept" me. I'd rather worry about the more important things than my own gender orientation anyway, like getting a stable life and education with a good income.
If soph was alright as a person and not a complete tit, then I wouldn't give a fuck if she's trans. Same for if a person who was black/fat/ginger etc., if they were decent as people then I'd not give a fuck. Otherwise, I will take the piss.
Excellent points.
Interestingly, the one making the most fuss about this is not Soph. Well, unless she is doing all her writing at ZOMG or in those countless pictures-of-my-dog threads that I don't plan to read.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
It's not about bashing transgendered people, CG, it's about bashing *people* who behave like cunts. Surely you're not saying that transgenderdness (if there is such a word; Firefox is marking it as wrong) is untouchable in a way that, say, hoping for someone to die is not?
You don't seem to realise that your and Scrapheap's transphobic comments are not just about Soph. They touch any transgendered person. Like TheOtherWindow for example or GA. Imagine (although that's perhaps asking way too much of you ::) ) how a transgendered person would feel reading it. However just because it's trans people, you feel you have a right to mock them. You would never mock a black person though would you? Cause that's just wrong isn't it?
You fucking hypocrite ;)
Soph is a "she" because of a biological setup, and so, btw, is GA (don't know about TOW cos I've not paid enough attention to him/her). I'm fairly sure they covered the basics of that topic where you went to school so if you want to disagree with the definition, you need to start name-calling others, starting with your teachers and moving on to the evil society in general, all those bad people who choose to go with that same basic definition Scrap and I did. That's the extent of my comments and that is what I meant. Now, Soph could become a "he" with a combination of meds and surgery, but right now she's not.
I'm interested in how not accepting your ad hoc definition of what a "he" is equals bashing all the TGs (and gays and pansexuals and blacks and pill-popping adolescents, etc, etc, etc) as a group. Logic isn't your strongest point, is it?
Back-track much?
And funny how you should mention my "pill-popping", I'm not the only member here who is on sleeping pills or who sometimes takes too many of them. Funny how you didn't mention my drinking too, or would that just make you even more of a hypocrite? ;)
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
Where the hell do eating disorders come into all of this Hadron?
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
Where the hell do eating disorders come into all of this Hadron?
Where is the fundamental difference in a female imagining they have a penis compared to imagining they do not need to eat?
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This is the only post I'm gonna make in any of these trans arguments (at least this week)
I am frequently called She and don;t make anything of it. Most male members on here and zomg refer to me as She and I don't think I;ve ever asked them to do otherwise myself. I never even mentioned which pronoun I preferred until Milla asked me once last year. People can call me whatever they like. I don't think I'm above being offended and I don't want to be either. I am comfortable with my gender and sexuality (although how did sexuality come into this?). I'd have to be to be able to put up with being trans IRL. I don't cry about pronouns. What does bother me though is what I personally view as transphobia or trans-bashing. Not becuase it's aimed at me, but because it's aimed (whether intentionally or not) at ALL trans people. It bothers me in the same way that homophobia or racism would bother me.
Anyway, people can think of me as male, female or anything in between. But please don't use this as an excuse and say it's just attacking me, because it isn't. Either attack me for being ME, or attack trans people openly. Have the "balls" to do that at least (pun intended).
Is it not possible to attack *you* specifically, targeting your particular variety of the trans issues? Is this akin to that black thing, where blacks can call each other niggers but if a white guy does it everybody screams "RACIST"?
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
Where the hell do eating disorders come into all of this Hadron?
Where is the fundamental difference in a female imagining they have a penis compared to imagining they do not need to eat?
:facepalm2:
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Actually, I do believe that some topics should be untouchable when it comes to bashing. Genderbending bashing and racist comments aren't cool in my books at all.
I'd hardly call criticism of Soph's sexual orientation "bashing" since she has made several contradictory statements regarging her orientation AND a complete lack of sexual experience. Soph is a confused little split-tail who needs to get laid about 100 times or so before she starts lecturing people on complex sexual issues.
Would you take advice on sex from a nun or a priest who had never been laid?? I didn't think so.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
I believe that anorexia is not a lifestyle choice. Don't know about TG but I'd suspect that it's not a lifestyle choice either.
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You don't seem to realise that your and Scrapheap's transphobic comments are not just about Soph.
I never made "transphobic" comments. I offered a reasoned critique of Soph's transgender claims.
You can fuck the hell off if you think her words are off limits to criticism of any kind.
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Actually, I do believe that some topics should be untouchable when it comes to bashing. Genderbending bashing and racist comments aren't cool in my books at all.
I'd hardly call criticism of Soph's sexual orientation "bashing" since she has made several contradictory statements regarging her orientation AND a complete lack of sexual experience. Soph is a confused little split-tail who needs to get laid about 100 times or so before she starts lecturing people on complex sexual issues.
Would you take advice on sex from a nun or a priest who had never been laid?? I didn't think so.
ok I said I was gonna stay outta the trans thing. But this is clearly about sexual orientation.
I'm not sure what you mean scrap. What contradictory statements have I made? I think I've been pretty consistent. I've never had sex and don't pretend to know a lot about sex for that very reason. I know who I am though, and I know who I'm attracted to.
When have I ever tried to give people sex advice? I've always been fairly open about the fact that I am extremely inexperienced when it comes to sex. I don't feel confused myself, but if I confuse you then sorry dude.
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Jesus Christ.
This place is full of morons. Stupid, brain-dead morons.
It's tiring to argue when you know someone won't understand in the first place.
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You don't seem to realise that your and Scrapheap's transphobic comments are not just about Soph.
I never made "transphobic" comments. I offered a reasoned critique of Soph's transgender claims.
You can fuck the hell off if you think her words are off limits to criticism of any kind.
Oh yeah, that isn't transphobic at all dickhead ::)
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
It's not about bashing transgendered people, CG, it's about bashing *people* who behave like cunts. Surely you're not saying that transgenderdness (if there is such a word; Firefox is marking it as wrong) is untouchable in a way that, say, hoping for someone to die is not?
You don't seem to realise that your and Scrapheap's transphobic comments are not just about Soph. They touch any transgendered person. Like TheOtherWindow for example or GA. Imagine (although that's perhaps asking way too much of you ::) ) how a transgendered person would feel reading it. However just because it's trans people, you feel you have a right to mock them. You would never mock a black person though would you? Cause that's just wrong isn't it?
You fucking hypocrite ;)
Soph is a "she" because of a biological setup, and so, btw, is GA (don't know about TOW cos I've not paid enough attention to him/her). I'm fairly sure they covered the basics of that topic where you went to school so if you want to disagree with the definition, you need to start name-calling others, starting with your teachers and moving on to the evil society in general, all those bad people who choose to go with that same basic definition Scrap and I did. That's the extent of my comments and that is what I meant. Now, Soph could become a "he" with a combination of meds and surgery, but right now she's not.
I'm interested in how not accepting your ad hoc definition of what a "he" is equals bashing all the TGs (and gays and pansexuals and blacks and pill-popping adolescents, etc, etc, etc) as a group. Logic isn't your strongest point, is it?
Back-track much?
And funny how you should mention my "pill-popping", I'm not the only member here who is on sleeping pills or who sometimes takes too many of them. Funny how you didn't mention my drinking too, or would that just make you even more of a hypocrite? ;)
I notice that you're not addressing what I wrote. You could try actually showing me how I'm a hypocrite, instead of simply repeating it like a mantra.
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Jesus Christ.
This place is full of morons. Stupid, brain-dead morons.
It's tiring to argue when you know someone won't understand in the first place.
You could try presenting us with an argument. Any argument would do to start with, but a coherent one would be preferable.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
I believe that anorexia is not a lifestyle choice. Don't know about TG but I'd suspect that it's not a lifestyle choice either.
Anorexia is largely a symptom of being middle class, 40-50 years it did not really exist very much at all. Now its in the vogue.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
I believe that anorexia is not a lifestyle choice. Don't know about TG but I'd suspect that it's not a lifestyle choice either.
Anorexia is largely a symptom of being middle class, 40-50 years it did not really exist very much at all. Now its in the vogue.
AIDS didn't exist 50 years ago, either. Doesn't make it a lifestyle choice.
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Jesus Christ.
This place is full of morons. Stupid, brain-dead morons.
It's tiring to argue when you know someone won't understand in the first place.
You could try presenting us with an argument. Any argument would do to start with, but a coherent one would be preferable.
Exactly. Rather than her behaving identically to a religious zealot.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
I believe that anorexia is not a lifestyle choice. Don't know about TG but I'd suspect that it's not a lifestyle choice either.
Anorexia is largely a symptom of being middle class, 40-50 years it did not really exist very much at all. Now its in the vogue.
AIDS didn't exist 50 years ago, either. Doesn't make it a lifestyle choice.
There is a difference in the medium it traverses: one is through biology, the other through the social medium (along with TG etc).
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
I believe that anorexia is not a lifestyle choice. Don't know about TG but I'd suspect that it's not a lifestyle choice either.
Anorexia is largely a symptom of being middle class, 40-50 years it did not really exist very much at all. Now its in the vogue.
AIDS didn't exist 50 years ago, either. Doesn't make it a lifestyle choice.
There is a difference in the medium it traverses: one is through biology, the other through the social medium (along with TG etc).
Not according to the doc that dx'd me, a couple of years ago. She also researched anorexia and did not regard it as a lifestyle choice.
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I see someone had a fit in this thread. Amazing.
Soph, you are the idiot. I have had several pets over the years, and they are replaceable. I love dogs, but I can't say that someone making fun of my dead dog is equivalent to them wishing that I die. I have had someone claim that I had sex with my dead dog before, his joke was that I dug it up and had sex with it. I laughed. You are way too sensitive.
I prefer to wish death upon people because it means a lot more than just making fun of their pets. If you get butthurt because someone makes fun of your dog dying, you need some help.
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I've endured a long lifetime of alienation from the prevailing standards of "polite" society. Online forums are a welcome respite from that; I can finally express myself in ways that were never possible before. You would not connect who I am in real life with the person whose posts you see here. I have enough trouble getting along with people in everyday life that (believe it or not) I don't feel the need to look for arguments online. I reserve the right to make bad jokes and tasteless remarks, but in all sincerity, I wish no ill on anyone here.
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Yep I probably am too sensitive when it comes to my cat/dog.
I've already apologised for this thread. Nothing I can do about it now except accept the consequences.
People are different though. What bothers one person isn't necessarily gonna bother me. I wouldn't care if Sir Les had said he hopes I die. It would have bothered me even less than the OCD posts, which (while I do think they were low) didn't bother me really.
My pets are part of my family, and my family is the most important thing in my life. Sure, I reacted badly. But different things bother different people. I don't care if someone wishes me dead for example.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
I believe that anorexia is not a lifestyle choice. Don't know about TG but I'd suspect that it's not a lifestyle choice either.
Anorexia is largely a symptom of being middle class, 40-50 years it did not really exist very much at all. Now its in the vogue.
AIDS didn't exist 50 years ago, either. Doesn't make it a lifestyle choice.
There is a difference in the medium it traverses: one is through biology, the other through the social medium (along with TG etc).
Not according to the doc that dx'd me, a couple of years ago. She also researched anorexia and did not regard it as a lifestyle choice.
Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
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I've endured a long lifetime of alienation from the prevailing standards of "polite" society. Online forums are a welcome respite from that; I can finally express myself in ways that were never possible before. You would not connect who I am in real life with the person whose posts you see here. I have enough trouble getting along with people in everyday life that (believe it or not) I don't feel the need to look for arguments online. I reserve the right to make bad jokes and tasteless remarks, but in all sincerity, I wish no ill on anyone here.
And your solution to it is to reinforce peoples right not to be offended. No - people need to be punished for attempting to enforce such a right and punished hard.
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
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Bigots are scary because they harm the people they hate. Bigotphobia - the fear of bigots.
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I've endured a long lifetime of alienation from the prevailing standards of "polite" society. Online forums are a welcome respite from that; I can finally express myself in ways that were never possible before. You would not connect who I am in real life with the person whose posts you see here. I have enough trouble getting along with people in everyday life that (believe it or not) I don't feel the need to look for arguments online. I reserve the right to make bad jokes and tasteless remarks, but in all sincerity, I wish no ill on anyone here.
And your solution to it is to reinforce peoples right not to be offended. No - people need to be punished for attempting to enforce such a right and punished hard.
I'm not attempting to "enforce" anything. I'll say what I damwell think, and I expect you to do the same.
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
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At least Soph doesn't ask me for tips on how to act NT Hadron ;)
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
For fucks sake, Hadron. You're like a walking talking headache! When people choose to come out has no bearing. I didn't come out with my bi-sexuality until I was 27. Does that mean that it doesn't exist or I'm not truly drawn to women as well as men? You might want to ask the women I've slept with then. I was pretty fucking enthusiastic (and good I hear too, but that's besides the point). I've known I was into both genders since I was 12. Doesn't mean i knew what it was called.
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I actually "came out" as trans to some people before I'd even heard of AS. Long before 21 anyway :zoinks:
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I'm not sure what you mean scrap. What contradictory statements have I made?
Claiming a "male" identitiy and then claiming that you weren't interested in ever having a penis. As I've said before, you can't ever understand what it means to be male until you've experienced having a penis, AND having the desire, every second that you're awake, to shove it it in the nearest willing pussy you can find. Ask any guy here or anywhere. When you're awake, you're horny, and that's what comes with elevated testosterone levels.
I think I've been pretty consistent. I've never had sex and don't pretend to know a lot about sex for that very reason. I know who I am though,
Untill you've been experienced, that's a claim you, or anyone else, can't make.
and I know who I'm attracted to.
That I can't disagree with. You like women and that's cool. But this would make you a butch lesbian and not male. If you were truly male brained then you would want to blow loads of baby batter all over their faces.
When have I ever tried to give people sex advice? I've always been fairly open about the fact that I am extremely inexperienced when it comes to sex. I don't feel confused myself, but if I confuse you then sorry dude.
But you are trying to lecture people on the whole transsexual/ transgender thingy. I've looked a bit into the trangendered movement, and found it to be so vaugely ill-defined as to be essentially meaningless. Ask 50 transgendered people what it means to be transgendered, and you get 50 different answers.
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I actually "came out" as trans to some people before I'd even heard of AS. Long before 21 anyway :zoinks:
You hopped out of the closet long before me. :laugh:
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I can't know who I am until I've "been" experienced? What? Other people need to tell me what or who I am for me to know it myself?
Thanks, but I think I'm ok with knowing who I am myself :thumbup:
And yeah, transgendered is an umbrella term. It includes transsexuals, intersex people and even cross dressers. Which can make it difficult as it's hard to define. But generally, when people say transgendered, they mean anyone who doesn't identify with the sex they were assigned at birth
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I'm not sure what you mean scrap. What contradictory statements have I made?
Claiming a "male" identitiy and then claiming that you weren't interested in ever having a penis. As I've said before, you can't ever understand what it means to be male until you've experienced having a penis, AND having the desire, every second that you're awake, to shove it it in the nearest willing pussy you can find. Ask any guy here or anywhere. When you're awake, you're horny, and that's what comes with elevated testosterone levels.
I think I've been pretty consistent. I've never had sex and don't pretend to know a lot about sex for that very reason. I know who I am though,
Untill you've been experienced, that's a claim you, or anyone else, can't make.
and I know who I'm attracted to.
That I can't disagree with. You like women and that's cool. But this would make you a butch lesbian and not male. If you were truly male brained then you would want to blow loads of baby batter all over their faces.
When have I ever tried to give people sex advice? I've always been fairly open about the fact that I am extremely inexperienced when it comes to sex. I don't feel confused myself, but if I confuse you then sorry dude.
But you are trying to lecture people on the whole transsexual/ transgender thingy. I've looked a bit into the trangendered movement, and found it to be so vaugely ill-defined as to be essentially meaningless. Ask 50 transgendered people what it means to be transgendered, and you get 50 different answers.
Damn, I should be asleep, but this one is too irresistible not to answer.
Ask 50 autistic people what it means to be autistic, and......
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If you were truly male brained then you would want to blow loads of baby batter all over their faces.
:lol:
So what do you say to this Scrap. Say your dick gets cut off in a freak accident with a chainsaw. Does that immediately mean you're not a man?
Also, a period makes women "women" right? What about those who don't have a period? My period stopped for a couple of months once. Does that mean that for those few months I stopped being a girl? What about women who get menopause? Do they stop being women? :zoinks:
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I can't know who I am until I've "been" experienced? What? Other people need to tell me what or who I am for me to know it myself?
Thanks, but I think I'm ok with knowing who I am myself :thumbup:
No, you misunderstood. You need to be experienced so YOU can reflect on and absorb the experience. YOU aren't going to understand YOUR own sexuality untill YOU experience it firsthand for YOURSELF.
Would you call youself a marathon runner before you had actually run a marathon??
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Oh Scrap, just a question, can a virgin know if he/she is gay, straight or something else? I think it is possible. But that's me.
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I can't know who I am until I've "been" experienced? What? Other people need to tell me what or who I am for me to know it myself?
Thanks, but I think I'm ok with knowing who I am myself :thumbup:
No, you misunderstood. You need to be experienced so YOU can reflect on and absorb the experience. YOU aren't going to understand YOUR own sexuality untill YOU experience it firsthand for YOURSELF.
Would you call youself a marathon runner before you had actually run a marathon??
Have you had gay sex? If not, how do you know you're not gay?
Same question to everyone else on this forum :thumbup:
When you say sexuality, do you mean gender identity? Because I'm getting confused about where you're coming from here. If you actually do mean sexuality, then I don't see why I need to actually fuck someone before I can tell if I like them or not. I'm pretty certain I only like women.
If you actually meant gender identity, then I don't see how fucking is the be all and end all. My gender identity is not defined by how I have sex, and I'm cool with that.
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If you were truly male brained then you would want to blow loads of baby batter all over their faces.
:lol:
So what do you say to this Scrap. Say your dick gets cut off in a freak accident with a chainsaw. Does that immediately mean you're not a man?
Also, a period makes women "women" right? What about those who don't have a period? My period stopped for a couple of months once. Does that mean that for those few months I stopped being a girl? What about women who get menopause? Do they stop being women? :zoinks:
If he lost his balls, he wouldn't be getting testosterone. That would make him less of a man in a way. He would still be a man biologically, but he would be a eunuch technically.
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If you were truly male brained then you would want to blow loads of baby batter all over their faces.
:lol:
So what do you say to this Scrap. Say your dick gets cut off in a freak accident with a chainsaw. Does that immediately mean you're not a man?
If it's just the dick then I would be a sexually frustrated man. If the balls went too then that would mean a drop in testosterone. I'd likely loose sexual interest at that point and technicaly be a eunich.
Also, a period makes women "women" right? What about those who don't have a period? My period stopped for a couple of months once. Does that mean that for those few months I stopped being a girl? What about women who get menopause? Do they stop being women? :zoinks:
Drops in estrogen levels mean less "womanly" behavior. Less desire to mate etc...
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Damn, I should be asleep, but this one is too irresistible not to answer.
Ask 50 autistic people what it means to be autistic, and......
My whole point was that "transgendered" is too vaguely defined to be meaningfull. Hell, I'M transgendered by most definitions.
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Drops in estrogen levels mean less "womanly" behavior. Less desire to mate etc...
You need to memo my Grandma then. She's 80 and still having sex twice a week and loves it. Don't ask me why the hell she chose to tell me this (Grandma lacks a verbal filter too :laugh: ) but considering she hit menopause 40 years ago, she's doing pretty damn good at the womanly mating part. ;)
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Wow... This thread is full ignorance and bullshit.
Gender and Sex are two different things. You can continue to claim they're the same or that your physical sex determines your gender, but it's bullshit, sorry.
What is the difference between sex and gender?
Sex = male and female
Gender = masculine and feminine
So in essence:
Sex refers to biological differences; chromosomes, hormonal profiles, internal and external sex organs.
Gender describes the characteristics that a society or culture delineates as masculine or feminine.
So while your sex as male or female is a biological fact that is the same in any culture, what that sex means in terms of your gender role as a 'man' or a 'woman' in society can be quite different cross culturally. These 'gender roles' have an impact on the health of the individual.
In sociological terms 'gender role' refers to the characteristics and behaviours that different cultures attribute to the sexes. What it means to be a 'real man' in any culture requires male sex plus what our various cultures define as masculine characteristics and behaviours, likewise a 'real woman' needs female sex and feminine characteristics. To summarise:
'man' = male sex+ masculine social role
(a 'real man', 'masculine' or 'manly')
'woman' = female sex + feminine social role
(a 'real woman', 'feminine' or 'womanly')
Source (http://www.med.monash.edu.au/gendermed/sexandgender.html)
Soph (for example) identifies as masculine, the preferred masculine pronouns are "he/him/his". Yes Soph is not biologically male. But that doesn't change his preference or his identity. Questioning his identity is akin to questioning one's autism, especially so if one's autism is part of their identity.
Being transgender is simply when one's gender identity does not conform with one's sexual characteristics:
Transgender is the state of one's "gender identity" (self-identification as woman, man, or neither) not matching one's "assigned sex" (identification by others as male or female based on physical/genetic sex). "Transgender" does not imply any specific form of sexual orientation; transgender people may identify as heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, pansexual, polysexual, or asexual; some may consider conventional sexual orientation labels inadequate or inapplicable to them. The precise definition for transgender remains in flux, but includes:
* "Of, relating to, or designating a person whose identity does not conform unambiguously to conventional notions of male or female gender roles, but combines or moves between these."[1]
* "People who were assigned a sex, usually at birth and based on their genitals, but who feel that this is a false or incomplete description of themselves."[2]
* "Non-identification with, or non-presentation as, the sex (and assumed gender) one was assigned at birth."[3]
A transgender individual may have characteristics that are normally associated with a particular gender, identify elsewhere on the traditional gender continuum, or exist outside of it as "other," "agender," "Genderqueer," or "third gender". Transgender people may also identify as bigender, or along several places on either the traditional transgender continuum, or the more encompassing continuums which have been developed in response to the significantly more detailed studies done in recent years.
Source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender)
This is not a whim, most people simply don't decide to be transgender (and those that do rarely are). It's far from easy or fun... Transphobic comments, whether intended or not, really hurt.
Transphobia (or less commonly, transprejudice and trans-misogyny, the latter referring to transphobia directed toward transwomen) refers to discrimination against transsexuality and transsexual or transgender people, based on the expression of their internal gender identity (see Phobia - terms indicating prejudice or class discrimination). Whether intentional or not, transphobia can have severe consequences for the object of the negative attitude. Many transpeople also experience homophobia from people who incorrectly associate their gender identity with homosexuality.[1] Attacking someone on the basis of a perception of their gender identity rather the perception of their sexual orientation is known as "trans-bashing," as opposed to "gay bashing."
Source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transphobia)
It is really difficult to explain Transgender in a way that people who already don't agree with it will accept it. Meaning that any discussion here with so many ignorant bigots is almost an exercise in futility. To put it as simply as possible; Biological sex characteristics are irrelevant, at least in this discussion. Gender identity, the internal identification toward a gender (which may or may not be male or female) is key. A transgendered person's pronoun preference is not for fun, but because that's how they identify.
Gender is not rigid. A male, say Odeon, is not exclusively 100% Masculine, he will have many feminine qualities and behaviours. That's the way people work. Obviously his identity is masucline as such those behaviours are preferred and more obvious.
People will flow from masucline to feminine and back again, very few people have a completely rigid gender identity. As such the terms "Male" and "Female" are absurd and almost entirely meaningless. There are some very masculine female-identifying women out there and same with vice-versa. There are even people who do not identify with either "male" or "female" and prefer either a bi-gendered identity, or a non-gender identity.
This makes for a confusing and difficult to understand topic, but just because you don't understand it doesn't make it invalid or wrong.
Now, Sexuality... Well that's a whole 'nother kettle of fish. (Why would you put fish in a kettle? "Mmm, a nice brew of fish tea." Blech)
Asexual:
The definition here is in flux as more people enter the discussion as to what asexuality is. The currently accepted definition is: "Someone who does not experience sexual attraction.". Sexual attraction is different from physical attraction in that sexual attraction is the desire to have sex with the subject of attraction. Physical os aesthetic attraction is simply that you find the subject pleasing to look at, or interesting, engaging, with no sexual component at all.
Some asexuals still have and enjoy sex, but they don't experience sexual based attraction, or even the desire to have sex.
I'm asexual and I no have desire to have sex. I don't find anyone sexually attractive.
Asexuals can have romantic attraction, where they want to have a relationship (non-sexual) with someone. The romantic orientations are similar to sexual orientation, aromantic, biromantic, hetero, homo, pan and poly.
(http://asexuality.org has more info)
Bisexual:
Bisexual is when someone is sexually attracted to either Male or Female. Here the gender roles and often sexual characteristics are important, as Bi people are only attracted to Male and/or Female.
Heterosexual:
Straight. Boring. :P
Homosexual:
Attracted to people of the same gender/sex.
Pansexual:
Here's where it gets interesting. Pansexual (and same for Panromantic without sexual component) are attracted to anyone. Of any gender expression. In any form. They can form a relationship with any person, regardless of their gender.
Polysexual:
Polysexual people are similar to pan, but are attracted smaller group. Similar in someways to Bisexual, but they prefer not to be restricted to the silly definitions of male or female.
Source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_orientation)
And like gender people can have fluid sexual identities... So consistency is quite irrelevant. If someone identifies with being homosexual, but actually find some females attractive that doesn't make them any less homosexual. The preference is based on the primary attraction, or the persons' stated identification.
I hope you've learned something...But if not and you still hold to your bigot opinions it would be best if you kept them to yourselves. Commenting on something you either have little knowledge on or are unwilling to learn about is rather stupid.
Damn, I should be asleep, but this one is too irresistible not to answer.
Ask 50 autistic people what it means to be autistic, and......
My whole point was that "transgendered" is too vaguely defined to be meaningfull. Hell, I'M transgendered by most definitions.
Transgender vs. transsexual
The word transsexual, unlike the word transgender, has a precise medical definition. It was defined by Harry Benjamin in his seminal book "The Transsexual Phenomenon". In particular he defined transsexuals on a scale called the "Benjamin Scale", which defines a few different levels of intensity of transsexualism; these are listed as "Transsexual (nonsurgical)", "True Transsexual (moderate intensity)", and "True Transsexual (high intensity)". Many transsexuals believe that to be a true transsexual one needs to have a desire for surgery. [18] However, it is notable that Benjamin's moderate intensity "true transsexual" needs estrogen medication as a "substitute for or preliminary to operation." There also exist people who have had sexual reassignment surgery (SRS) but do not meet the definition of a transsexual, such as Gregory Hemingway., while other people do not desire SRS yet clearly meet Dr. Benjamin's definition of a "true transsexual". Beyond Dr. Benjamin's work, which focused on Male to Female transsexuals, there are cases of Female to Male transsexuals for whom surgery is often considered to be not practical.
Outside of the above medical definition there is a wide range of gender expressions which are contrary to the norm. Cross dressers, drag queens, transvestites, transvestic fetishist etc. It is notable that many transsexuals go through one of those self identifications before realizing that they are in fact transsexual.
Some transsexuals also take issue with the term because Charles "Virginia" Prince, the founder of the cross dressing organization Tri-Ess and coiner of the term "transgender", did so because she wished to distinguish herself from transsexual people. In "Men Who Choose to Be Women," Prince wrote "I, at least, know the difference between sex and gender and have simply elected to change the latter and not the former". There is a substantial academic literature on the difference between sex and gender, but in pragmatic English, this academic distinction is ignored and "gender" is used mostly to describe the categorical male/female difference while "sex" is used mostly to describe the physical act.[25]
There is political tension between the identities that fall under the "transgender umbrella." For example, transsexual men and women who can pay for medical treatments (or who have institutional coverage for their treatment) are likely to be concerned with medical privacy and establishing a durable legal status as men and women later in life. Extending insurance coverage for medical care is a coherent issue in the intersection of transsexuality and economic class. Most of these issues can appeal even to conservatives, if framed in terms of an unusual sort of "maintenance" of traditional notions of gender for rare people who feel the need for medical treatments. Some trans people might express this by saying "I don't challenge the gender binary, I just started out on the wrong side of it."
Source (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender#Transgender_vs._transsexual)
Transgender as stated above is often an umbrella term. Whereas Transsexual is quite specific. Genderqueer is another preferred umbrella term.
I'd be interested to know how you, Scrapheap, fit into Transgender?
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
I believe that anorexia is not a lifestyle choice. Don't know about TG but I'd suspect that it's not a lifestyle choice either.
Anorexia is largely a symptom of being middle class, 40-50 years it did not really exist very much at all. Now its in the vogue.
AIDS didn't exist 50 years ago, either. Doesn't make it a lifestyle choice.
There is a difference in the medium it traverses: one is through biology, the other through the social medium (along with TG etc).
Not according to the doc that dx'd me, a couple of years ago. She also researched anorexia and did not regard it as a lifestyle choice.
Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
Not true, again according to my doc. But maybe you know better?
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At least Soph doesn't ask me for tips on how to act NT Hadron ;)
Would you know? :zoinks:
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At least Soph doesn't ask me for tips on how to act NT Hadron ;)
Would you know? :zoinks:
Yes, cause Hadron usually asks me that ;)
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At least Soph doesn't ask me for tips on how to act NT Hadron ;)
Would you know? :zoinks:
Yes, cause Hadron usually asks me that ;)
That's why you know how to act NT? :P
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At least Soph doesn't ask me for tips on how to act NT Hadron ;)
Would you know? :zoinks:
Yes, cause Hadron usually asks me that ;)
That's why you know how to act NT? :P
I didn't say I knew how to "act NT", I meant that Hadron asks me how he can.
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I've already apologised for this thread. Nothing I can do about it now except accept the consequences.
People are different though. What bothers one person isn't necessarily gonna bother me. I wouldn't care if Sir Les had said he hopes I die. It would have bothered me even less than the OCD posts, which (while I do think they were low) didn't bother me really.
My pets are part of my family, and my family is the most important thing in my life. Sure, I reacted badly. But different things bother different people. I don't care if someone wishes me dead for example.
yeah and what les said was more hurtful than what you said. cuz it's the same as saying him he wished someone's child dies. everyone knows that's worse.
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I've already apologised for this thread. Nothing I can do about it now except accept the consequences.
People are different though. What bothers one person isn't necessarily gonna bother me. I wouldn't care if Sir Les had said he hopes I die. It would have bothered me even less than the OCD posts, which (while I do think they were low) didn't bother me really.
My pets are part of my family, and my family is the most important thing in my life. Sure, I reacted badly. But different things bother different people. I don't care if someone wishes me dead for example.
yeah and what les said was more hurtful than what you said. cuz it's the same as saying him he wished someone's child dies. everyone knows that's worse.
Pets are not children and anyone who thinks that is a fucking moron and it's an insult to those who have actual children. If you have children and still think your pets are children, that's an insult to your actual children.
Move along.
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shithead. you can love animals as much or more as stupid human podlings.
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I've already apologised for this thread. Nothing I can do about it now except accept the consequences.
People are different though. What bothers one person isn't necessarily gonna bother me. I wouldn't care if Sir Les had said he hopes I die. It would have bothered me even less than the OCD posts, which (while I do think they were low) didn't bother me really.
My pets are part of my family, and my family is the most important thing in my life. Sure, I reacted badly. But different things bother different people. I don't care if someone wishes me dead for example.
yeah and what les said was more hurtful than what you said. cuz it's the same as saying him he wished someone's child dies. everyone knows that's worse.
Pets are not children and anyone who thinks that is a fucking moron and it's an insult to those who have actual children. If you have children and still think your pets are children, that's an insult to your actual children.
Move along.
For some people pets are almost like children. Obviously it's not the same, but they can have such a great love for their pets that can be akin to the love for a child.
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For those who don't have actual children, you really aren't qualified to answer in that way.
I've had pets die recently and sure it sucked, but if one of my kids died, I'd be a complete mess for many years.
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For those who don't have actual children, you really aren't qualified to answer in that way.
I understand your point, but some people do have a emotional attachment to their pets that is akin to one's parents share with children. And I suppose child-less people not being qualified to answer, would mean that those no transgender aren't qualified to speak on that.
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For those who don't have actual children, you really aren't qualified to answer in that way.
I understand your point, but some people do have a emotional attachment to their pets that is akin to one's parents share with children. And I suppose child-less people not being qualified to answer, would mean that those no transgender aren't qualified to speak on that.
You talk about your transgendered issues every time there seems to be an arguement over it here, how many times have you talked about how your issues upset Ren and your marriage?
The thing is, I've been a person without kids and with kids, and I can tell you, beforehand you have no idea what it is like to have children and the love you have for them. It's a completely new experience that you can't even imagine beforehand.
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You talk about your transgendered issues every time there seems to be an arguement over it here, how many times have you talked about how your issues upset Ren and your marriage?
I didn't speak about "my issues" at all this time. And my and renaeden have spoken many times, as recent as last night, about these issues and how it affects our relationship...Which frankly is no one's business, and that's all I'll say on that matter.
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You talk about your transgendered issues every time there seems to be an arguement over it here, how many times have you talked about how your issues upset Ren and your marriage?
I didn't speak about "my issues" at all this time. And my and renaeden have spoken many times, as recent as last night, about these issues and how it affects our relationship...Which frankly is no one's business, and that's all I'll say on that matter.
I think it's an important issue and tied into your trangenderness is how you effect those around you especially the ones that love you.
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Soph (for example) identifies as masculine, the preferred masculine pronouns are "he/him/his". Yes Soph is not biologically male. But that doesn't change his preference or his identity. Questioning his identity is akin to questioning one's autism, especially so if one's autism is part of their identity.
And if Soph was injured in an accident and unconscious with no ID she would be identified as a woman by Hospital personnel. You and her can't change the XX or XY chromosones even with surgery and hormones.
Being transgender is simply when one's gender identity does not conform with one's sexual characteristics:
Transgender is the state of one's "gender identity" (self-identification as woman, man, or neither) not matching one's "assigned sex" (identification by others as male or female based on physical/genetic sex). "Transgender" does not imply any specific form of sexual orientation; transgender people may identify as heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, pansexual, polysexual, or asexual; some may consider conventional sexual orientation labels inadequate or inapplicable to them. The precise definition for transgender remains in flux, but includes:
In other words even the TG/TS, LGBT and BLT communities can't agree what is what?
This is not a whim, most people simply don't decide to be transgender (and those that do rarely are). It's far from easy or fun... Transphobic comments, whether intended or not, really hurt.
Sometimes life is tough. I am not going to refrain from laughing at the scene in the NY bar in Crocodile Dundee because some trans doesn't like it. There are too fucking many do gooder advocacy groups running around looking for things to be offended by for me to care to keep up with it.
As such the terms "Male" and "Female" are absurd and almost entirely meaningless.
Just because you would like that to be true dioes not make it so. Sell that to the National Organization for Women if you are that bold.
Heterosexual:
Straight. Boring. :P
To you it is, some people like being that way.
Homosexual:
Attracted to people of the same gender/sex.
How is this not as equally boring as being Heterosexual is to an Asexual like you?
Pansexual:
Here's where it gets interesting. Pansexual (and same for Panromantic without sexual component) are attracted to anyone. Of any gender expression. In any form. They can form a relationship with any person, animal or whatever else regardless of their gender.
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_meaning_of_the_prefix_pan (http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_meaning_of_the_prefix_pan)I hope you've learned something...But if not and you still hold to your bigot opinions it would be best if you kept them to yourselves.
Fuck off you self righteous cunt. :finger: Start your own internet forum and you can restrict any expression you don't like.
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I think it's an important issue and tied into your trangenderness is how you effect those around you especially the ones that love you.
Yes, but it's not an issue I'm obliged to discuss in public.
Soph (for example) identifies as masculine, the preferred masculine pronouns are "he/him/his". Yes Soph is not biologically male. But that doesn't change his preference or his identity. Questioning his identity is akin to questioning one's autism, especially so if one's autism is part of their identity.
And if Soph was injured in an accident and unconscious with no ID she would be identified as a woman by Hospital personnel. You and her can't change the XX or XY chromosones even with surgery and hormones.
Ok. Sure. Chromosomes determine your sex/gender. You can go with that argument if you like. But you'll find yourself short when encountering an intersex person... A biological woman with XY chromosomes, for example. Or say an XXY person...
Being transgender is simply when one's gender identity does not conform with one's sexual characteristics:
Transgender is the state of one's "gender identity" (self-identification as woman, man, or neither) not matching one's "assigned sex" (identification by others as male or female based on physical/genetic sex). "Transgender" does not imply any specific form of sexual orientation; transgender people may identify as heterosexual, homosexual, bisexual, pansexual, polysexual, or asexual; some may consider conventional sexual orientation labels inadequate or inapplicable to them. The precise definition for transgender remains in flux, but includes:
In other words even the TG/TS, LGBT and BLT communities can't agree what is what?
DSG is a better term; Diverse Sexuality And Gender. But yes, everyone has their own specific definition. But same would be for almost every label-based community. Even autism.
This is not a whim, most people simply don't decide to be transgender (and those that do rarely are). It's far from easy or fun... Transphobic comments, whether intended or not, really hurt.
Sometimes life is tough. I am not going to refrain from laughing at the scene in the NY bar in Crocodile Dundee because some trans doesn't like it. There are too fucking many do gooder advocacy groups running around looking for things to be offended by for me to care to keep up with it.
That's your choice. I just hope, for your sake, you're not too surprised when someone knocks your block off.
As such the terms "Male" and "Female" are absurd and almost entirely meaningless.
Just because you would like that to be true dioes not make it so. Sell that to the National Organization for Women if you are that bold.
And just because you believe it not to be so doesn't mean it isn't. The way we view the world is a sum of perceptions.
And I'd gladly sell it to any organistion. And NOW, being a feminist organisation would likely gladly buy it. Gender roles are the biggest issues facing feminists. Gender roles that assume that women are soft and emotional, whilst men are hard and stoic. Women stay in the kitchen whilst men go to work (subverted in now days). Women can't serve as a front line soldier. Gender roles stifle expression and individuality.
Heterosexual:
Straight. Boring. :P
To you it is, some people like being that way.
The ' :P ' generally means I was joking. I don't really think being straight is boring. But it's not as interesting as the way sexualities, to me anyway.
Homosexual:
Attracted to people of the same gender/sex.
How is this not as equally boring as being Heterosexual is to an Asexual like you?
It's different. And difficult to be accepted in society (more so now days than some years ago), which makes it more interesting to me.
Pansexual:
Here's where it gets interesting. Pansexual (and same for Panromantic without sexual component) are attracted to anyone. Of any gender expression. In any form. They can form a relationship with any person, animal or whatever else regardless of their gender.
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_meaning_of_the_prefix_pan (http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_meaning_of_the_prefix_pan)
So you're agreeing with me?
http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_meaning_of_the_prefix_pan
I hope you've learned something...But if not and you still hold to your bigot opinions it would be best if you kept them to yourselves.
Fuck off you self righteous cunt. :finger: Start your own internet forum and you can restrict any expression you don't like.[/quote]
So you admit to being a bigot?
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Ok. Sure. Chromosomes determine your sex/gender. You can go with that argument if you like. But you'll find yourself short when encountering an intersex person... A biological woman with XY chromosomes, for example. Or say an XXY person...
Intersex conditions aren't as uncommon as people might assume. About 1% of births are intersex to some degree. Sure that seems like a small number but, for example, say you've got a small city with 250,000 people. Of those people, 2,500 are going to be intersex in some way.
There's a condition called Androgen Insensitivity Syndrome. It occurs about 1 in 20,000. In this set of disorders mutations of the gene encoding on the androgen receptors prevent the XY fetus from beginning development as a male, and thus the body continues to develop as a female. The AIS may not be discovered until much later in life, such as when trying to conceive a child.
An CAIS (complete AIS) female is still a female despite Her XY chromosomes and undescended testicles, and may still identify as female despite learning of her AIS condition.
According to PPK any CAIS woman is a man, despite her physical appearance. And yet he struggles to see someone like Soph as a male despite his physical appearence. Nice going hypocrite.
(which would make me, a hypocrite, a hypocrite for calling him a hypocrite, but I'm a hypocrite, so it's ok.. :P )
Gender is not as simple as looking down one's pants or checking the chromosomes as the CAIS cases clearly illustrate.
Millions of people compete in sport every year. And thousands of new athletes coming up to the professional stage every year. 1% of 1 million is 100,000. 1% of 1000, is 10. So every year there's at least athletes that are in some way intersex. Many, if not all, sports bodies have some of sort of gender testing, which as I said, isn't as simple as looking down one's pants.
For example; Caster Semenya was one such young athlete. But her gender testing seems to indicate that she is AIS or CAIS. But does that mean she's not allowed to compete? Not even IAAF knows for sure.
The ministry did not say if she would be allowed to compete as a woman but they did note that the IAAF's threshold for when a female is considered ineligible to compete as a woman is unclear.
And someone like Jim Sincalir (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Sinclair_%28activist%29), an autism activist, is intersex. Raised as a girl, Jim now identifies as neuter. Neither gender.
Gender Identity is even more complex than gender testing... And is an almost wholly personal thing.
I really can't give me own insight on this topic, as I'm really still learning.
Perhaps these Wiki pages will be of use in your education:
Gender Identity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_identity)
Gender Verification in Sports (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_verification_in_sports)
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
I am sure Amanda Baggs would throw me that line too. The difference is, because of my own choices, I am very likely to have a nice job and life 5 years from now. Where are you? Where are you going to be? That is what you should be seriously thinking about, not friviloties such as reineventing your sexuality.
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
I believe that anorexia is not a lifestyle choice. Don't know about TG but I'd suspect that it's not a lifestyle choice either.
Anorexia is largely a symptom of being middle class, 40-50 years it did not really exist very much at all. Now its in the vogue.
AIDS didn't exist 50 years ago, either. Doesn't make it a lifestyle choice.
There is a difference in the medium it traverses: one is through biology, the other through the social medium (along with TG etc).
Not according to the doc that dx'd me, a couple of years ago. She also researched anorexia and did not regard it as a lifestyle choice.
Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
Not true, again according to my doc. But maybe you know better?
Then explain how people recover from Anorexia - it is perfectly treatable and over time curable.
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
I am sure Amanda Baggs would throw me that line too. The difference is, because of my own choices, I am very likely to have a nice job and life 5 years from now. Where are you? Where are you going to be? That is what you should be seriously thinking about, not friviloties such as reineventing your sexuality.
The need to work, to have a job is a western construct. The correlation between having a job and having a life is spurious at best. A life is what you make. If Soph feels he has a life then so he does. I believe you were one who once called me arrogant, or self-righteous (as PPK just did) and yet here you are, acting the Mr High and Mighty decreeing that Soph has no life, whilst you are soon to acquire one. Well good luck with the 5 year plan. In the mean time, Soph, and myself will be enjoying our lives, in the way we see fit.
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I can't know who I am until I've "been" experienced? What? Other people need to tell me what or who I am for me to know it myself?
Thanks, but I think I'm ok with knowing who I am myself :thumbup:
No, you misunderstood. You need to be experienced so YOU can reflect on and absorb the experience. YOU aren't going to understand YOUR own sexuality untill YOU experience it firsthand for YOURSELF.
Would you call youself a marathon runner before you had actually run a marathon??
Have you had gay sex? If not, how do you know you're not gay?
Same question to everyone else on this forum :thumbup:
When you say sexuality, do you mean gender identity? Because I'm getting confused about where you're coming from here. If you actually do mean sexuality, then I don't see why I need to actually fuck someone before I can tell if I like them or not. I'm pretty certain I only like women.
If you actually meant gender identity, then I don't see how fucking is the be all and end all. My gender identity is not defined by how I have sex, and I'm cool with that.
Why someone sane would shove their cock up someones arse and get gratification for it. Personally myself and others here would not rather try out that experiment.
All this TG / whatever is a lifestyle choice, just like going to church. Some people are naive and get sucked in, just as ever.
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All this TG / whatever is a lifestyle choice, just like going to church. Some people are naive and get sucked in, just as ever.
For most TG is as much as a lifestyle choice as Autism, or Downs Syndrome. People are born with it. Gender Identity Disorder often manifests around early puberty, but sometimes much early.
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OK you all seem to have had a say on the heart attack thing and the transgender thing and what have you.
Here is where I stand on things.
The heart attack thing? Not bothered. Yup I had one 18 mths ago. Scary as hell at the time and was unwell for a good while and have bounced back. I am not sensitive about it and I don't feel that in the scheme of the fight it was a lowblow or hurtful or whatever. No real issue with it.
The transgender thing? As far as I am aware Soph is not uncomfortable with his gender and as much as I saw it pissed him off me flaming him over it I do not think he will be crying over it. Were my comments nice? Nope. They weren't meant to be. That said it rates in my book to have the same effect as calling a straight person gay or a man a girl or similarly derisive comments. In themselves pretty incorrect and without force. Sure you can dress them up with clever turns of phrase or nastiness but the underlying concept is at it's base pretty weak. The "power" is in the way the insult is received. Breaking it down to base tacks. If Soph is comfortable with his gender it really doesn't matter. Want confirmation? Pick a fight with someone who is completely comfortable with who they are and dress a similar insult about their neurotype, their sexuality or their gender. See the reaction. Now try the same thing with someone who isn't. The reaction is different the insult the same. The insult as a concept is a weak one. You are something we know you aren't nyuk, nyuk, nyuk. Pretty weak. Certainly not worth the drama or the cries of outrage.
The Paedophile thing? Again I thought in the scheme of things such a comment was in line with what was being thrown around. I was not bothered by it. Am I a Paedophile? No. Do I think I have to justify my position as not being a paedophile? No. Was it a terrible affront? No.
The OCD thing. Raise hands all those on the Spectrum. Keep hands raised all those with weird and embarrassing co-morbids. If you could look at all those in Intensity with hands raised you would see plenty of us spazzes with shitty special talents including Dyslexia, Epilespy, Anxiety Disorders, Depression, Social Aversion and people so wound up with trying desperately to keep some control and routine in their life that the stupidest of things get them melting down, talking to themselves or stimming. What a bunch of retards! That is us. For the most part. (OK Bint gets a pass on this but the point ought to be made). Calling Soph out over this is like a one legged man boasting to another one-legged man how fast they can run and how slow the other is in comparison or maybe how much more sexier their stump is. I may be wrong in how I view this but that is my value judgment.
The my Father being an Alcoholic? So what? He was and I am not going to cry about it. Many people have grown up with angry Alcoholic Dads. Hell I am not an Alcoholic and my kids are not subjected to that. Why then do I care? Shit I think again in the terms of the fight it was a reasonable exchange.
Lily the Dog? Star of much DogSpam? Ok I was more than a little pissed of with constant Lily spam. I am not an animal person and I honestly don't get this bonding to these creatures. I again am not cruel or hostile to them but don't understand why anyone would take a pet knowing it has a short life and thrown emotion and love and bonding and seeing it deteriorate in such a period of time and cope with grief. It makes no sense to me. In my mind it is obviously something a pet owner takes on knowing and is happy accepting and reminding them of this fundamental truth (which, morbid and in bad taste) is not a damning horror. Again that is my take. If I have completely misread this and it is actually more than just mere bad taste and morbidity then any affronted individuals have my apologies.
I think that pretty much covers most of the bases as I see it.
I have no real issue with the shots taken at me nor the ones I dished out. I do have misgivings that it has spread around the board as it has and would have preferred it to have stayed on Zomgaspies. But that was taken out of my hands. I would have preferred if it had have been dropped with my Pm back to Bint. That did not happen. I would have preferred it to have been addressed shortly after by the existing callout. That too did not happen.
I don't see any victims in Bint or me or Soph. I do see that the board has put up with this crap and without the benefit of eye bleach and with the people such as Tiger Girl, Odeon, PPK and Phex caught in the crossfire I do see victims this sits badly with me and this too I apologise for.
As for walking away? I just don't believe in it and I am sure to most of you that seems an immature response or nasty or whatever. If life has taught me nothing else (which many will probably throw your weight behind as a notion :P ) it has taught me to fight and hold my ground. Not to let others dictate my outcomes or to reinforce the belief that others can get away with doing the wrong thing. That includes an idea that if someone can maintain a holding pattern long enough they don't have to resolve an issue they just have to hold out long enough for others to "walk away" and be "better people". I think it is bullshit.
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The transgender thing? As far as I am aware Soph is not uncomfortable with his gender and as much as I saw it pissed him off me flaming him over it I do not think he will be crying over it. Were my comments nice? Nope. They weren't meant to be. That said it rates in my book to have the same effect as calling a straight person gay or a man a girl or similarly derisive comments. In themselves pretty incorrect and without force. Sure you can dress them up with clever turns of phrase or nastiness but the underlying concept is at it's base pretty weak. The "power" is in the way the insult is received. Breaking it down to base tacks. If Soph is comfortable with his gender it really doesn't matter. Want confirmation? Pick a fight with someone who is completely comfortable with who they are and dress a similar insult about their neurotype, their sexuality or their gender. See the reaction. Now try the same thing with someone who isn't. The reaction is different the insult the same. The insult as a concept is a weak one. You are something we know you aren't nyuk, nyuk, nyuk. Pretty weak. Certainly not worth the drama or the cries of outrage.
You make a very good point.
But I think for many it's the misconceptions, ignorance and bigotry from others, not yourself, that has sparked this discussion.
The OCD thing. Raise hands all those on the Spectrum. Keep hands raised all those with weird and embarrassing co-morbids. If you could look at all those in Intensity with hands raised you would see plenty of us spazzes with shitty special talents including Dyslexia, Epilespy, Anxiety Disorders, Depression, Social Aversion and people so wound up with trying desperately to keep some control and routine in their life that the stupidest of things get them melting down, talking to themselves or stimming. What a bunch of retards! That is us. For the most part. (OK Bint gets a pass on this but the point ought to be made). Calling Soph out over this is like a one legged man boasting to another one-legged man how fast they can run and how slow the other is in comparison or maybe how much more sexier their stump is. I may be wrong in how I view this but that is my value judgment.
Pot. Kettle. Black, in other words?
As for walking away? I just don't believe in it and I am sure to most of you that seems an immature response or nasty or whatever. If life has taught me nothing else (which many will probably throw your weight behind as a notion :P ) it has taught me to fight and hold my ground. Not to let others dictate my outcomes or to reinforce the belief that others can get away with doing the wrong thing. That includes an idea that if someone can maintain a holding pattern long enough they don't have to resolve an issue they just have to hold out long enough for others to "walk away" and be "better people". I think it is bullshit.
This is a problem. Having equally stubborn people who are arguing on a forum can literally destroy that forum... Though as renaeden said somewhere, this has certainly increased the number of people and posts on the site for a short while. Controversy'll do that.
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At least Soph doesn't ask me for tips on how to act NT Hadron ;)
Would you know? :zoinks:
Yes, cause Hadron usually asks me that ;)
That's why you know how to act NT? :P
I didn't say I knew how to "act NT", I meant that Hadron asks me how he can.
I got that. It was an attempt at a joke. Never mind.
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For those who don't have actual children, you really aren't qualified to answer in that way.
I've had pets die recently and sure it sucked, but if one of my kids died, I'd be a complete mess for many years.
QFT
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Pot calling kettle back? Yup. But they got a reaction. That was what I was aiming for.
As for the death of the forum? Again I don't like how this has gone but yeah it has increased activity from just before I came back and Odeon was suggesting shutting this place down for lack of activity. It also will not destroy the forum. I think it has and will spill bad blood and make some strange bondings. In the end Intensity will be Intensity and we all begrudgingly get over this like we did with the Ahayes drama, The Cal drama, The Robert N drama and so on. Is that good or bad I dunno. I would not like this to have gone the way it has as I say but I don't think it is a terminal wound
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The transgendered bashing is making you guys sound like a bunch of fucking assholes. You don't have any idea what it is to be TG. I've spent a lot of years working in the LGBT community and have seen the struggles people go through. Soph is very secure in his sexuality and he sure as hell can fight his own battles. But this is a topic near and dear to my heart. I don't appreciate being bashed for my bi-sexuality and I can't stand by and see someone else who comes from the same community get bashed for where they fall on the sexual spectrum. And to think these comments come from people I have respect for.
You could make an identical argument about Anorexia, if you want to see the big flaws in your "logic".
TG is just another cop out for people with AS (and others) who are not brave enough to stand for who they actually are. Just like religion and a mulititude of other self-righteous ideologies.
it doesn't have to be, hadron. The problem arises when it is *used* as a cop-out, either by the person herself or somebody near her, but then, a multitude of conditions (from AS to TG to anorexia, etc) can be used for that same purpose.
I have no idea what it is like to be TG but it seems to me that Soph is not using it as a cop-out; if anything, she seems to be fairly secure in whatever she is. Bint, on the other hand, seems to be less confident and my guess is that it's why she resorts to posting all those pics.
No the difference between Anorexia (asides it being bad for you - though some girls beg to differ) and TG/ whatever is that AS is not a lifestyle choice or mental illness. By endorsing all these non-conditions then we completely undermine our own actual cause.
I believe that anorexia is not a lifestyle choice. Don't know about TG but I'd suspect that it's not a lifestyle choice either.
Anorexia is largely a symptom of being middle class, 40-50 years it did not really exist very much at all. Now its in the vogue.
AIDS didn't exist 50 years ago, either. Doesn't make it a lifestyle choice.
There is a difference in the medium it traverses: one is through biology, the other through the social medium (along with TG etc).
Not according to the doc that dx'd me, a couple of years ago. She also researched anorexia and did not regard it as a lifestyle choice.
Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
Not true, again according to my doc. But maybe you know better?
Then explain how people recover from Anorexia - it is perfectly treatable and over time curable.
Google is your friend. I'm not the expert here--my doc is--but I have heard enough to know that anorexia is not a lifestyle choice for lots of people out there. And it is treatable but not necessarily curable.
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All this TG / whatever is a lifestyle choice, just like going to church. Some people are naive and get sucked in, just as ever.
For most TG is as much as a lifestyle choice as Autism, or Downs Syndrome. People are born with it. Gender Identity Disorder often manifests around early puberty, but sometimes much early.
Please - stop undermining actual causes. Lots of people with AS deciding that they are sexually confused helps us all how?
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Someone give Hadron a tinfoil hat plz.
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:tinfoil:
No, I'm keeping mine...
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All this TG / whatever is a lifestyle choice, just like going to church. Some people are naive and get sucked in, just as ever.
For most TG is as much as a lifestyle choice as Autism, or Downs Syndrome. People are born with it. Gender Identity Disorder often manifests around early puberty, but sometimes much early.
Please - stop undermining actual causes. Lots of people with AS deciding that they are sexually confused helps us all how?
Actual causes?
And what makes you think they decide they're sexually confused? If sexuality were an easy choice surely the vast, VAST, majority would choose to be straight, it's easier that way, society is more accepting or such things. But sexuality isn't a choice, any more than the hair colour you're born with is. There is mountains of evidence to confirm this going back as far as the early 1960s. Perhaps even early if you look outside Western culture.
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
I am sure Amanda Baggs would throw me that line too. The difference is, because of my own choices, I am very likely to have a nice job and life 5 years from now. Where are you? Where are you going to be? That is what you should be seriously thinking about, not friviloties such as reineventing your sexuality.
The need to work, to have a job is a western construct. The correlation between having a job and having a life is spurious at best. A life is what you make. If Soph feels he has a life then so he does. I believe you were one who once called me arrogant, or self-righteous (as PPK just did) and yet here you are, acting the Mr High and Mighty decreeing that Soph has no life, whilst you are soon to acquire one. Well good luck with the 5 year plan. In the mean time, Soph, and myself will be enjoying our lives, in the way we see fit.
Sounds like you are both well on the path to long term happiness. What you have both done is nothing at all to be proud of. If you want to isolate yourselves, develop some lifeskills and move to Alaska.
Where as both of your 5-year plans sound to me like a "career on benefits", which sounds fantastically boring to me. Imagine if everyone to do that. We all should contribute a little at least, if we can.
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All this TG / whatever is a lifestyle choice, just like going to church. Some people are naive and get sucked in, just as ever.
For most TG is as much as a lifestyle choice as Autism, or Downs Syndrome. People are born with it. Gender Identity Disorder often manifests around early puberty, but sometimes much early.
Please - stop undermining actual causes. Lots of people with AS deciding that they are sexually confused helps us all how?
Actual causes?
And what makes you think they decide they're sexually confused? If sexuality were an easy choice surely the vast, VAST, majority would choose to be straight, it's easier that way, society is more accepting or such things. But sexuality isn't a choice, any more than the hair colour you're born with is. There is mountains of evidence to confirm this going back as far as the early 1960s. Perhaps even early if you look outside Western culture.
Yeah sure there is, when someone decided that we would add sexual identity confusion onto the list of damaging lifestyle choices, along with all the ones already there. It is rare that some group of people are so arrogant as to be proud of doing so, though.
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
I am sure Amanda Baggs would throw me that line too. The difference is, because of my own choices, I am very likely to have a nice job and life 5 years from now. Where are you? Where are you going to be? That is what you should be seriously thinking about, not friviloties such as reineventing your sexuality.
The need to work, to have a job is a western construct. The correlation between having a job and having a life is spurious at best. A life is what you make. If Soph feels he has a life then so he does. I believe you were one who once called me arrogant, or self-righteous (as PPK just did) and yet here you are, acting the Mr High and Mighty decreeing that Soph has no life, whilst you are soon to acquire one. Well good luck with the 5 year plan. In the mean time, Soph, and myself will be enjoying our lives, in the way we see fit.
Sounds like you are both well on the path to long term happiness. What you have both done is nothing at all to be proud of. If you want to isolate yourselves, develop some lifeskills and move to Alaska.
Where as both of your 5-year plans sound to me like a "career on benefits", which sounds fantastically boring to me. Imagine if everyone to do that. We all should contribute a little at least, if we can.
LOL, you have no idea what my or Soph's plans are.
I don't how you think we're isolating ourselves. I've made more friends following my interests and instincts than I ever following what society tells me to. I'd wager that I have more life skills than you'll ever have.
Career on Benefits... pfft, LOL! Fantastically Boring is subjective. Thus only applies to you. Not to I or Soph, or indeed anyone else. Considering the amount of time I put in volunteering my skills to various people, I suppose if everyone did as I do it'd turn out alright.
How about you actually learn about something or ask questions before you go off and attack what you don't understand.
All this TG / whatever is a lifestyle choice, just like going to church. Some people are naive and get sucked in, just as ever.
For most TG is as much as a lifestyle choice as Autism, or Downs Syndrome. People are born with it. Gender Identity Disorder often manifests around early puberty, but sometimes much early.
Please - stop undermining actual causes. Lots of people with AS deciding that they are sexually confused helps us all how?
Actual causes?
And what makes you think they decide they're sexually confused? If sexuality were an easy choice surely the vast, VAST, majority would choose to be straight, it's easier that way, society is more accepting or such things. But sexuality isn't a choice, any more than the hair colour you're born with is. There is mountains of evidence to confirm this going back as far as the early 1960s. Perhaps even early if you look outside Western culture.
Yeah sure there is, when someone decided that we would add sexual identity confusion onto the list of damaging lifestyle choices, along with all the ones already there. It is rare that some group of people are so arrogant as to be proud of doing so, though.
Being Gay: A Life Style Choice? (http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?type=doc&id=28531&cn=55)
Damaging? In what context? And you didn't answer my question: what do you mean by actual causes?
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:tinfoil:
No, I'm keeping mine...
13 pages of flying bullshit and you pop in with an awesome oneliner. Made me laugh so hard I cried. :plus:
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Why someone sane would shove their cock up someones arse and get gratification for it. Personally myself and others here would not rather try out that experiment.
What does anal sex have to do with anything? Anal sex is not a strictly gay thing you know.
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This is not a whim, most people simply don't decide to be transgender (and those that do rarely are). It's far from easy or fun... Transphobic comments, whether intended or not, really hurt.
Sometimes life is tough. I am not going to refrain from laughing at the scene in the NY bar in Crocodile Dundee because some trans doesn't like it. There are too fucking many do gooder advocacy groups running around looking for things to be offended by for me to care to keep up with it.
That's your choice. I just hope, for your sake, you're not too surprised when someone knocks your block off.
Let a motherfucker try. I have won and I have lost including two broken ribs in one fight and a minor stab wound in my thigh another time. If some POS wants to initiate violent shit with me that person should be preapared when I ratchet things up a few notches.
I hope you've learned something...But if not and you still hold to your bigot opinions it would be best if you kept them to yourselves.
Fuck off you self righteous cunt. :finger: Start your own internet forum and you can restrict any expression you don't like.
So you admit to being a bigot?
No I do not, and I don't particularly care if you choose to view me in that light. It is more a matter of you recomending that anyone disagreeing with you keep their mouths shut that I take issue with. I do have freedom of speech whether you fucking like it or not. As for the definition of pansexual posted above I believe a more correct definition would include sex, or the desire for sex, with the non human portion of the animal kingdom, plants and any other way someone could dream up to get their jollies.r
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So you admit to being a bigot?
No I do not, and I don't particularly care if you choose to view me in that light. It is more a matter of you recomending that anyone disagreeing with you keep their mouths shut that I take issue with. I do have freedom of speech whether you fucking like it or not. As for the definition of pansexual posted above I believe a more correct definition would include sex, or the desire for sex, with the non human portion of the animal kingdom, plants and any other way someone could dream up to get their jollies.r
I didn't say those who disagree with me should shut it. I said that those unwilling to learn other viewpoints before making a decision should.
Pansexual does not include animals, as much as you might want it to. Hate to break it you, but some words don't mean what they seem to mean, the way of the cobbled together english language.
Sexual orientation is about who a human being views other human beings in light of sex. Pansexuality in that context simply means able, or desiring to have sex with any human.
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::)
No one cares Shleed, piss off.
You cared enough to say that, and people cared enough to +1 me. :orly:
Now then, drama over or what? Might have some more fun tonight.
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I think I may want the hour of my life back I wasted reading this thread.
Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on. So don't try saying I can cure my own asperger's if I'm 'strong' enough because that's totally a different thing. Really. I'm not being a hypocritical douche at all, here.
Fixed.
Where is the fundamental difference in a female imagining they have a penis compared to imagining they do not need to eat?
I dunno, but I think that the middle of that venn diagram would have some skinny-ass lesbians and/or women who have been married awhile in the middle of it.
Also, a period makes women "women" right?
Personally, I thought periods made women miserable several days out of every month.
I'd hardly call criticism of Soph's sexual orientation "bashing" since she has made several contradictory statements regarging her orientation AND a complete lack of sexual experience. Soph is a confused little split-tail who needs to get laid about 100 times or so before she starts lecturing people on complex sexual issues.
Would you take advice on sex from a nun or a priest who had never been laid?? I didn't think so.
So is 100 times the minimum before you can be certain of your sexual orientation, scrap, or is that just a rough estimate? Also, how does one have to distribute one's sexual partners through those 100 times? Should there be a 50/50 split between sexual experiences with men and sexual experiences with women? And, how are we defining sex, here? If one has had oral sex 100 times, does one have the ability to understand one's sexual identity, or does there need to be actual vaginal or anal penetration (depending which is applicable/possible)? I'm quite intruigued.
She will never know what it's like to have a dick, and spend every waking moment of your life, searching for a hole to stick it in. That's what it means to be male.
Thanks for the succinct definition of the male experience. In your opinion, when men stop compulsively pussy-chasing in exhange for other pursiuts (ranging from careers to video games to drugs), do they become female, or just cease to become male?
Claiming a "male" identitiy and then claiming that you weren't interested in ever having a penis. As I've said before, you can't ever understand what it means to be male until you've experienced having a penis, AND having the desire, every second that you're awake, to shove it it in the nearest willing pussy you can find. Ask any guy here or anywhere. When you're awake, you're horny, and that's what comes with elevated testosterone levels.
[...]
If you were truly male brained then you would want to blow loads of baby batter all over their faces.
...wait, I thought men wanted to put their cocks in holes, not ejaculate onto faces. Does it have to be both, or is one sufficient in order to be considered male?
Drops in estrogen levels mean less "womanly" behavior. Less desire to mate etc...
But I thought that horniness was a man-thing? I'm so confused now.
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Are you still having a hissy fit coz we gheyed you, PPK? :beer:
What's with the Brandon Teena comments btw? That the best you can come up with?
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
I am sure Amanda Baggs would throw me that line too. The difference is, because of my own choices, I am very likely to have a nice job and life 5 years from now. Where are you? Where are you going to be? That is what you should be seriously thinking about, not friviloties such as reineventing your sexuality.
The need to work, to have a job is a western construct. The correlation between having a job and having a life is spurious at best. A life is what you make. If Soph feels he has a life then so he does. I believe you were one who once called me arrogant, or self-righteous (as PPK just did) and yet here you are, acting the Mr High and Mighty decreeing that Soph has no life, whilst you are soon to acquire one. Well good luck with the 5 year plan. In the mean time, Soph, and myself will be enjoying our lives, in the way we see fit.
Sounds like you are both well on the path to long term happiness. What you have both done is nothing at all to be proud of. If you want to isolate yourselves, develop some lifeskills and move to Alaska.
Where as both of your 5-year plans sound to me like a "career on benefits", which sounds fantastically boring to me. Imagine if everyone to do that. We all should contribute a little at least, if we can.
LOL, you have no idea what my or Soph's plans are.
Your recent thread tells me enough. But Soph's career plans are particularly ridiculous, how can someone at MMU without having added anything else to their degree think they have much of a chance in todays job market is beyond me. Unless she is going to get given a job by accident/ nepotism, she has no chance whatsoever. That is just reality.
I don't how you think we're isolating ourselves. I've made more friends following my interests and instincts than I ever following what society tells me to. I'd wager that I have more life skills than you'll ever have.
Career on Benefits... pfft, LOL! Fantastically Boring is subjective. Thus only applies to you. Not to I or Soph, or indeed anyone else. Considering the amount of time I put in volunteering my skills to various people, I suppose if everyone did as I do it'd turn out alright.
[/quote]
If you live in some sort of communist commune then that sort of behaviour is OK. In the rest of the world it is not however. As for life skills, lets just say that I am one of the 3% of people who manage to live fully independantly - I assure you that I am fine.
How about you actually learn about something or ask questions before you go off and attack what you don't understand.
I know more than enough - there is nothing to learn about TG. Pretty much exactly the same as with how I can defeat a bible basher without being able to quote the Bible verse by verse.
All this TG / whatever is a lifestyle choice, just like going to church. Some people are naive and get sucked in, just as ever.
For most TG is as much as a lifestyle choice as Autism, or Downs Syndrome. People are born with it. Gender Identity Disorder often manifests around early puberty, but sometimes much early.
Please - stop undermining actual causes. Lots of people with AS deciding that they are sexually confused helps us all how?
Actual causes?
And what makes you think they decide they're sexually confused? If sexuality were an easy choice surely the vast, VAST, majority would choose to be straight, it's easier that way, society is more accepting or such things. But sexuality isn't a choice, any more than the hair colour you're born with is. There is mountains of evidence to confirm this going back as far as the early 1960s. Perhaps even early if you look outside Western culture.
Yeah sure there is, when someone decided that we would add sexual identity confusion onto the list of damaging lifestyle choices, along with all the ones already there. It is rare that some group of people are so arrogant as to be proud of doing so, though.
Being Gay: A Life Style Choice? (http://www.mentalhelp.net/poc/view_doc.php?type=doc&id=28531&cn=55)
Damaging? In what context? And you didn't answer my question: what do you mean by actual causes?
I would have thought the answer was obvious - how do clowns like yourself and Soph running around revelling in some self made pariah status help those with AS who actually want some sort of meaningful life. Please explain.
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I think I may want the hour of my life back I wasted reading this thread.
Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on. So don't try saying I can cure my own asperger's if I'm 'strong' enough because that's totally a different thing. Really. I'm not being a hypocritical douche at all, here.
Fixed.
Not at all - people are born with AS and there is good evidence for this. But it is possible for us to help ourselves a lot, though there is a limit as to how much I can change the society around me; i.e. the actual problem for a large part.
Where is the fundamental difference in a female imagining they have a penis compared to imagining they do not need to eat?
I dunno, but I think that the middle of that venn diagram would have some skinny-ass lesbians and/or women who have been married awhile in the middle of it.
Lol.
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Go and fly up your own arse Hadron. I'm not changing the way I live my life to satisfy a load of self-righteous autistic twats like yourself. I have AS as well but I don't expect every other person with AS to live how I'd like them to to make my own life easier. By being fairly open about being trans, despite the shit I get for it IRL, I'm refusing to hide from ignorant idiots like you. What kind of meaningful life would I be having if I pretended to be a woman because society tells me to?
I've also told you a million times already that I'm not at MMU for a career. I'm there becuase I want to study the course there, and I'm perfectly happy with the choice I've made.
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Go and fly up your own arse Hadron. I'm not changing the way I live my life to satisfy a load of self-righteous autistic twats like yourself. I have AS as well but I don't expect every other person with AS to live how I'd like them to to make my own life easier.
You make it sound like I am the one who is going to suffer from your behaviour. I am in a fairly comfortable position. Most of our lot are not. Thanks to people like you, they have less of a chance.
The idea of being a pariah is you have a legitimate cause to back it up.
By being fairly open about being trans, despite the shit I get for it IRL, I'm refusing to hide from ignorant idiots like you. What kind of meaningful life would I be having if I pretended to be a woman because society tells me to?
Tell me when they find your Y chromosome - until then, you are a woman. Why not join the flat earth society whilst at it though? I am sure you can find some people in your mindset.
I've also told you a million times already that I'm not at MMU for a career. I'm there becuase I want to study the course there, and I'm perfectly happy with the choice I've made.
Yeah because the world revolves around your wants. Are you intending to contribute anything back to society, by any chance?
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You know there are a lot of people with chromosomes which don't match their genitilia. But this is all pointless anyway as I couldn't care less what you think I am :thumbup:
How are other autistic people suffering because I'm transgendered? I really don't see it at all. And until you can demonstrate how exactly I'm harming anyone (autistic or not), I'm not gonna change a thing.
Am I intending to contribute anything back to the society you're always bitching and moaning about you mean? God hadron, pick which way you're gonna go. One way or the other, jeez. You know nothing about my life or my plans, except the very little I post about on here.
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You know there are a lot of people with chromosomes which don't match their genitilia. But this is all pointless anyway as I couldn't care less what you think I am :thumbup:
By definition, XY = male, XX = female. Whether you like it or not.
How are other autistic people suffering because I'm transgendered? I really don't see it at all. And until you can demonstrate how exactly I'm harming anyone (autistic or not), I'm not gonna change a thing.
Because you and others are associating AS with it - I have demonstated it enough. We are judged by our collective behaviour - stop letting the side down. It makes it harder to get opportunities for those of us who actually deserve it.
Am I intending to contribute anything back to the society you're always bitching and moaning about you mean? God hadron, pick which way you're gonna go. One way or the other, jeez. You know nothing about my life or my plans, except the very little I post about on here.
I take that for a no then. I see no reason why everyone else should pay to support your pansexual or whatever nonsense; eventually people will get fed up with it. I have options. You don't - ffs why are you at a level where social services are helping you if anything but is the case.
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How are other autistic people suffering because I'm transgendered? I really don't see it at all. And until you can demonstrate how exactly I'm harming anyone (autistic or not), I'm not gonna change a thing.
Because you and others are associating AS with it - I have demonstated it enough. We are judged by our collective behaviour - stop letting the side down. It makes it harder to get opportunities for those of us who actually deserve it.
Yeah, christ, Soph, act RIGHT. Otherwise stupid people will associate AS with being transgendered, loving your dog with having AS, having OCD with hitting on girls in internet forums, taking a lot of showers with wearing your belt as a tie, and so on and so forth. Remember: With great complexity of diagnostic and symptomatic presentation, comes great responsibility.
Also, clearly, the type of person who would be using you as an example for what Asperger's "is" (i.e., someone who is not only stupid, but also specifically stalking just *you,* probably due to your hottness of course), is the type of person you should want to impress, even if you didn't have a legitimate responsibility to impress them.
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:lol:
hadron - I don't discuss every fucking aspect of my life and my plans on this site. If things go to plan, I won't even be living in this country in 5 years time. Yes I post a lot, but not about things like this. You really know absolutely jack shit about me.
What about people who have an extra chromosome? What are they?
Yeah I'm finally getting some help from social services, after 20 years of fuck all. And I'm not gonna apologise for that. What are you gonna contribute to society that's so absolutely brilliant?
Since when did I associate my having AS with my being transgendered? They're both two totally different things. If other people associate them, then that's not my problem.
I could tell you to quit spouting so much rubbish all the time, as you're letting the side down. Actually, yeh. Quit spouting so much rubbish hardon.
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If things go to plan, I won't even be living in this country in 5 years time.
Planning on moving in with me and being my catsitter/sex slave?
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How did you guess? It was meant to be a surprise!
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
I am sure Amanda Baggs would throw me that line too. The difference is, because of my own choices, I am very likely to have a nice job and life 5 years from now. Where are you? Where are you going to be? That is what you should be seriously thinking about, not friviloties such as reineventing your sexuality.
Because of your own choices?
I take it those are choices having to do with your ASD?
Is ASD a lifestyle for you, where you can make choices? Amazing. Well done.
In that case, either, you don't have ASD, or you, for you and you alone, can treat your neurotype, gender, sexual orientation and race as a lifestyle. And leave us wondering why you chose to be an ASD, male, heterosexual white man. Why not a NT, male, heterosexual white man?
OK, maybe you weren't talking about ASD, please enlighten us then what choices you do mean.
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How are other autistic people suffering because I'm transgendered? I really don't see it at all. And until you can demonstrate how exactly I'm harming anyone (autistic or not), I'm not gonna change a thing.
Because you and others are associating AS with it - I have demonstated it enough. We are judged by our collective behaviour - stop letting the side down. It makes it harder to get opportunities for those of us who actually deserve it.
Yeah, christ, Soph, act RIGHT. Otherwise stupid people will associate AS with being transgendered, loving your dog with having AS, having OCD with hitting on girls in internet forums, taking a lot of showers with wearing your belt as a tie, and so on and so forth. Remember: With great complexity of diagnostic and symptomatic presentation, comes great responsibility.
Also, clearly, the type of person who would be using you as an example for what Asperger's "is" (i.e., someone who is not only stupid, but also specifically stalking just *you,* probably due to your hottness of course), is the type of person you should want to impress, even if you didn't have a legitimate responsibility to impress them.
Actually it is dead simple - people like Soph make it hard for people with AS to be taken seriously. Fine, she can spend her life acting and living like a clown, but could she be so kind as to not associate it with Aspergers.
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How are other autistic people suffering because I'm transgendered? I really don't see it at all. And until you can demonstrate how exactly I'm harming anyone (autistic or not), I'm not gonna change a thing.
Because you and others are associating AS with it - I have demonstated it enough. We are judged by our collective behaviour - stop letting the side down. It makes it harder to get opportunities for those of us who actually deserve it.
Yeah, christ, Soph, act RIGHT. Otherwise stupid people will associate AS with being transgendered, loving your dog with having AS, having OCD with hitting on girls in internet forums, taking a lot of showers with wearing your belt as a tie, and so on and so forth. Remember: With great complexity of diagnostic and symptomatic presentation, comes great responsibility.
Also, clearly, the type of person who would be using you as an example for what Asperger's "is" (i.e., someone who is not only stupid, but also specifically stalking just *you,* probably due to your hottness of course), is the type of person you should want to impress, even if you didn't have a legitimate responsibility to impress them.
Actually it is dead simple - people like Soph make it hard for people with AS to be taken seriously. Fine, she can spend her life acting and living like a clown, but could she be so kind as to not associate it with Aspergers.
Thanks for making me laugh out loud. Roaring with laughter here.
If you were in charge, there would be only one type of ASD person. All spitting images of you. That idea is so funny.
Thank Goodness for diversity.
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And how the fuck am I supposed to do that?
I don't go round telling everyone I have AS, but I don't hide it either
I don't go round telling everyone I'm transgendered, but I don't hide it either
I don't really see what more you expect of me. Also interesting that you didn't answer my question about a woman who has an extra Y chromosome
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And how the fuck am I supposed to do that?
I don't go round telling everyone I have AS, but I don't hide it either
I don't go round telling everyone I'm transgendered, but I don't hide it either
I don't really see what more you expect of me. Also interesting that you didn't answer my question about a woman who has an extra Y chromosome
Funny isn't it. Hadron is hiding his AS, and is accusing you for obscuring AS.
Well, some enigma's will stay an enigma for ever. I think Hadron is one of them.
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:lol:
hadron - I don't discuss every fucking aspect of my life and my plans on this site. If things go to plan, I won't even be living in this country in 5 years time. Yes I post a lot, but not about things like this. You really know absolutely jack shit about me.
What plan? Is Harry Potter going to magic your boobs away or something, then send you off to live with the fairies
What about people who have an extra chromosome? What are they?
In many cases, seriously ill or disabled. Chromosomal disorders do have actual names though...
Yeah I'm finally getting some help from social services, after 20 years of fuck all. And I'm not gonna apologise for that. What are you gonna contribute to society that's so absolutely brilliant?
I wont be a burden on it, nor be enslaved by it.
Since when did I associate my having AS with my being transgendered? They're both two totally different things. If other people associate them, then that's not my problem.
No other people will just not take you seriously and you will chip away at people with AS. As to what you chip away from those who claim to be transgendered, that is not my problem.
I could tell you to quit spouting so much rubbish all the time, as you're letting the side down. Actually, yeh. Quit spouting so much rubbish hardon.
What rubbish. Your the one who insists on play acting as a male.
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How did you guess? It was meant to be a surprise!
I wasn't sure, but I wished on a shooting star a couple of days ago, so I figured maybe my wish was starting to come true!
Actually it is dead simple - people like Soph make it hard for people with AS to be taken seriously. Fine, she can spend her life acting and living like a clown, but could she be so kind as to not associate it with Aspergers.
Thanks for making me laugh out loud. Roaring with laughter here.
If you were in charge, there would be only one type of ASD person. All spitting images of you. That idea is so funny.
Thank Goodness for diversity.
Dense and difficult to like?
Frankly I'd rather have Soph represent me than Hadron. Soph's weird and probably does have more quirks and eccentricities than Hadron does, but
1. I'd rather grab a coffee and have a chat with Soph than with Hadron any day of the week and
2. I'm weird too and so is pretty much every I get along well with; 'normal people' bore me.
(And, might I add, have absolutely nothing to do with psychology, psychiatry, or counseling. The community that invented the diagnositic system which gives Asperger's and Autism their names in the first place is chalk of of weirdos.)
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Who are these "other people" who aren't gonna take me seriously?
You're creating these people in your head hadron. Complete bullshit.
So what is someone with Klinefelter's syndrome? A man or a woman? (in your expert opinion)
lol Magic boobs away. Some of the other guys on this forum have bigger boobs than me :zoinks:
PMSElle - I'd like to "grab a coffee" with you someday too, if that's what they're calling it these days :chin:
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PMSElle - I'd like to "grab a coffee" with you someday too, if that's what they're calling it these days :chin:
Yes, these days us crazy kids call "going out and talking over a cup of coffee in some coffe shop or another" "grabbing a coffee."
(And, I'd even let you assert your manliness by footing the bill! :thumbup: )
I'm totally going to have to duck out of this conversation after a couple more turns or else I'm going to wake up with Soph somehow having teleported into my bed, aren't I?
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Just let me go get another shower and find my sexy hat and I'll be on my way :beer:
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PMSElle - I'd like to "grab a coffee" with you someday too, if that's what they're calling it these days :chin:
Yes, these days us crazy kids call "going out and talking over a cup of coffee in some coffe shop or another" "grabbing a coffee."
(And, I'd even let you assert your manliness by footing the bill! :thumbup: )
I'm totally going to have to duck out of this conversation after a couple more turns or else I'm going to wake up with Soph somehow having teleported into my bed, aren't I?
No, he hates to travel. The OCD thing. He'll have you magically teleported into his and Flo won't give up her side of the bed so it will be a tight squeeze.
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:laugh:
Don't forget to bring your furball too
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Actually it is dead simple - people like Soph make it hard for people with AS to be taken seriously. Fine, she can spend her life acting and living like a clown, but could she be so kind as to not associate it with Aspergers.
Thanks for making me laugh out loud. Roaring with laughter here.
If you were in charge, there would be only one type of ASD person. All spitting images of you. That idea is so funny.
Thank Goodness for diversity.
Dense and difficult to like?
Frankly I'd rather have Soph represent me than Hadron. Soph's weird and probably does have more quirks and eccentricities than Hadron does, but
1. I'd rather grab a coffee and have a chat with Soph than with Hadron any day of the week and
2. I'm weird too and so is pretty much every I get along well with; 'normal people' bore me.
(And, might I add, have absolutely nothing to do with psychology, psychiatry, or counseling. The community that invented the diagnositic system which gives Asperger's and Autism their names in the first place is chalk of of weirdos.)
That, or the perfect thing to count if you want to fall asleep. Sheep are so divers and astonishing.
I certainly feel not represented by Hadron. He is an amazing example of how all on the spectrum are different though.
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
I am sure Amanda Baggs would throw me that line too. The difference is, because of my own choices, I am very likely to have a nice job and life 5 years from now. Where are you? Where are you going to be? That is what you should be seriously thinking about, not friviloties such as reineventing your sexuality.
Because of your own choices?
I take it those are choices having to do with your ASD?
Is ASD a lifestyle for you, where you can make choices? Amazing. Well done.
In that case, either, you don't have ASD, or you, for you and you alone, can treat your neurotype, gender, sexual orientation and race as a lifestyle. And leave us wondering why you chose to be an ASD, male, heterosexual white man. Why not a NT, male, heterosexual white man?
OK, maybe you weren't talking about ASD, please enlighten us then what choices you do mean.
There are some great people with ASD's and some weak people with ASD's. Lets just say I know which category I want to fit into and make a choice.
-
I'd hardly call criticism of Soph's sexual orientation "bashing" since she has made several contradictory statements regarging her orientation AND a complete lack of sexual experience. Soph is a confused little split-tail who needs to get laid about 100 times or so before she starts lecturing people on complex sexual issues.
Would you take advice on sex from a nun or a priest who had never been laid?? I didn't think so.
So is 100 times the minimum before you can be certain of your sexual orientation, scrap, or is that just a rough estimate? Also, how does one have to distribute one's sexual partners through those 100 times? Should there be a 50/50 split between sexual experiences with men and sexual experiences with women? And, how are we defining sex, here? If one has had oral sex 100 times, does one have the ability to understand one's sexual identity, or does there need to be actual vaginal or anal penetration (depending which is applicable/possible)? I'm quite intruigued.
She will never know what it's like to have a dick, and spend every waking moment of your life, searching for a hole to stick it in. That's what it means to be male.
Thanks for the succinct definition of the male experience. In your opinion, when men stop compulsively pussy-chasing in exhange for other pursiuts (ranging from careers to video games to drugs), do they become female, or just cease to become male?
Claiming a "male" identitiy and then claiming that you weren't interested in ever having a penis. As I've said before, you can't ever understand what it means to be male until you've experienced having a penis, AND having the desire, every second that you're awake, to shove it it in the nearest willing pussy you can find. Ask any guy here or anywhere. When you're awake, you're horny, and that's what comes with elevated testosterone levels.
[...]
If you were truly male brained then you would want to blow loads of baby batter all over their faces.
...wait, I thought men wanted to put their cocks in holes, not ejaculate onto faces. Does it have to be both, or is one sufficient in order to be considered male?
Drops in estrogen levels mean less "womanly" behavior. Less desire to mate etc...
But I thought that horniness was a man-thing? I'm so confused now.
:thumbdn: :minusevil:
For taking a few words out of context and mis-construeing what I was trying to say.
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Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
I am sure Amanda Baggs would throw me that line too. The difference is, because of my own choices, I am very likely to have a nice job and life 5 years from now. Where are you? Where are you going to be? That is what you should be seriously thinking about, not friviloties such as reineventing your sexuality.
Because of your own choices?
I take it those are choices having to do with your ASD?
Is ASD a lifestyle for you, where you can make choices? Amazing. Well done.
In that case, either, you don't have ASD, or you, for you and you alone, can treat your neurotype, gender, sexual orientation and race as a lifestyle. And leave us wondering why you chose to be an ASD, male, heterosexual white man. Why not a NT, male, heterosexual white man?
OK, maybe you weren't talking about ASD, please enlighten us then what choices you do mean.
There are some great people with ASD's and some weak people with ASD's. Lets just say I know which category I want to fit into and make a choice.
Did you choose to be strong? Or were you born strong? And are you strong indeed?
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There are some great people with ASD's and some weak people with ASD's. Lets just say I know which category I want to fit into and make a choice.
Shame. We all want things we can't have sometimes.
Try living as an openly transgendered person for a while and tell me again that I'm weak :thumbup:
:thumbdn: :minusevil:
For making me look like an arse
fixed
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Who are these "other people" who aren't gonna take me seriously?
You're creating these people in your head hadron. Complete bullshit.
So what is someone with Klinefelter's syndrome? A man or a woman? (in your expert opinion)
Male - ask the experts if you like. Having a Y chromosome makes someone male. People with XXY are referred to in general as male.
Next...
lol Magic boobs away. Some of the other guys on this forum have bigger boobs than me :zoinks:
PMSElle - I'd like to "grab a coffee" with you someday too, if that's what they're calling it these days :chin:
Well as I actually have a lot of contact with real people, have set up and ran two very successful autism awareness events (which involved quell-surprise talking to people that need winning over, along with a good lot on our side). Who have you actually talked to? You really have no experience and no clue.
As for Aspergers, we have to define it as people who are unable to fit in, rather than just as eccentric. There has to be a compelling reason why people cannot fit in and yes the social expectations that people with AS cannot meet should be lifted. Though when people like you revel in being the pariah for no good reason, it is a lot harder to persuade people.
-
:thumbdn: :minusevil:
I'm a gigantic flaming arse
fixederer.
-
There are some great people with ASD's and some weak people with ASD's. Lets just say I know which category I want to fit into and make a choice.
Shame. We all want things we can't have sometimes.
Try living as an openly transgendered person for a while and tell me again that I'm weak :thumbup:
There is bravery and stupidity. You fall into the latter catagory.
-
Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
I am sure Amanda Baggs would throw me that line too. The difference is, because of my own choices, I am very likely to have a nice job and life 5 years from now. Where are you? Where are you going to be? That is what you should be seriously thinking about, not friviloties such as reineventing your sexuality.
Because of your own choices?
I take it those are choices having to do with your ASD?
Is ASD a lifestyle for you, where you can make choices? Amazing. Well done.
In that case, either, you don't have ASD, or you, for you and you alone, can treat your neurotype, gender, sexual orientation and race as a lifestyle. And leave us wondering why you chose to be an ASD, male, heterosexual white man. Why not a NT, male, heterosexual white man?
OK, maybe you weren't talking about ASD, please enlighten us then what choices you do mean.
There are some great people with ASD's and some weak people with ASD's. Lets just say I know which category I want to fit into and make a choice.
Did you choose to be strong? Or were you born strong? And are you strong indeed?
I made the choice to be stronger compared to being weaker. It is a combination of being born strong and choosing to be strong. Unfortunately a good load of us lack self respect and choose to be weak, to all our detriment.
-
Who are these "other people" who aren't gonna take me seriously?
You're creating these people in your head hadron. Complete bullshit.
So what is someone with Klinefelter's syndrome? A man or a woman? (in your expert opinion)
Male - ask the experts if you like. Having a Y chromosome makes someone male. People with XXY are referred to in general as male.
Next...
lol Magic boobs away. Some of the other guys on this forum have bigger boobs than me :zoinks:
PMSElle - I'd like to "grab a coffee" with you someday too, if that's what they're calling it these days :chin:
Well as I actually have a lot of contact with real people, have set up and ran two very successful autism awareness events (which involved quell-surprise talking to people that need winning over, along with a good lot on our side). Who have you actually talked to? You really have no experience and no clue.
As for Aspergers, we have to define it as people who are unable to fit in, rather than just as eccentric. There has to be a compelling reason why people cannot fit in and yes the social expectations that people with AS cannot meet should be lifted. Though when people like you revel in being the pariah for no good reason, it is a lot harder to persuade people.
I don't get it. I truly don't get it.
I try understanding the reasoning of people. And often it has a logical coherence I can grasp. Even if I don't share the starting points. With you, I don't get where you start, I don't get your 'logic'. I try and I try. There is no-one here on the board I find harder to understand at least a bit than you. Probably goes both ways, that's OK.
-
Who are these "other people" who aren't gonna take me seriously?
You're creating these people in your head hadron. Complete bullshit.
So what is someone with Klinefelter's syndrome? A man or a woman? (in your expert opinion)
Male - ask the experts if you like. Having a Y chromosome makes someone male. People with XXY are referred to in general as male.
Next...
So you accept that someone born and raised as girl can be a male?
I still don't see how I'm harming any other autistic person. I'm not even having surgery and have absolutely no plans to either. I could sit her and moan about how you're making us all look like we're just arrogant idiots who expects to get a first class degree just because he "deserves" it. But no, I'm not stupid enough to think that people will assume ALL autistic people are like you.
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There are some great people with ASD's and some weak people with ASD's. Lets just say I know which category I want to fit into and make a choice.
Shame. We all want things we can't have sometimes.
Try living as an openly transgendered person for a while and tell me again that I'm weak :thumbup:
There is bravery and stupidity. You fall into the latter catagory.
Care to explain how?
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There are some great people with ASD's and some weak people with ASD's. Lets just say I know which category I want to fit into and make a choice.
Shame. We all want things we can't have sometimes.
Try living as an openly transgendered person for a while and tell me again that I'm weak :thumbup:
There is bravery and stupidity. You fall into the latter catagory.
Care to explain how?
Why on EARTH would you want to ask that? :lol: Here...let me just do you the favour now... :brickwall:
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It's all for the cauuuseee
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_g7KcbMxmLEU/R5E2Yk_YZ4I/AAAAAAAADFY/_m0pJ7oocXI/s400/TinfoilHat.jpg)
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Who are these "other people" who aren't gonna take me seriously?
You're creating these people in your head hadron. Complete bullshit.
So what is someone with Klinefelter's syndrome? A man or a woman? (in your expert opinion)
Male - ask the experts if you like. Having a Y chromosome makes someone male. People with XXY are referred to in general as male.
Next...
So you accept that someone born and raised as girl can be a male?
Not at all - look up John Money. XXY by defintion is male, having a single Y chromosome makes someone male. Anything else is female. How clear do I have to be.
I still don't see how I'm harming any other autistic person. I'm not even having surgery and have absolutely no plans to either. I could sit her and moan about how you're making us all look like we're just arrogant idiots who expects to get a first class degree just because he "deserves" it. But no, I'm not stupid enough to think that people will assume ALL autistic people are like you.
Your fighting the wrong battles, put simply. This TG stuff is a distraction that many with AS are going down and its an unhelpful path. Sort out your actual problems, rather than going after frivolties. Having a position is better than no position; what steps are you taking? What plan do you have?
By the way, stupidity is a form of weakness. Something you need to learn.
-
Anorexia is something that if you are psychologically strong enough, you can fight off and many people do; hence how it becomes a lifestyle choice, along with the LGBT stuff. The same cannot be said for AIDS, AS and so on.
The only way being trans is a lifestyle choice is in that I have the guts to live openly as a transgendered person, despite the problems that causes me pretty much every day (and no, I don't moan about it on this forum. I don't think I ever even mention those problems as I try to just ignore it)
AS at 19 (was it). TG at 21. No wonder people find it hard to take you seriously. Even worse, your behavior (and the sizable chunk of people on the spectrum like you) really undermines our credibility as people on the spectrum. Congratulations.
It takes a lot to live openly as a trans person. That's the only lifestyle choice really (the same for gay people). Whether you choose to be yourself or choose to hide because of people like you. And I don't blame those who choose to hide it. It can be extremely difficult IRL (dangerous sometimes as well, although probably more so for transwomen).
It is not about being yourself, it is about a lifestyle choice. No one here has presented any evidence that being trans is anything but a lifestyle choice. Why? Because it is one.
TG at 21? lol I've been open about being trans since I was 17, and can look back at my childhood and see it there too, I just didn't know what it was back then.
And what's wrong with getting a late diagnosis, hadron? Lots of people do. I was able to hide a lot of my problems when I was in school. I'm more proud of my achievements so far than I would be if I was in your position mate.
I am sure Amanda Baggs would throw me that line too. The difference is, because of my own choices, I am very likely to have a nice job and life 5 years from now. Where are you? Where are you going to be? That is what you should be seriously thinking about, not friviloties such as reineventing your sexuality.
Because of your own choices?
I take it those are choices having to do with your ASD?
Is ASD a lifestyle for you, where you can make choices? Amazing. Well done.
In that case, either, you don't have ASD, or you, for you and you alone, can treat your neurotype, gender, sexual orientation and race as a lifestyle. And leave us wondering why you chose to be an ASD, male, heterosexual white man. Why not a NT, male, heterosexual white man?
OK, maybe you weren't talking about ASD, please enlighten us then what choices you do mean.
There are some great people with ASD's and some weak people with ASD's. Lets just say I know which category I want to fit into and make a choice.
Did you choose to be strong? Or were you born strong? And are you strong indeed?
I made the choice to be stronger compared to being weaker. It is a combination of being born strong and choosing to be strong. Unfortunately a good load of us lack self respect and choose to be weak, to all our detriment.
Explain where the good load of us lack self respect and choose to be weak. And explain how you choose to be strong there.
And have you made choices regarding your gender and your sexual orientation? Think knowing that might make it a bit easier to try and understand your reasoning.
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rofl, Hadron lecturing people on stupidity... :hahaha:
What I'm saying is, someone can appear to be 100% female externally, but actually be male, despite looking and being raised as a female? Yes?
-
By the way, stupidity is a form of weakness. Something you need to learn.
Listen to the master. :lol:
-
Who are these "other people" who aren't gonna take me seriously?
You're creating these people in your head hadron. Complete bullshit.
So what is someone with Klinefelter's syndrome? A man or a woman? (in your expert opinion)
Male - ask the experts if you like. Having a Y chromosome makes someone male. People with XXY are referred to in general as male.
Next...
lol Magic boobs away. Some of the other guys on this forum have bigger boobs than me :zoinks:
PMSElle - I'd like to "grab a coffee" with you someday too, if that's what they're calling it these days :chin:
Well as I actually have a lot of contact with real people, have set up and ran two very successful autism awareness events (which involved quell-surprise talking to people that need winning over, along with a good lot on our side). Who have you actually talked to? You really have no experience and no clue.
As for Aspergers, we have to define it as people who are unable to fit in, rather than just as eccentric. There has to be a compelling reason why people cannot fit in and yes the social expectations that people with AS cannot meet should be lifted. Though when people like you revel in being the pariah for no good reason, it is a lot harder to persuade people.
I don't get it. I truly don't get it.
I try understanding the reasoning of people. And often it has a logical coherence I can grasp. Even if I don't share the starting points. With you, I don't get where you start, I don't get your 'logic'. I try and I try. There is no-one here on the board I find harder to understand at least a bit than you. Probably goes both ways, that's OK.
What is so difficult to understand? I put the cause of AS well above the LGBT stuff, namely the other group are asking for an artifical lifestyle choice (yes gay culture was invented), we are asking to have some freedom to be who we are to a reasonable extent. Political capital is finite, if it gets wasted on LGBT stuff, it detracts from our cause. The effects are very real, 3% of us live independently, most of us do not get the support or acceptance we need. All thanks to most of our lot being lower down the agenda and not standing up with some self respect.
-
Of course the gay "culture" was invented. That doesn't mean the sexuality itself (or gender identity for that matter) was invented. Why should the cause of glbt people be any less important than that of autistic people?
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rofl, Hadron lecturing people on stupidity... :hahaha:
What I'm saying is, someone can appear to be 100% female externally, but actually be male, despite looking and being raised as a female? Yes?
No they can't.
-
Of course the gay "culture" was invented. That doesn't mean the sexuality itself (or gender identity for that matter) was invented. Why should the cause of glbt people be any less important than that of autistic people?
Obviously because they are demanding the right to follow a certain lifestyle choice, where as we are after the right to a life at all. Go figure.
-
Who are these "other people" who aren't gonna take me seriously?
You're creating these people in your head hadron. Complete bullshit.
So what is someone with Klinefelter's syndrome? A man or a woman? (in your expert opinion)
Male - ask the experts if you like. Having a Y chromosome makes someone male. People with XXY are referred to in general as male.
Next...
lol Magic boobs away. Some of the other guys on this forum have bigger boobs than me :zoinks:
PMSElle - I'd like to "grab a coffee" with you someday too, if that's what they're calling it these days :chin:
Well as I actually have a lot of contact with real people, have set up and ran two very successful autism awareness events (which involved quell-surprise talking to people that need winning over, along with a good lot on our side). Who have you actually talked to? You really have no experience and no clue.
As for Aspergers, we have to define it as people who are unable to fit in, rather than just as eccentric. There has to be a compelling reason why people cannot fit in and yes the social expectations that people with AS cannot meet should be lifted. Though when people like you revel in being the pariah for no good reason, it is a lot harder to persuade people.
I don't get it. I truly don't get it.
I try understanding the reasoning of people. And often it has a logical coherence I can grasp. Even if I don't share the starting points. With you, I don't get where you start, I don't get your 'logic'. I try and I try. There is no-one here on the board I find harder to understand at least a bit than you. Probably goes both ways, that's OK.
What is so difficult to understand? I put the cause of AS well above the LGBT stuff, namely the other group are asking for an artifical lifestyle choice (yes gay culture was invented), we are asking to have some freedom to be who we are to a reasonable extent. Political capital is finite, if it gets wasted on LGBT stuff, it detracts from our cause. The effects are very real, 3% of us live independently, most of us do not get the support or acceptance we need. All thanks to most of our lot being lower down the agenda and not standing up with some self respect.
Comparing apples to oranges.
Since when is someone being gay robbing support of someone being on the spectrum?
Since when is being gay a handicap? Or being trans? It is a social challenge, and that should change. It's ridiculous that it is a social challenge.
If the world is more open to all kinds of diversity, there may be more places where autistics can fit in.
Autism is a handicap for some/most of us, not by choice, just matter of factly. Not in every aspect of life neseccarily, but in some aspects. It also is a huge social challenge. And that should change, but not by smearing people that are different from the way you want to present yourself.
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I think Hadron needs a cock up his arse.
Any volunteers?
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rofl, Hadron lecturing people on stupidity... :hahaha:
What I'm saying is, someone can appear to be 100% female externally, but actually be male, despite looking and being raised as a female? Yes?
No they can't.
I thought having a Y chromosome made you male, regadless of anything else though? (in your fantastic opinion I mean)
People with AS aren't denied any rights people without AS have. Yeah it's more difficult for us. Life sucks sometimes. Big fucking deal, you have to make your own way round these obstacles, not expect the world to change to suit you
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rofl, Hadron lecturing people on stupidity... :hahaha:
What I'm saying is, someone can appear to be 100% female externally, but actually be male, despite looking and being raised as a female? Yes?
No they can't.
What about the women that don't know yet, or will never know. Are they male? Both sociologically and biologically. And in denial, even if there is no way that they could know?
Flawed Hadron, very flawed.
-
Who are these "other people" who aren't gonna take me seriously?
You're creating these people in your head hadron. Complete bullshit.
So what is someone with Klinefelter's syndrome? A man or a woman? (in your expert opinion)
Male - ask the experts if you like. Having a Y chromosome makes someone male. People with XXY are referred to in general as male.
Next...
lol Magic boobs away. Some of the other guys on this forum have bigger boobs than me :zoinks:
PMSElle - I'd like to "grab a coffee" with you someday too, if that's what they're calling it these days :chin:
Well as I actually have a lot of contact with real people, have set up and ran two very successful autism awareness events (which involved quell-surprise talking to people that need winning over, along with a good lot on our side). Who have you actually talked to? You really have no experience and no clue.
As for Aspergers, we have to define it as people who are unable to fit in, rather than just as eccentric. There has to be a compelling reason why people cannot fit in and yes the social expectations that people with AS cannot meet should be lifted. Though when people like you revel in being the pariah for no good reason, it is a lot harder to persuade people.
I don't get it. I truly don't get it.
I try understanding the reasoning of people. And often it has a logical coherence I can grasp. Even if I don't share the starting points. With you, I don't get where you start, I don't get your 'logic'. I try and I try. There is no-one here on the board I find harder to understand at least a bit than you. Probably goes both ways, that's OK.
What is so difficult to understand? I put the cause of AS well above the LGBT stuff, namely the other group are asking for an artifical lifestyle choice (yes gay culture was invented), we are asking to have some freedom to be who we are to a reasonable extent. Political capital is finite, if it gets wasted on LGBT stuff, it detracts from our cause. The effects are very real, 3% of us live independently, most of us do not get the support or acceptance we need. All thanks to most of our lot being lower down the agenda and not standing up with some self respect.
Comparing apples to oranges.
Since when is someone being gay robbing support of someone being on the spectrum?
In politics, a finite amount can be done. When political capital is being spent on say letting gay people give blood, it is being wasted. That capital could be being spent on us, instead it is being squandered on pandering to the gay lobby. All this is to our detriment. Not difficult to get. There is a queue and we need to be a lot higher in it.
Since when is being gay a handicap? Or being trans? It is a social challenge, and that should change. It's ridiculous that it is a social challenge.
It is a tiny social challenge, unless you choose to make it one.
If the world is more open to all kinds of diversity, there may be more places where autistics can fit in.
Society was a lot easier for us to fit into socially 40 years ago, social expectations have mushroomed in both quantity and variety. All it does is make it harder for us.
Autism is a handicap for some/most of us, not by choice, just matter of factly.
Where as being gay is a social handicap by choice, hence should be at the bottom of the pile for being dealt with. Finally, you are getting somewhere.
Not in every aspect of life neseccarily, but in some aspects. It also is a huge social challenge. And that should change, but not by smearing people that are different from the way you want to present yourself.
So your grand plan for changing it is what exactly? I have done a lot more than you have for the cause and it is a damn sight harder if our membership are convincing each other to miss the point and go on wild goose chases.
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Oh shush Hadron.
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yeah shut your face, fucktard
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rofl, Hadron lecturing people on stupidity... :hahaha:
What I'm saying is, someone can appear to be 100% female externally, but actually be male, despite looking and being raised as a female? Yes?
No they can't.
I thought having a Y chromosome made you male, regadless of anything else though? (in your fantastic opinion I mean)
People with AS aren't denied any rights people without AS have. Yeah it's more difficult for us. Life sucks sometimes. Big fucking deal, you have to make your own way round these obstacles, not expect the world to change to suit you
XXY gives underdeveloped testicles, not no testicals.
Look up the "pure motives fallacy" whilst at this, clearly you have no understanding of disability rights (or the law surrounding it) by that last sentence.
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Soph: Twilight
Bint: Twilight Fangirl
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rofl, Hadron lecturing people on stupidity... :hahaha:
What I'm saying is, someone can appear to be 100% female externally, but actually be male, despite looking and being raised as a female? Yes?
No they can't.
What about the women that don't know yet, or will never know. Are they male? Both sociologically and biologically. And in denial, even if there is no way that they could know?
Flawed Hadron, very flawed.
As I said, there is a well defined biological partition between sexes. No need not to stick to it.
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Shleed: fat leprechaun no one gives a shit about
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Not in every aspect of life neseccarily, but in some aspects. It also is a huge social challenge. And that should change, but not by smearing people that are different from the way you want to present yourself.
So your grand plan for changing it is what exactly? I have done a lot more than you have for the cause and it is a damn sight harder if our membership are convincing each other to miss the point and go on wild goose chases.
I feel so deeply known by you now. Almost crying with gratitude. [/sarcasm]
You are right, I have no idea what you have done in life. You have no idea about me either. I love the symbol of the wild goose btw. Going where she wants.
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Not in every aspect of life neseccarily, but in some aspects. It also is a huge social challenge. And that should change, but not by smearing people that are different from the way you want to present yourself.
So your grand plan for changing it is what exactly? I have done a lot more than you have for the cause and it is a damn sight harder if our membership are convincing each other to miss the point and go on wild goose chases.
I feel so deeply known by you now. Almost crying with gratitude. [/sarcasm]
You are right, I have no idea what you have done in life. You have no idea about me either. I love the symbol of the wild goose btw. Going where she wants.
Miss the point yet again.
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Only you and Soph don't give a shit. Well, apparently.
If you're posting about not giving a shit, i'll post on how much I don't care. Then we'll prove each other wrong. :orly:
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Bluhblahblu.
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Huh?
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Not in every aspect of life neseccarily, but in some aspects. It also is a huge social challenge. And that should change, but not by smearing people that are different from the way you want to present yourself.
So your grand plan for changing it is what exactly? I have done a lot more than you have for the cause and it is a damn sight harder if our membership are convincing each other to miss the point and go on wild goose chases.
I feel so deeply known by you now. Almost crying with gratitude. [/sarcasm]
You are right, I have no idea what you have done in life. You have no idea about me either. I love the symbol of the wild goose btw. Going where she wants.
Miss the point yet again.
Sorry that you missed it.
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What's with the Brandon Teena comments btw? That the best you can come up with?
Actually that was too rank to leave so I took it out. I was wrong to put that up.
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PMSElle - I'd like to "grab a coffee" with you someday too, if that's what they're calling it these days :chin:
Yes, these days us crazy kids call "going out and talking over a cup of coffee in some coffe shop or another" "grabbing a coffee."
(And, I'd even let you assert your manliness by footing the bill! :thumbup: )
I'm totally going to have to duck out of this conversation after a couple more turns or else I'm going to wake up with Soph somehow having teleported into my bed, aren't I?
No, he hates to travel. The OCD thing. He'll have you magically teleported into his and Flo won't give up her side of the bed so it will be a tight squeeze.
But I hate travel too!!! Damn it!!!
only time I ever travel willingly is for boys I like
:laugh:
Don't forget to bring your furball too
Make sure to beam my luffable furball along when you teleport me!
I'd hardly call criticism of Soph's sexual orientation "bashing" since she has made several contradictory statements regarging her orientation AND a complete lack of sexual experience. Soph is a confused little split-tail who needs to get laid about 100 times or so before she starts lecturing people on complex sexual issues.
Would you take advice on sex from a nun or a priest who had never been laid?? I didn't think so.
So is 100 times the minimum before you can be certain of your sexual orientation, scrap, or is that just a rough estimate? Also, how does one have to distribute one's sexual partners through those 100 times? Should there be a 50/50 split between sexual experiences with men and sexual experiences with women? And, how are we defining sex, here? If one has had oral sex 100 times, does one have the ability to understand one's sexual identity, or does there need to be actual vaginal or anal penetration (depending which is applicable/possible)? I'm quite intruigued.
She will never know what it's like to have a dick, and spend every waking moment of your life, searching for a hole to stick it in. That's what it means to be male.
Thanks for the succinct definition of the male experience. In your opinion, when men stop compulsively pussy-chasing in exhange for other pursiuts (ranging from careers to video games to drugs), do they become female, or just cease to become male?
Claiming a "male" identitiy and then claiming that you weren't interested in ever having a penis. As I've said before, you can't ever understand what it means to be male until you've experienced having a penis, AND having the desire, every second that you're awake, to shove it it in the nearest willing pussy you can find. Ask any guy here or anywhere. When you're awake, you're horny, and that's what comes with elevated testosterone levels.
[...]
If you were truly male brained then you would want to blow loads of baby batter all over their faces.
...wait, I thought men wanted to put their cocks in holes, not ejaculate onto faces. Does it have to be both, or is one sufficient in order to be considered male?
Drops in estrogen levels mean less "womanly" behavior. Less desire to mate etc...
But I thought that horniness was a man-thing? I'm so confused now.
:thumbdn: :minusevil:
For taking a few words out of context and mis-construeing what I was trying to say.
The brilliance of your rebuttal is matched only by its overall maturity.
:thumbdn: :minusevil:
For making me look like an arse
fixed
Actually, I think scrap did that all by himself. I just helped highlight some of the arsiest arsiness.
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I hope he lives to be 129 year old
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:laugh:
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I get up the next day, and behold! Five more pages of pure fun.
Wow... This thread is full ignorance and bullshit.
[massive infodump]
I hope you've learned something...But if not and you still hold to your bigot opinions it would be best if you kept them to yourselves. Commenting on something you either have little knowledge on or are unwilling to learn about is rather stupid.
Mate! If it's sympathy and understanding you're after, this — assuming the worst about your critics' intelligence and motivations — is a poor way to go about it.
Hadron: The world and its people will continue to carry on in ways you deem inappropriate. You don't have to like it, but if you can learn to tolerate it, you'll be better off.
Huh?
We've had this talk before, haven't we? :green: For mercy's sake, child, dumb it down a wee bit so the rest can get a chance to catch up with yeh.
As for the rest: Even the most sensitive, intuitive, Theory-of-Mind-equipped person is not EVER going to experience life exactly the same way as anyone else. Talk to them online, be personally acquainted with them, live under the same roof as them, share a bed with them? You're still not inside their head, and you can NOT know what it's like to be them. What to do? Turn into a PC-obsessed ninny, never saying anything for fear of hurting someone's feelings? Go to the other extreme and blame the victims for causing their own problems? Or try to find a middle ground between the two?
A eye for the absurd and a functioning sense of humour are good assets. My most poignant transgender-awareness moment was back in the late 70s when a few of us were having a laugh over a cartoon. It was a picture of two guys, one of them saying to the other, "See, it's because I'm a lesbian trapped in a man's body." After we'd had a laugh, there was a moment of quiet, and then one of the men there, an enormous teddy bear of a man with a huge mop of curly hair, said wistfully, "That's just how I feel." Made us all think, that did.
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If you live in some sort of communist commune then that sort of behaviour is OK. In the rest of the world it is not however. As for life skills, lets just say that I am one of the 3% of people who manage to live fully independantly - I assure you that I am fine.
Who are you to deteremine what's right or wrong? You're also generalising. "rest of the world", really? The whole world? You've been I take it?
Damaging? In what context? And you didn't answer my question: what do you mean by actual causes?
I would have thought the answer was obvious - how do clowns like yourself and Soph running around revelling in some self made pariah status help those with AS who actually want some sort of meaningful life. Please explain.
Self made pariah status? Show me the evidence that I have ever done something like that in relation to being Trans or being Autistic. And who are you to decree that I must help other AS people lead a meaningful life? That's their choice.
By god! How arrogant can you be? I mean I thought I was arrogant, but you sir...Well I tip my hat to you.
Tell me when they find your Y chromosome - until then, you are a woman. Why not join the flat earth society whilst at it though? I am sure you can find some people in your mindset.
By definition, XY = male, XX = female. Whether you like it or not.
Chromosomes do not determine gender. Yes it's easy, and dare I say autistic, to look at the chromosomes and go "Aha! That's how gender should be determined it makes sense!" but then up comes the intersex conditions such as CAIS, as I explained. How do you get around that discrepency? Do you call the CAIS woman a man for simply having 46XY chromosomes? If not then why can't you accept trans people?
Yeah because the world revolves around your wants. Are you intending to contribute anything back to society, by any chance?
But you're seemingly telling us that the world revolves around your wants.
Because you and others are associating AS with it - I have demonstated it enough. We are judged by our collective behaviour - stop letting the side down. It makes it harder to get opportunities for those of us who actually deserve it.
Associate AS with Trans? Show me clearly evidence that I or Soph have ever done that. There is conjectural evidence to suggest that for Trans people with AS the conditions are somewhat linked. Like how AS has comorbid conditions. Should we not associate those comorbidities with autism either?
I take that for a no then. I see no reason why everyone else should pay to support your pansexual or whatever nonsense; eventually people will get fed up with it. I have options. You don't - ffs why are you at a level where social services are helping you if anything but is the case.
LOL! So in your mind society will regress in openess and tolerance of uniqueness and difference? Sorry to break you heart, but all evidence suggests otherwise.
In many cases, seriously ill or disabled. Chromosomal disorders do have actual names though...
"Autistic people are just damaged in the head."
I dare you to tell an intersex person that they're seriously ill.
I wont be a burden on it, nor be enslaved by it.
You absolute hypocrit... How dare you desire not to be enslaved by society but decree that Soph or I must be.
Who are these "other people" who aren't gonna take me seriously?
You're creating these people in your head hadron. Complete bullshit.
So what is someone with Klinefelter's syndrome? A man or a woman? (in your expert opinion)
Male - ask the experts if you like. Having a Y chromosome makes someone male. People with XXY are referred to in general as male.
Next...
What about someone with CAIS?
Well as I actually have a lot of contact with real people, have set up and ran two very successful autism awareness events (which involved quell-surprise talking to people that need winning over, along with a good lot on our side). Who have you actually talked to? You really have no experience and no clue.
As for Aspergers, we have to define it as people who are unable to fit in, rather than just as eccentric. There has to be a compelling reason why people cannot fit in and yes the social expectations that people with AS cannot meet should be lifted. Though when people like you revel in being the pariah for no good reason, it is a lot harder to persuade people.
Wow... I think you've let your successes (which should be commended no doubt) go to your head, and in a big way. Just because you've done speeches and got stuff done in your specific field doesn't make you any more or less superior to Soph or I for having not done such.
Your definition of Aspergers is flawed. Almost anyone could fit that description.
It's all for the cauuuseee
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_g7KcbMxmLEU/R5E2Yk_YZ4I/AAAAAAAADFY/_m0pJ7oocXI/s400/TinfoilHat.jpg)
I love that cat's expression! :lol:
rofl, Hadron lecturing people on stupidity... :hahaha:
What I'm saying is, someone can appear to be 100% female externally, but actually be male, despite looking and being raised as a female? Yes?
No they can't.
I thought having a Y chromosome made you male, regadless of anything else though? (in your fantastic opinion I mean)
People with AS aren't denied any rights people without AS have. Yeah it's more difficult for us. Life sucks sometimes. Big fucking deal, you have to make your own way round these obstacles, not expect the world to change to suit you
XXY gives underdeveloped testicles, not no testicals.
Look up the "pure motives fallacy" whilst at this, clearly you have no understanding of disability rights (or the law surrounding it) by that last sentence.
What about CAIS people?
I get up the next day, and behold! Five more pages of pure fun.
Wow... This thread is full ignorance and bullshit.
[massive infodump]
I hope you've learned something...But if not and you still hold to your bigot opinions it would be best if you kept them to yourselves. Commenting on something you either have little knowledge on or are unwilling to learn about is rather stupid.
Mate! If it's sympathy and understanding you're after, this — assuming the worst about your critics' intelligence and motivations — is a poor way to go about it.
Not sympathy and only understanding is so far as being aware. My point for that post and most of the posts here are to increase awareness and knowledge about these issues. Someone who has no desire to learn about these issues, but still poo-poos them is ignorant. And willfully ignorant, which I just simply can not abide. Hadron has little knowledge in the area of gender and sexuality and is seemingly unwilling to learn about the issues instead decreeing that they're lifestyle choices and they isolate people from his all hallowed society.
Hadron: The world and its people will continue to carry on in ways you deem inappropriate. You don't have to like it, but if you can learn to tolerate it, you'll be better off.
Hear Hear!
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I identify people by sex, and not gender. I mean, why go into the men's bathroom if you can't pee in the urinal (while standing)? I don't care what they identify themselves as, if I see a woman, I call the person a she, and if I see a man, I call the person he. Gender is all about gender roles, which is all societal conditioning. Biological gender = sex. Gender is garbage anyways, the entire concept that is.
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I identify people by sex, and not gender. I mean, why go into the men's bathroom if you can't pee in the urinal (while standing)?
(http://www.bowlofserial.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/go-girl-01.jpg)
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I don't care what they identify themselves as, if I see a woman, I call the person a she, and if I see a man, I call the person he.
Yeah because everybody walks round with their penis/vagina on show 24-7
Gender identity and gender roles/stereotypes are two different things. I think I am probably one of the most androgynous people I know when it comes to personality. I definitely don't fit into either gender role very well anyway.
As for why go int a men's toilet if you don't need to pee in a urinal, try and think about what could happen if a man (yes, someone perceived to be a man, regardless of what's in his pants) continually went into a women's bathroom. Good idea? No, didn't think so. Trans guys don't use men's toilets because they think it's some great thing to be able to piss in them, they use them because they want to be inconspicuous like anyone else. They want to pee without making a big song and dance about it.
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I identify people by sex, and not gender. I mean, why go into the men's bathroom if you can't pee in the urinal (while standing)?
What do you do when you go to the toilet?
"Hey! Everyone! I'm peeing in the urinal! It's awesome! YEAH!"
Most people go to the toilets to..well go to the toilet. I use mens toilets (considering I'd probably be arrested for using a womens given my appearence), and I haven't used a urinal since I was a child. And if the toilet is clean (which they rarely are) I'd even sit. :: shrugs ::
I don't care what they identify themselves as, if I see a woman, I call the person a she, and if I see a man, I call the person he. Gender is all about gender roles, which is all societal conditioning. Biological gender = sex. Gender is garbage anyways, the entire concept that is.
So someone born a man who passes well as a woman is a woman to you? Fair enough, I can accept that...to a degree.
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You mean you don't all use the disabled toilets?
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You mean you don't all use the disabled toilets?
I do if they're available, but I sometimes feel a little guilty using them as I'm not physically disabled.... But then.. It doesn't actually specify physical disability, and Autism is a disability, and to some degree transitioning person would be sort of disabled....
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You mean you don't all use the disabled toilets?
I do if they're available, but I sometimes feel a little guilty using them as I'm not physically disabled.... But then.. It doesn't actually specify physical disability, and Autism is a disability, and to some degree transitioning person would be sort of disabled....
Well that's the thing. If you don't like crowds, big or small, and if you need room to flap your hands, the disabled toilets are a win!
Fuck I don't even use urinals or troughs, I likes my privacy.
Plus taking a shit in public toilets is full of wrong. You have to sit on that seat, and even if they do have those paper seat covers, sitting on them isn't much better. Hovering is feat in itself, and then you have to put up with really bad public toilet toilet paper.
I'm not as bad as Shit Break, but you get the idea.
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If you live in some sort of communist commune then that sort of behaviour is OK. In the rest of the world it is not however. As for life skills, lets just say that I am one of the 3% of people who manage to live fully independantly - I assure you that I am fine.
Who are you to deteremine what's right or wrong? You're also generalising. "rest of the world", really? The whole world? You've been I take it?
Most school children should at least know the tenets of capitalism, which is pretty much the axis the world spins on these days. Barter was so stone age.
Damaging? In what context? And you didn't answer my question: what do you mean by actual causes?
I would have thought the answer was obvious - how do clowns like yourself and Soph running around revelling in some self made pariah status help those with AS who actually want some sort of meaningful life. Please explain.
Self made pariah status? Show me the evidence that I have ever done something like that in relation to being Trans or being Autistic. And who are you to decree that I must help other AS people lead a meaningful life? That's their choice.
By god! How arrogant can you be? I mean I thought I was arrogant, but you sir...Well I tip my hat to you.
Calling yourself Trans is asking to be a pariah, I don't need to say anymore here to prove my point.
Tell me when they find your Y chromosome - until then, you are a woman. Why not join the flat earth society whilst at it though? I am sure you can find some people in your mindset.
By definition, XY = male, XX = female. Whether you like it or not.
Chromosomes do not determine gender. Yes it's easy, and dare I say autistic, to look at the chromosomes and go "Aha! That's how gender should be determined it makes sense!" but then up comes the intersex conditions such as CAIS, as I explained. How do you get around that discrepency? Do you call the CAIS woman a man for simply having 46XY chromosomes? If not then why can't you accept trans people?
No, gender is determined genetically and is well defined, whether you like it or not. Just like if you call the sky purple, it doesn't mean it isn't actually blue.
Yeah because the world revolves around your wants. Are you intending to contribute anything back to society, by any chance?
But you're seemingly telling us that the world revolves around your wants.
No, the world revolves around reality. And yes, your actions and the actions of others have real consequences.
Because you and others are associating AS with it - I have demonstated it enough. We are judged by our collective behaviour - stop letting the side down. It makes it harder to get opportunities for those of us who actually deserve it.
Associate AS with Trans? Show me clearly evidence that I or Soph have ever done that. There is conjectural evidence to suggest that for Trans people with AS the conditions are somewhat linked. Like how AS has comorbid conditions. Should we not associate those comorbidities with autism either?
The link is that more people with AS make that lifestyle choice
I take that for a no then. I see no reason why everyone else should pay to support your pansexual or whatever nonsense; eventually people will get fed up with it. I have options. You don't - ffs why are you at a level where social services are helping you if anything but is the case.
LOL! So in your mind society will regress in openess and tolerance of uniqueness and difference? Sorry to break you heart, but all evidence suggests otherwise.
In many cases, seriously ill or disabled. Chromosomal disorders do have actual names though...
"Autistic people are just damaged in the head."
I dare you to tell an intersex person that they're seriously ill.
They know it in most cases, depending on the disorder. It doesn't just effect their sex organs you know, much as you trivialise.
I wont be a burden on it, nor be enslaved by it.
You absolute hypocrit... How dare you desire not to be enslaved by society but decree that Soph or I must be.
Who are these "other people" who aren't gonna take me seriously?
You're creating these people in your head hadron. Complete bullshit.
So what is someone with Klinefelter's syndrome? A man or a woman? (in your expert opinion)
Male - ask the experts if you like. Having a Y chromosome makes someone male. People with XXY are referred to in general as male.
Next...
What about someone with CAIS?
What about them? Google it and see what it actually is. The welsh bureau for looking after druggies, if you cba.
Well as I actually have a lot of contact with real people, have set up and ran two very successful autism awareness events (which involved quell-surprise talking to people that need winning over, along with a good lot on our side). Who have you actually talked to? You really have no experience and no clue.
As for Aspergers, we have to define it as people who are unable to fit in, rather than just as eccentric. There has to be a compelling reason why people cannot fit in and yes the social expectations that people with AS cannot meet should be lifted. Though when people like you revel in being the pariah for no good reason, it is a lot harder to persuade people.
Wow... I think you've let your successes (which should be commended no doubt) go to your head, and in a big way. Just because you've done speeches and got stuff done in your specific field doesn't make you any more or less superior to Soph or I for having not done such.
Your definition of Aspergers is flawed. Almost anyone could fit that description.
Not at all true, for Aspergers to be a useful definition, there has to be some social expecation we actually cannot meet.
It's all for the cauuuseee
(http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_g7KcbMxmLEU/R5E2Yk_YZ4I/AAAAAAAADFY/_m0pJ7oocXI/s400/TinfoilHat.jpg)
I love that cat's expression! :lol:
rofl, Hadron lecturing people on stupidity... :hahaha:
What I'm saying is, someone can appear to be 100% female externally, but actually be male, despite looking and being raised as a female? Yes?
No they can't.
I thought having a Y chromosome made you male, regadless of anything else though? (in your fantastic opinion I mean)
People with AS aren't denied any rights people without AS have. Yeah it's more difficult for us. Life sucks sometimes. Big fucking deal, you have to make your own way round these obstacles, not expect the world to change to suit you
XXY gives underdeveloped testicles, not no testicals.
Look up the "pure motives fallacy" whilst at this, clearly you have no understanding of disability rights (or the law surrounding it) by that last sentence.
What about CAIS people?
I get up the next day, and behold! Five more pages of pure fun.
Wow... This thread is full ignorance and bullshit.
[massive infodump]
I hope you've learned something...But if not and you still hold to your bigot opinions it would be best if you kept them to yourselves. Commenting on something you either have little knowledge on or are unwilling to learn about is rather stupid.
Mate! If it's sympathy and understanding you're after, this — assuming the worst about your critics' intelligence and motivations — is a poor way to go about it.
Not sympathy and only understanding is so far as being aware. My point for that post and most of the posts here are to increase awareness and knowledge about these issues. Someone who has no desire to learn about these issues, but still poo-poos them is ignorant. And willfully ignorant, which I just simply can not abide. Hadron has little knowledge in the area of gender and sexuality and is seemingly unwilling to learn about the issues instead decreeing that they're lifestyle choices and they isolate people from his all hallowed society.
Hadron: The world and its people will continue to carry on in ways you deem inappropriate. You don't have to like it, but if you can learn to tolerate it, you'll be better off.
Hear Hear!
There is nothing to know, when someone actually comes up with some real science rather than just some collective delusions, please do let me know. All you have is a religious mentality and behaviour.
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*smiles and nods at Hadron* Unless you're willing to present actual evidence to back up your claims I think we're done.
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Just like if you call the sky purple, it doesn't mean it isn't actually blue.
Actually the sky often is purple. And it's very rarely blue here... you should know that :zoinks:
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*smiles and nods at Hadron* Unless you're willing to present actual evidence to back up your claims I think we're done.
I don't need to, your the one claiming something exists without any evidence whatsoever.
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*smiles and nods at Hadron* Unless you're willing to present actual evidence to back up your claims I think we're done.
I don't need to, your the one claiming something exists without any evidence whatsoever.
You're*
I've presented plenty of evidence. Evidence that has citations, and further reading with verifiable research backing it up. You've presented... Well just your word.
And I'm not the only one claiming. You are also.
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*smiles and nods at Hadron* Unless you're willing to present actual evidence to back up your claims I think we're done.
I don't need to, your the one claiming something exists without any evidence whatsoever.
Yeah like those "other people" inside your head who all think aspies are just like me (if only... we'd be a much better-looking bunch if they were :( )
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Sorry I know Hadron has posted a lot and I have read a lot of it but what is the point he is making. He may be right, wrong or indifferent but I can't follow him or what he is trying to say?
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He's trying to say that transgendered aspies are harming other autistic people because others then associate autism with being transgendered. Also the sky is not purple.
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He's trying to say that transgendered aspies are harming other autistic people because others then associate autism with being transgendered. Also the sky is not purple.
And that being gay or trans is a lifestyle choice, as is anorexia (or was that PPK?)
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Oh yeh lol, that was a hardon claim too
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It's all about implanting false memories by evil psychologists. That's why you have to make sure there is no gaps in either you tin foil hat or your tin foil underpants.
Also you may want to wear tin foil sneaker, you might stand on some gay thought patterns while you are at it.
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It's all about implanting false memories by evil psychologists. That's why you have to make sure there is no gaps in either you tin foil hat or your tin foil underpants.
Also you may want to wear tin foil sneaker, you might stand on some gay thought patterns while you are at it.
Holy fuck, don't tell me you've gone all Scientologist on us? :o :laugh:
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He also claims I haven't presented any evidence... :lol:
It's all about implanting false memories by evil psychologists. That's why you have to make sure there is no gaps in either you tin foil hat or your tin foil underpants.
Also you may want to wear tin foil sneaker, you might stand on some gay thought patterns while you are at it.
Some guys did a scientific study on tin foils hats and showed they did fuck all in blocking out anything, but actually increased the reception to a specific band of radio waves. :zoinks:
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He also claims I haven't presented any evidence... :lol:
It's all about implanting false memories by evil psychologists. That's why you have to make sure there is no gaps in either you tin foil hat or your tin foil underpants.
Also you may want to wear tin foil sneaker, you might stand on some gay thought patterns while you are at it.
Some guys did a scientific study on tin foils hats and showed they did fuck all in blocking out anything, but actually increased the reception to a specific band of radio waves. :zoinks:
That's what they want you to think.
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It's all about implanting false memories by evil psychologists. That's why you have to make sure there is no gaps in either you tin foil hat or your tin foil underpants.
Also you may want to wear tin foil sneaker, you might stand on some gay thought patterns while you are at it.
Holy fuck, don't tell me you've gone all Scientologist on us? :o :laugh:
WHAT ARE YOUR CRIMES!??!?!!!
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It's all about implanting false memories by evil psychologists. That's why you have to make sure there is no gaps in either you tin foil hat or your tin foil underpants.
Also you may want to wear tin foil sneaker, you might stand on some gay thought patterns while you are at it.
Holy fuck, don't tell me you've gone all Scientologist on us? :o :laugh:
WHAT ARE YOUR CRIMES!??!?!!!
I love Xenu, he's my homeboy. 8)
OH SHI-
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He also claims I haven't presented any evidence... :lol:
It's all about implanting false memories by evil psychologists. That's why you have to make sure there is no gaps in either you tin foil hat or your tin foil underpants.
Also you may want to wear tin foil sneaker, you might stand on some gay thought patterns while you are at it.
Some guys did a scientific study on tin foils hats and showed they did fuck all in blocking out anything, but actually increased the reception to a specific band of radio waves. :zoinks:
That's what they want you to think.
:LOL: :lol:
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I don't care what they identify themselves as, if I see a woman, I call the person a she, and if I see a man, I call the person he.
Yeah because everybody walks round with their penis/vagina on show 24-7
Gender identity and gender roles/stereotypes are two different things. I think I am probably one of the most androgynous people I know when it comes to personality. I definitely don't fit into either gender role very well anyway.
As for why go int a men's toilet if you don't need to pee in a urinal, try and think about what could happen if a man (yes, someone perceived to be a man, regardless of what's in his pants) continually went into a women's bathroom. Good idea? No, didn't think so. Trans guys don't use men's toilets because they think it's some great thing to be able to piss in them, they use them because they want to be inconspicuous like anyone else. They want to pee without making a big song and dance about it.
They shouldn't assume you are a man just because you don't dress like a woman. You look very feminine in the face to me Soph, so I doubt that I would mistake you for a man. It is pretty easy to tell when someone is a M2F tran usually too. I don't care so much in the restroom as long you aren't taking forever while pissing in the stall (which has seats I wouldn't want to sit on anyways). I have seen a cross dressing dude pissing in a urinal before in downtown Orlando, it looked pretty funny.
You can choose to dress however you want. For me it like using the Handicapped stall when you don't need to, as far as pissing in the urinal and not using the stalls all the time. You would be the only guy that uses the stall all the time, which is a pain in the ass if you are a guy going into the restroom and you absolutely have to take a crap and there is some other dude in there taking a piss. I mean, he could have just as easily used one of the several urinals available which are not being used by anyone else, but instead he has to take up the only stall. That is how I view the men's restroom part of the entire thing, because that is the only place where this would really come to be a problem (and a locker room of course could be).
Really the only place I could see that being a problem is in public restrooms. Locker rooms are private and people should at least be wise enough where to go and not to go at the gym.
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It is pretty easy to tell when someone is a M2F tran usually too.
I could make you eat those words. I mean not me personally...But others. But I is tired so I might see about doing something about this issue tomorrow. If I can be bothered.
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*smiles and nods at Hadron* Unless you're willing to present actual evidence to back up your claims I think we're done.
I don't need to, your the one claiming something exists without any evidence whatsoever.
You're*
I've presented plenty of evidence. Evidence that has citations, and further reading with verifiable research backing it up. You've presented... Well just your word.
And I'm not the only one claiming. You are also.
Present me a peer-reviewed legitimate scientific research article and then we might have something to discuss. Oh I forget, they don't exist, I wonder why
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I identify people by sex, and not gender. I mean, why go into the men's bathroom if you can't pee in the urinal (while standing)?
What do you do when you go to the toilet?
"Hey! Everyone! I'm peeing in the urinal! It's awesome! YEAH!"
Most people go to the toilets to..well go to the toilet. I use mens toilets (considering I'd probably be arrested for using a womens given my appearence), and I haven't used a urinal since I was a child. And if the toilet is clean (which they rarely are) I'd even sit. :: shrugs ::
I don't care what they identify themselves as, if I see a woman, I call the person a she, and if I see a man, I call the person he. Gender is all about gender roles, which is all societal conditioning. Biological gender = sex. Gender is garbage anyways, the entire concept that is.
So someone born a man who passes well as a woman is a woman to you? Fair enough, I can accept that...to a degree.
I usually do not talk when I am taking a piss in the urinal, it makes me uncomfortable haha. I don't take a shit in public restroom unless it is an absolute emergency. That is the only way you would see me in a stall. That makes it even lamer that there is a dude taking forever while taking a piss in the stall (usually only one or two in a restroom), when he could just as easily be pissing in one of of several available urinals. When someone is bothering to take a shit in a public restroom they usually have to REALLY take a shit. Making them wait while you use a stall is kinda rude imo. They could have a diarrhea disaster right there.
I don't sit on a toilet without putting a good deal of toilet paper or the sanitary toilet paper on the seat. Ugh, sitting on toilets that I don't clean myself disgusts me. I don't trust janitors in public places to keep the restrooms clean. I am a major clean freak about my restroom though. I probably overuse bleach if anything.
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I piss using the stalls because I need my privacy. Plus who takes that long to take a piss?
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It is pretty easy to tell when someone is a M2F tran usually too.
I could make you eat those words. I mean not me personally...But others. But I is tired so I might see about doing something about this issue tomorrow. If I can be bothered.
I mean in person, photographs make it much easier to deceive people. Jeez, we all have seen what lighting, camera angles, etc can do. You can tell by how much makeup they wear in addition to their muscularity. I have seen real women that look more like men than a M2F though, because they were basically female bodybuilders.
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I piss using the stalls because I need my privacy. Plus who takes that long to take a piss?
Most people don't take long at all, but I have seen exceptions unfortunately. I like a divider between urinals, the huge trough thing is just gross to me haha. I was just saying that is one of the few places where you might run into problems with a tran person.
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I piss using the stalls because I need my privacy. Plus who takes that long to take a piss?
Most people don't take long at all, but I have seen exceptions unfortunately. I like a divider between urinals, the huge trough thing is just gross to me haha. I was just saying that is one of the few places where you might run into problems with a tran person.
The huge trough is so wrong, too much splash back, too noisey, less than zero privacy. :zombiefuck:
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I wasn't talking about me personally alex, although it's interesting that you keep bringing it back to me. What is your problem with me being a guy? Are you insecure about your masculinity or something? I don't use public toilets full stop, so that particular issue is irrelevant to me
Anyway, yes I have a very feminine face. Half the time IRL I am referred to as "son" "he" etc though. Do you really look at other guys in bathrooms that much anyway? Look them in the eye and have a think about what they have in their pants? If I were you I would just go in, do my thing and get out. Why concern yourself with the other guys in there? :-\
I wouldn't be so quick to assume you can spot a transgendered person so easily btw.
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Funny how this thread has evolved :orly:
Also, Alex you've been an awfully twatty lately :thumbup: I bet if I showed you some pics of both ftms and mtfs you wouldn't be able to tell for 3/4 of them.
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It is pretty easy to tell when someone is a M2F tran usually too.
I could make you eat those words. I mean not me personally...But others. But I is tired so I might see about doing something about this issue tomorrow. If I can be bothered.
I think I'm pretty good at telling the difference between M2F trans and women who were born female, assuming I can see the person's Adam's Apple.
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You two are really being defensive. I am just saying that is the only possible place where a problem would arise. All it has to do is with me having to take a shit and someone taking up the only stall in the restroom. I don't see any other possible places for me to have any issues with a tran person. It would either be the restroom or the locker room, which both should be a given.
Where was I referring to Soph specifically other than saying I wouldn't view Soph as a man in person? I just think you look feminine, always have. Why is that an insult to you? Do you really want to look manly or something? You look like a young woman that dresses like a guy to me. I can't blame you at all for that. Dressing like a woman would be a shitload of work and it isn't worth it. If I was a chick, I would dress like a dude too. Way more comfortable and less bullshit to put up with haha.
You were saying that chicks would freak out if they saw you in the women's room. I wouldn't even react if I saw you going in to take a piss in the men's room. I do my thing and leave. The only times I notice anything is when I have to wait on someone (like when I absolutely have to use a stall and it is being occupied by someone). I don't notice people in the restroom unless I have to wait in line and they are taking too long. Then I start to wonder "WTF is taking this person so long?". That is about the extent of my bathroom interactions, they rely on me being impatient... just like how I am at a store or anywhere else where there is a possibility of waiting in line.
I have not been twatty at all, but you sure have been a bit defensive and reactive. I don't look people in the eye outside of the restroom, why would I do it when I am trying to go take a piss? It seems like you are just trying to pick a fight Soph, that is all.
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It is pretty easy to tell when someone is a M2F tran usually too.
I could make you eat those words. I mean not me personally...But others. But I is tired so I might see about doing something about this issue tomorrow. If I can be bothered.
I think I'm pretty good at telling the difference between M2F trans and women who were born female, assuming I can see the person's Adam's Apple.
When I worked at AOL there were 4 different M2F trans working there and all of them were obvious to me. The Adam's Apple is indeed one of the dead giveaways. M2F trannys have to do a shitload of work just to look somewhat like a woman.
F2M trannies on the other hand get to be slackers like us men normally do. That I can understand. Fuck wearing makeup and shit haha. Also if you are a woman that can grow a moustache that is a bonus, as you don't even have to worry about shaving your face, nevermind shaving your arms or legs. Low maintenance ftw!
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You're an arse ::)
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I'm not bothered that you think I look feminine, Alex. I do look pretty feminine and I'm fine with that. A lot of trans guys who try and look really manly just end up looking like fat butch lesbians imo, and I don't wanna do that. I am pretty girly looking (features I mean) and that's ok with me. I don't have an overly manly personality either.
The only problem I have with being feminine-looking is that it makes me look a lot younger.
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I'm not bothered that you think I look feminine, Alex. I do look pretty feminine and I'm fine with that. A lot of trans guys who try and look really manly just end up looking like fat butch lesbians imo lol, and I don't wanna do that. I am pretty girly looking (features I mean) and that's ok with me. I don't have an overly manly personality either.
Yeah, don't change either way. It is not worth it just to attract women. There is bound to be some out there that will enjoy you just the way you are of course. Yeah do not do the fat butch lesbian thing, haha ever.
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I'm not getting surgery. I would consider hormones though, if only to make my life easier
I definitely wouldn't do anything just to attract women though. I mean if that was my plan, then I'd have better luck as a girl. If I pretended I was just a lesbian I reckon I could get girls fairly easily if I went to a gay club
Plenty of pansexual women around and I've talked to a lot online. Just none IRL. It's not a big deal atm though
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He's trying to say that transgendered aspies are harming other autistic people because others then associate autism with being transgendered. Also the sky is not purple.
And that being gay or trans is a lifestyle choice, as is anorexia (or was that PPK?)
PPK is a lifestyle choice? :o
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I'd assume even Alex would have to admit, these guys are prettier women than most women are:
http://www.missinternationalqueen.com/images/gallery/2009/gallery.html
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*smiles and nods at Hadron* Unless you're willing to present actual evidence to back up your claims I think we're done.
I don't need to, your the one claiming something exists without any evidence whatsoever.
You're*
I've presented plenty of evidence. Evidence that has citations, and further reading with verifiable research backing it up. You've presented... Well just your word.
And I'm not the only one claiming. You are also.
Present me a peer-reviewed legitimate scientific research article and then we might have something to discuss. Oh I forget, they don't exist, I wonder why
http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034
http://www.hawaii.edu/hivandaids/Sexual_Differentiation_of_the_Human_Brain__Relevance_for_Gender_Identity,_Transsexualism_and_Sexual_Orientation.pdf
http://brain.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/131/12/3132
http://www.gendermedicine.com/Uploads/assets/swaab.pdf
Also the ICD-10 is a peer reviewed medical and psychological diagnostic manual. And contains the following criteria:
F64 Gender identity disorders
F64.0 Transsexualism
A desire to live and be accepted as a member of the opposite sex, usually accompanied by a sense of discomfort with, or inappropriateness of, one's anatomic sex, and a wish to have surgery and hormonal treatment to make one's body as congruent as possible with one's preferred sex.
F64.1 Dual-role transvestism
The wearing of clothes of the opposite sex for part of the individual's existence in order to enjoy the temporary experience of membership of the opposite sex, but without any desire for a more permanent sex change or associated surgical reassignment, and without sexual excitement accompanying the cross-dressing.
Gender identity disorder of adolescence or adulthood, nontranssexual type
Excludes: fetishistic transvestism ( F65.1 )
F64.2 Gender identity disorder of childhood
A disorder, usually first manifest during early childhood (and always well before puberty), characterized by a persistent and intense distress about assigned sex, together with a desire to be (or insistence that one is) of the other sex. There is a persistent preoccupation with the dress and activities of the opposite sex and repudiation of the individual's own sex. The diagnosis requires a profound disturbance of the normal gender identity; mere tomboyishness in girls or girlish behaviour in boys is not sufficient. Gender identity disorders in individuals who have reached or are entering puberty should not be classified here but in F66.-.
Excludes: egodystonic sexual orientation ( F66.1 )
sexual maturation disorder ( F66.0 )
F64.8 Other gender identity disorders
F64.9 Gender identity disorder, unspecified
Gender-role disorder NOS
The DSM-IV the american psychological diagnostic manual contains this:
Diagnostic Criteria for Gender Identity Disorder
* A. A strong persistent cross-gender identification (not merely a desire for any perceived cultural advantages of being the other sex). In children, the disturbance is manifested by four (or more) of the following:
1. Repeatedly stated desire to be, or insistence that he or she is, the other sex.
2. In boys, preference for cross-dressing or simulating female attire; In girls, insistence on wearing only stereotypical masculine clothing.
3. Strong and persistent preferences for cross-sex roles in make believe play or persistent fantasies of being the other sex.
4. Intense desire to participate in the stereotypical games and pastimes of the other sex.
5. Strong preference for playmates of the other sex.
In adolescents and adults, the disturbance is manifested by symptoms such as a stated desire to be the other sex, frequent passing as the other sex, desire to live or be treated as the other sex, or the conviction that he or she has the typical feelings and reactions of the other sex.
* B. Persistent discomfort with his or her sex or sense of inappropriateness in the gender role of that sex.
In children, the disturbance is manifested by any of the following:
In boys, assertion that his penis or testes are disgusting or will disappear or assertion that it would be better not to have a penis, or aversion toward rough-and-tumble play and rejection of male stereotypical toys, games, and activities.
In girls, rejection of urinating in a sitting position, assertion that she has or will grow a penis, or assertion that she does not want to grow breasts or menstruate, or marked aversion toward normative feminine clothing.
In adolescents and adults, the disturbance is manifested by symptoms such as preoccupation with getting rid of primary and secondary sex characteristics (e.g., request for hormones, surgery, or other procedures to physically alter sexual characteristics to simulate the other sex) or belief that he or she was born the wrong sex.
* C. The disturbance is not concurrent with physical intersex condition.
* D. The disturbance causes clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.
Code based on current age:
* 302.6 Gender Identity Disorder in Children
* 302.85 Gender Identity Disorder in Adolescents or Adults
Specify if (for sexually mature individuals):
* Sexually Attracted to Males
* Sexually Attracted to Females
* Sexually Attracted to Both
* Sexually Attracted to Neither
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I'd assume even Alex would have to admit, these guys are prettier women than most women are:
http://www.missinternationalqueen.com/images/gallery/2009/gallery.html
Oh that title is hilarious. I am sure almost all of them are on some serious hormones. Maybe some plastic surgery as well. I have already stated I have seen very convincing photos of trans models before, who has not? Those are tranny beauty pageant contestants, not the everyday person. It just seems a bit insane for someone to do that much shit to make themselves look different. I just have never put that much thought into my physical appearance, and it shows in how I dress lol. I don't even understand metrosexual dudes in that way as well, it is just too much work for too little benefit. I like to shower in the morning, dry off fast and leave. I do not see why someone would choose to get up every day super early and do all the shit a woman does to get ready in the morning. It is a form of insanity or psychological disorder in that way. OCD in that they are obsessed with their appearance, but they are focused towards one gender role (the opposite of the traditional gender of their sex). Would make life a huge pain in the ass if you had to dress up as a woman. Dressing like a guy, that is pretty damn easy.
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You're an arse ::)
You are an ass, not an arse. A jackass.
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I'd assume even Alex would have to admit, these guys are prettier women than most women are:
http://www.missinternationalqueen.com/images/gallery/2009/gallery.html
Oh that title is hilarious. I am sure almost all of them are on some serious hormones. Maybe some plastic surgery as well. I have already stated I have seen very convincing photos of trans models before, who has not? Those are tranny beauty pageant contestants, not the everyday person. It just seems a bit insane for someone to do that much shit to make themselves look different. I just have never put that much thought into my physical appearance, and it shows in how I dress lol. I don't even understand metrosexual dudes in that way as well, it is just too much work for too little benefit. I like to shower in the morning, dry off fast and leave. I do not see why someone would choose to get up every day super early and do all the shit a woman does to get ready in the morning. It is a form of insanity or psychological disorder in that way. OCD in that they are obsessed with their appearance, but they are focused towards one gender role (the opposite of the traditional gender of their sex). Would make life a huge pain in the ass if you had to dress up as a woman. Dressing like a guy, that is pretty damn easy.
Dude all of the above could be said about most bio women as well. I don't understand why any women (trans or not) can be arsed making so much effort with their appearance. Although I'm glad they do
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I'd assume even Alex would have to admit, these guys are prettier women than most women are:
http://www.missinternationalqueen.com/images/gallery/2009/gallery.html
Oh that title is hilarious. I am sure almost all of them are on some serious hormones. Maybe some plastic surgery as well. I have already stated I have seen very convincing photos of trans models before, who has not? Those are tranny beauty pageant contestants, not the everyday person. It just seems a bit insane for someone to do that much shit to make themselves look different. I just have never put that much thought into my physical appearance, and it shows in how I dress lol. I don't even understand metrosexual dudes in that way as well, it is just too much work for too little benefit. I like to shower in the morning, dry off fast and leave. I do not see why someone would choose to get up every day super early and do all the shit a woman does to get ready in the morning. It is a form of insanity or psychological disorder in that way. OCD in that they are obsessed with their appearance, but they are focused towards one gender role (the opposite of the traditional gender of their sex). Would make life a huge pain in the ass if you had to dress up as a woman. Dressing like a guy, that is pretty damn easy.
Dude all of the above could be said about most bio women as well. I don't understand why any women (trans or not) can be arsed making so much effort with their appearance. Although I'm glad they do
Very true. The reason why biological women do it because that is what has been expected of them for so long. That is how their gender role formed in each respective society. They think that they have to do all that work (well a lot of them do in a sense). I like that women care about their looks, but they have men to blame in a sense for that. Kids are taught at a young age, this is what boys do and this is what girls do, etcetera. I think most biological women are crazy, their behavior is hardwired in a sense and still chaotic. I stopped trying to make sense of women a long time ago.
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I know an MTF trans that barely bothers with makeup or wearing fashionable clothes or any of that.
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I know an MTF trans that barely bothers with makeup or wearing fashionable clothes or any of that.
That is probably why one of our neighbours mistook her for a guy. Twice.
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(http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/11_03/Gemma3REX_468x829.jpg)
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I know an MTF trans that barely bothers with makeup or wearing fashionable clothes or any of that.
That is probably why one of our neighbours mistook her for a guy. Twice.
When?
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(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a4/Vaginal_opening_-_english_description.jpg)
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(http://cache.jalopnik.com/assets/resources/2008/05/Naked-Vagina-Bike.jpg)
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(http://www.artfagcity.com/wordpress_core/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/vagina.jpg)
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(http://cache.jalopnik.com/assets/resources/2008/05/Naked-Vagina-Bike.jpg)
In Soviet Russia, pussy eats you.
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At last, a video game even non-gaming guys will like.
Vagina Hero!!!
(http://www.orangeek.org/images/vagina_hero.jpg)
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(http://media.ebaumsworld.com/picture/krail969/SandyVagina.png)
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(http://myvaginablog.com/files/vagina%20dentata.jpg)
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(http://images.benquick.net/d/22265-1/the-other-vagina.jpg)
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(http://graylenses.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/wall_of_vagina.jpg)
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Vagina Hero looks like a real winner.
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(http://files.sharenator.com/funny_202_20beer_20why1copy_1_Beer_Vs_Vagina-s574x612-21669-580.jpg)
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I know an MTF trans that barely bothers with makeup or wearing fashionable clothes or any of that.
That is probably why one of our neighbours mistook her for a guy. Twice.
Mistook? Now I'm confused :laugh:
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*smiles and nods at Hadron* Unless you're willing to present actual evidence to back up your claims I think we're done.
I don't need to, your the one claiming something exists without any evidence whatsoever.
You're*
I've presented plenty of evidence. Evidence that has citations, and further reading with verifiable research backing it up. You've presented... Well just your word.
And I'm not the only one claiming. You are also.
Present me a peer-reviewed legitimate scientific research article and then we might have something to discuss. Oh I forget, they don't exist, I wonder why
http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034
http://www.hawaii.edu/hivandaids/Sexual_Differentiation_of_the_Human_Brain__Relevance_for_Gender_Identity,_Transsexualism_and_Sexual_Orientation.pdf
http://brain.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/131/12/3132
http://www.gendermedicine.com/Uploads/assets/swaab.pdf
Also the ICD-10 is a peer reviewed medical and psychological diagnostic manual. And contains the following criteria:
F64 Gender identity disorders
F64.0 Transsexualism
A desire to live and be accepted as a member of the opposite sex, usually accompanied by a sense of discomfort with, or inappropriateness of, one's anatomic sex, and a wish to have surgery and hormonal treatment to make one's body as congruent as possible with one's preferred sex.
F64.1 Dual-role transvestism
The wearing of clothes of the opposite sex for part of the individual's existence in order to enjoy the temporary experience of membership of the opposite sex, but without any desire for a more permanent sex change or associated surgical reassignment, and without sexual excitement accompanying the cross-dressing.
Gender identity disorder of adolescence or adulthood, nontranssexual type
Excludes: fetishistic transvestism ( F65.1 )
F64.2 Gender identity disorder of childhood
A disorder, usually first manifest during early childhood (and always well before puberty), characterized by a persistent and intense distress about assigned sex, together with a desire to be (or insistence that one is) of the other sex. There is a persistent preoccupation with the dress and activities of the opposite sex and repudiation of the individual's own sex. The diagnosis requires a profound disturbance of the normal gender identity; mere tomboyishness in girls or girlish behaviour in boys is not sufficient. Gender identity disorders in individuals who have reached or are entering puberty should not be classified here but in F66.-.
Excludes: egodystonic sexual orientation ( F66.1 )
sexual maturation disorder ( F66.0 )
F64.8 Other gender identity disorders
F64.9 Gender identity disorder, unspecified
Gender-role disorder NOS
The DSM-IV the american psychological diagnostic manual contains this:
Diagnostic Criteria for Gender Identity Disorder
* A. A strong persistent cross-gender identification (not merely a desire for any perceived cultural advantages of being the other sex). In children, the disturbance is manifested by four (or more) of the following:
1. Repeatedly stated desire to be, or insistence that he or she is, the other sex.
2. In boys, preference for cross-dressing or simulating female attire; In girls, insistence on wearing only stereotypical masculine clothing.
3. Strong and persistent preferences for cross-sex roles in make believe play or persistent fantasies of being the other sex.
4. Intense desire to participate in the stereotypical games and pastimes of the other sex.
5. Strong preference for playmates of the other sex.
In adolescents and adults, the disturbance is manifested by symptoms such as a stated desire to be the other sex, frequent passing as the other sex, desire to live or be treated as the other sex, or the conviction that he or she has the typical feelings and reactions of the other sex.
* B. Persistent discomfort with his or her sex or sense of inappropriateness in the gender role of that sex.
In children, the disturbance is manifested by any of the following:
In boys, assertion that his penis or testes are disgusting or will disappear or assertion that it would be better not to have a penis, or aversion toward rough-and-tumble play and rejection of male stereotypical toys, games, and activities.
In girls, rejection of urinating in a sitting position, assertion that she has or will grow a penis, or assertion that she does not want to grow breasts or menstruate, or marked aversion toward normative feminine clothing.
In adolescents and adults, the disturbance is manifested by symptoms such as preoccupation with getting rid of primary and secondary sex characteristics (e.g., request for hormones, surgery, or other procedures to physically alter sexual characteristics to simulate the other sex) or belief that he or she was born the wrong sex.
* C. The disturbance is not concurrent with physical intersex condition.
* D. The disturbance causes clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.
Code based on current age:
* 302.6 Gender Identity Disorder in Children
* 302.85 Gender Identity Disorder in Adolescents or Adults
Specify if (for sexually mature individuals):
* Sexually Attracted to Males
* Sexually Attracted to Females.
* Sexually Attracted to Both
* Sexually Attracted to Neither
None of that actually disproves any of my arguments, if you read through the papers carefully. You could find differences like that (i.e. on that magnitude) in devoutly religious people; religion is equally a lifestyle choice.
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I know an MTF trans that barely bothers with makeup or wearing fashionable clothes or any of that.
That is probably why one of our neighbours mistook her for a guy. Twice.
Mistook? Now I'm confused :laugh:
It should be the other way around, but we are being politically correct to the trans community. Ignoring the fact that the person is really a man, and wants to be "mistook" for a woman.
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I dunno where you live alex, but where I live people don't tend to look like a walking penis or a walking vagina
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I dunno where you live alex, but where I live people don't tend to look like a walking penis or a walking vagina
We have nude beaches in Florida. Try to be transgendered at a nude beach.
It does not matter what they look like, as with enough effort you can make yourself look like just about anything. Just because a furry wears an extremely convincing costume, doesn't make him/her that particular animal. It is still a man under all that costume. Just because you dress, walk and talk like a man, it doesn't make you a man. There are biological men that aren't even men in a sense that they don't know what being a man is about. Clothing is just a costume of sorts, but with practical uses in that it keeps us warm in cold weather.
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What the fuck are you on about :lol:
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What the fuck are you on about :lol:
The truth that you are in denial about. People are just apes that wear clothes and dress up in attempts to establish individuality. Other than to keep warm, clothes do not serve as much of a purpose other than to separate people.
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There are biological men that aren't even men in a sense that they don't know what being a man is about.
Enlighten us then. What is being a man all about exactly?
Clothing is just a costume of sorts, but with practical uses in that it keeps us warm in cold weather.
No one's denying that. A woman wearing guys' clothes isn't a guy. And a man dressed up in a skirt and make up isn't a woman. Transvestites are men/women who dress up as a different sex. Transgendered people aren't just drag queens
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*smiles and nods at Hadron* Unless you're willing to present actual evidence to back up your claims I think we're done.
I don't need to, your the one claiming something exists without any evidence whatsoever.
You're*
I've presented plenty of evidence. Evidence that has citations, and further reading with verifiable research backing it up. You've presented... Well just your word.
And I'm not the only one claiming. You are also.
Present me a peer-reviewed legitimate scientific research article and then we might have something to discuss. Oh I forget, they don't exist, I wonder why
http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034
http://www.hawaii.edu/hivandaids/Sexual_Differentiation_of_the_Human_Brain__Relevance_for_Gender_Identity,_Transsexualism_and_Sexual_Orientation.pdf
http://brain.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/content/abstract/131/12/3132
http://www.gendermedicine.com/Uploads/assets/swaab.pdf
Also the ICD-10 is a peer reviewed medical and psychological diagnostic manual. And contains the following criteria:
F64 Gender identity disorders
F64.0 Transsexualism
A desire to live and be accepted as a member of the opposite sex, usually accompanied by a sense of discomfort with, or inappropriateness of, one's anatomic sex, and a wish to have surgery and hormonal treatment to make one's body as congruent as possible with one's preferred sex.
F64.1 Dual-role transvestism
The wearing of clothes of the opposite sex for part of the individual's existence in order to enjoy the temporary experience of membership of the opposite sex, but without any desire for a more permanent sex change or associated surgical reassignment, and without sexual excitement accompanying the cross-dressing.
Gender identity disorder of adolescence or adulthood, nontranssexual type
Excludes: fetishistic transvestism ( F65.1 )
F64.2 Gender identity disorder of childhood
A disorder, usually first manifest during early childhood (and always well before puberty), characterized by a persistent and intense distress about assigned sex, together with a desire to be (or insistence that one is) of the other sex. There is a persistent preoccupation with the dress and activities of the opposite sex and repudiation of the individual's own sex. The diagnosis requires a profound disturbance of the normal gender identity; mere tomboyishness in girls or girlish behaviour in boys is not sufficient. Gender identity disorders in individuals who have reached or are entering puberty should not be classified here but in F66.-.
Excludes: egodystonic sexual orientation ( F66.1 )
sexual maturation disorder ( F66.0 )
F64.8 Other gender identity disorders
F64.9 Gender identity disorder, unspecified
Gender-role disorder NOS
The DSM-IV the american psychological diagnostic manual contains this:
Diagnostic Criteria for Gender Identity Disorder
* A. A strong persistent cross-gender identification (not merely a desire for any perceived cultural advantages of being the other sex). In children, the disturbance is manifested by four (or more) of the following:
1. Repeatedly stated desire to be, or insistence that he or she is, the other sex.
2. In boys, preference for cross-dressing or simulating female attire; In girls, insistence on wearing only stereotypical masculine clothing.
3. Strong and persistent preferences for cross-sex roles in make believe play or persistent fantasies of being the other sex.
4. Intense desire to participate in the stereotypical games and pastimes of the other sex.
5. Strong preference for playmates of the other sex.
In adolescents and adults, the disturbance is manifested by symptoms such as a stated desire to be the other sex, frequent passing as the other sex, desire to live or be treated as the other sex, or the conviction that he or she has the typical feelings and reactions of the other sex.
* B. Persistent discomfort with his or her sex or sense of inappropriateness in the gender role of that sex.
In children, the disturbance is manifested by any of the following:
In boys, assertion that his penis or testes are disgusting or will disappear or assertion that it would be better not to have a penis, or aversion toward rough-and-tumble play and rejection of male stereotypical toys, games, and activities.
In girls, rejection of urinating in a sitting position, assertion that she has or will grow a penis, or assertion that she does not want to grow breasts or menstruate, or marked aversion toward normative feminine clothing.
In adolescents and adults, the disturbance is manifested by symptoms such as preoccupation with getting rid of primary and secondary sex characteristics (e.g., request for hormones, surgery, or other procedures to physically alter sexual characteristics to simulate the other sex) or belief that he or she was born the wrong sex.
* C. The disturbance is not concurrent with physical intersex condition.
* D. The disturbance causes clinically significant distress or impairment in social, occupational, or other important areas of functioning.
Code based on current age:
* 302.6 Gender Identity Disorder in Children
* 302.85 Gender Identity Disorder in Adolescents or Adults
Specify if (for sexually mature individuals):
* Sexually Attracted to Males
* Sexually Attracted to Females
* Sexually Attracted to Both
* Sexually Attracted to Neither
Hadron wanted peer-reviewed scientific material. He got it. :plus:
It's interesting that these things are labelled as "disorders", though, isn't it?
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Hadron wanted peer-reviewed scientific material. He got it. :plus:
It's interesting that these things are labelled as "disorders", though, isn't it?
Homosexuality itself was listed as a disorder in the DSM a couple of revisions ago. Frankly you can still sneak it in under sexual disorder NOS under the third example (basically, being homosexual and not feeling OK about it).
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Everyone is acting in poor taste here the sooner its over the better
You are right parts, I read your post, then looked down. I was on page 1 and there are 23! I must read on!
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There are biological men that aren't even men in a sense that they don't know what being a man is about.
Enlighten us then. What is being a man all about exactly?
Clothing is just a costume of sorts, but with practical uses in that it keeps us warm in cold weather.
No one's denying that. A woman wearing guys' clothes isn't a guy. And a man dressed up in a skirt and make up isn't a woman. Transvestites are men/women who dress up as a different sex. Transgendered people aren't just drag queens
They are irresponsible and mature. I am really immature myself, so I would know where I am as far as maturation goes. At least I can support myself somewhat haha. Being a man is more than just getting a woman pregnant for example. Plenty of guys do that and then shirk the responsibility entirely.
Transgendered people want to be the opposite sex, but they start it before puberty. They want to be almost everything that goes along with the stereotypical roles assigned to the opposite sex. Stereotypes that have been reinforced for thousands of years, they reject and go against. I know what a transgendered person is. They do more than just cross dress. A transsexual goes a lot further when they get surgery and start taking hormones. Drag queens can be total part timers, it is a fetish of sorts or hobby in a way for some.
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It's interesting that these things are labelled as "disorders", though, isn't it?
A disorder is anything (not literally anything) that causes a person discomfort in their life. Homosexuality doesn't generally cause people discomfort in life and it's beginning to become accepted in society. Gender Identity Disorder does cause discomfort and requires treatment of some sort (even just psycho-therapy), thus it is a disorder.
Transgendered people want to be the opposite sex, but they start it before puberty. They want to be almost everything that goes along with the stereotypical roles assigned to the opposite sex. Stereotypes that have been reinforced for thousands of years, they reject and go against. I know what a transgendered person is. They do more than just cross dress. A transsexual goes a lot further when they get surgery and start taking hormones. Drag queens can be total part timers, it is a fetish of sorts or hobby in a way for some.
Wrong.
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They are irresponsible and mature. I am really immature myself, so I would know where I am as far as maturation goes. At least I can support myself somewhat haha. Being a man is more than just getting a woman pregnant for example. Plenty of guys do that and then shirk the responsibility entirely.
I'm not sure what this has to do with anything. Not bothering with your kid is about being an asshole, not being a man.
Transgendered people want to be the opposite sex, but they start it before puberty.
Start what before puberty?
They want to be almost everything that goes along with the stereotypical roles assigned to the opposite sex. Stereotypes that have been reinforced for thousands of years, they reject and go against. I know what a transgendered person is. They do more than just cross dress. A transsexual goes a lot further when they get surgery and start taking hormones. Drag queens can be total part timers, it is a fetish of sorts or hobby in a way for some.
You say you know what a transgendered person is, but then you prove that you don't by the comments you make in the very same post. I think I've already said myself that I am more androgynous personality-wise than pretty much anyone else I know. I don't in any way want to be your typical manly man, and plenty of MTF are tomboyish.
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I know an MTF trans that barely bothers with makeup or wearing fashionable clothes or any of that.
That is probably why one of our neighbours mistook her for a guy. Twice.
Mistook? Now I'm confused :laugh:
It should be the other way around, but we are being politically correct to the trans community. Ignoring the fact that the person is really a man, and wants to be "mistook" for a woman.
Hard to explain. The person I know has a female's name and dresses in girls' shirts. GA invites this person to stay at our house overnight sometimes which means that our neighbour has seen this person a number of times and has referred to them as "that young man" twice.
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Soph, what I posted was closer to the diagnosis in what GA posted as far as transgendered goes.
Gender identity disorder of childhood
A disorder, usually first manifest during early childhood (and always well before puberty), characterized by a persistent and intense distress about assigned sex, together with a desire to be (or insistence that one is) of the other sex. There is a persistent preoccupation with the dress and activities of the opposite sex and repudiation of the individual's own sex. The diagnosis requires a profound disturbance of the normal gender identity; mere tomboyishness in girls or girlish behaviour in boys is not sufficient.
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Soph, what I posted was closer to the diagnosis in what GA posted as far as transgendered goes.
Gender identity disorder of childhood
A disorder, usually first manifest during early childhood (and always well before puberty), characterized by a persistent and intense distress about assigned sex, together with a desire to be (or insistence that one is) of the other sex. There is a persistent preoccupation with the dress and activities of the opposite sex and repudiation of the individual's own sex. The diagnosis requires a profound disturbance of the normal gender identity; mere tomboyishness in girls or girlish behaviour in boys is not sufficient.
The criteria for children is different to adults.
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There are biological men that aren't even men in a sense that they don't know what being a man is about.
Enlighten us then. What is being a man all about exactly?
That Soph is something that you will have to discover for yourself but it doesn't come with a set of ready instruction or definitions. It may mean understanding what things you are raise and culture to accept as part of your socialisation. Some will be beneficial and some not. To drop them all and to accept other cultural and social more and values as your own is part of the deal. No pick and choosing. You likely will get there in time if you care to do so.
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Hahahahaha wtf
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I don't know either. This little gnome-like man seems to be talking, but I can't work out what it is he's saying. :-\
Maybe he's saying he wishes he didn't have a receding hairline. Maybe he's saying he wishes he had a life. Who knows, who cares? Not me
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(http://www.intensitysquared.com/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=8976;type=avatar)
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I don't know either. This little gnome-like man seems to be talking, but I can't work out what it is he's saying. :-\
Maybe he's saying he wishes he didn't have a receding hairline. Maybe he's saying he wishes he had a life. Who knows, who cares? Not me
I am not prepare to dumb it down for you Soph. Let's say broadly though that you and Bint both act like a couple of bored, self-centred teenage girls. That is nothing to do with what you are just what you come across as. You have of course both been socialised and cultured into being girls and even though Soph says that he identifies as a man.
As stupid as Soph is (and let's not unnecessarily under-rate this) he will not be able to exorcise or trade those social mores, value and trappings easily, nor automatically become masculine. Nor will reading a book or asking questions do more than provide a rough starting point to what a man is.
Soph doesn't have much of a clue. Regardless of the way Soph identifies himself or how useless he is being convincingly masculine, in time it may become more apparent. At the moment his looks like a plain girl and acts like a stupid girl. In time who knows.
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lol
Convincing? I'm not trying to be a man. I've said so myself plenty of times - I'm not very masculine and I'm fine with that.
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The binary runs deep in this one. :: nods :: :P
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Look it is highly hypothetical BUT if I was to tomorrow suddenly feel that I was perhaps transgendered myself, and If I was to feel within myself that I was not a male but perhaps more female than man and waned to embrace that, I would HAVE to realise that my life and all it was built on would need to change.
I would appreciate that every step in life and every interaction I had and indeed many of the values and social and cultural mores that I had accepted as inherent to who I was would need revisiting.
I am not saying this would be easy or that I would just be a chick. This is a cop out. I would need to tear down this foundations and rebuild brick by brick. It would not matter if I had accepted being a transgendered female at that point. That would be a start and nothing more.
To grow and accept this as a new way of me being me, I would have to examine every fundamental aspect of me and defend it and learn what being a woman was about. I would need to take on the bad aspects with the good and defend everything.
Not easy, but then I don't think anyone but the truly ignorant would say it was.
Now if I say that Soph holds on by all appearances, female socialisation or behaves like a female, this is identifying that perhaps (as much as Soph may have started the road to self-actualisation to a masculine identity) that perhaps Soph has a ways to go.
Enough perhaps to get GA's knickers in a twist but at its core pretty lightweight in what is said.
Funnily if Soph or GA for that matter have recently (in terms of years of their life) accepted their transgendered identities, it would be ridiculous to believe that they would automatically be what they identify as. They would take sometime to become or reach self-actualisation. In the meantime they have to learn and evolve. It is not simply a matter of making a decision or feeling they identify as this gender and "Hey Presto".
I am not saying this and I don't believe I ever have or that they would even expect this.
I don't know why either would be sensitive about it either.
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Look it is highly hypothetical BUT if I was to tomorrow suddenly feel that I was perhaps transgendered myself, and If I was to feel within myself that I was not a male but perhaps more female than man and waned to embrace that, I would HAVE to realise that my life and all it was built on would need to change.
I would appreciate that every step in life and every interaction I had and indeed many of the values and social and cultural mores that I had accepted as inherent to who I was would need revisiting.
I am not saying this would be easy or that I would just be a chick. This is a cop out. I would need to tear down this foundations and rebuild brick by brick. It would not matter if I had accepted being a transgendered female at that point. That would be a start and nothing more.
To grow and accept this as a new way of me being me, I would have to examine every fundamental aspect of me and defend it and learn what being a woman was about. I would need to take on the bad aspects with the good and defend everything.
Not easy, but then I don't think anyone but the truly ignorant would say it was.
Now if I say that Soph holds on by all appearances, female socialisation or behaves like a female, this is identifying that perhaps (as much as Soph may have started the road to self-actualisation to a masculine identity) that perhaps Soph has a ways to go.
Enough perhaps to get GA's knickers in a twist but at its core pretty lightweight in what is said.
Funnily if Soph or GA for that matter have recently (in terms of years of their life) accepted their transgendered identities, it would be ridiculous to believe that they would automatically be what they identify as. They would take sometime to become or reach self-actualisation. In the meantime they have to learn and evolve. It is not simply a matter of making a decision or feeling they identify as this gender and "Hey Presto".
I am not saying this and I don't believe I ever have or that they would even expect this.
I don't know why either would be sensitive about it either.
You surprise me. Perhaps there is more to you than the majority of you posts would indicate.
What you've said is pretty accurate but you come at it from the wrong angle. But the I am exhausted of explaining it all. The basics are being transgender doesn't "onset", the accepted theory is that it's always been there, that the transgendered person often tries to identify as their birth-assigned gender, they try to fit in, but they don't. It doesn't work. This is where transgenderedness comes from. They realise that they can not fit, do not want to fit, fit in elsewhere, or something along those lines. This can take years, some people not fully realising until much later in life, some much earlier like Kim Petras.
What you elude to, in "female socialisation" is cultural imprinting of the gender binary. People expect certain behaviours from certain people and react in a way expectant of such behaviours. Meaning "See Male: Interact as with Male." and vice versa. Every one has a certain "script" pre-loaded on how to interact with male or female. Society "decrees"* that every member fit into either Male or Female, and that behaviours match outward appearance. Society, as us autistics should be well aware of, is often flawed in magnificent ways.
*= Decrees implies some sort of law making committee, but society is merely a product of the majority's perceived* opinions, stereotypes, etc.
*= There is research to suggest that people will sacrifice their own opinions in favour of a perceived majority opinion, even if a statistical majority of people don't agree with this perceived opinion. Therein like the problems with society.
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Kim Petras:
(http://i.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/01289/kim-petras_1289473i.jpg)
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No and here you must see that we are all autistic (aside from a few notables like Bint) and we know what it is like "fitting in" with a society which is not set up to cater for the diversity from which we belong to. We know this inherently yet we endeavour to fit in best we can despite it. Part of that is evolving into embracing what we are and are not and finding what we can accept as fundamentally us and what is in flux and what is worth throwing out and what is worth modifying, and that is not a one off.
Transgender is not a lifestyle choice but neither is autism. Transgender is a difference from birth as is Autism. That is not saying that because you are Autistic that recognition on this is somehow a time of complete enlightenment in which everything about you is placed at your feet and you instantly adapt. Neither is recognising yourself as Transgender.
How long does it take to deconstruct the identity and all that baggage? How long to reconstruct (whist continually still receiving the same cultural and societal data)?
Hell as much as an authority as you hold yourself out to be on Transgender and how comfortable you both are neither of you could be expected to give these answers because they are ambiguous.
Questioning these things is not a sign of intolerance and ought not be seen as some intolerant fault. Better to have this and defend your position and shore up things from all sides. My best mates objected in a big way when I let them know I was on the Autism Spectrum. In gently showing them how and why and where it affected me was a help to understanding myself and perhaps appreciate this. Better than them not questioning it and not eventually coming around to understanding it themselves. What I did not do though was to play the intolerance card or the "you are not getting it" card.
As I say shining a light on Soph's gender or pointing out what I see as anomalies is no biggie in my book and I think you have looked at it from the wrong angle. Why? Because you are sensitive and you are wanting to see Transgender vs non-transgender issues. There is a word for this approach to difference.
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Am I totally mistranslating this, or is Sir Les trying to say that in order to identify as female, one must act traditionally female/feminine, and in order to identify as male, one must act traditionally male/masculine? Because, shit, that would pretty much rob me of my gender.
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I don't think he himself knows what he's on about.
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i would be male. i took a gender test and came out as male. i also typically think in a male way and don't understand women at all. but i like having a female body, i mean i don't mind it, nor do i mind make up or being girly. people who have some weird gender stereotype in their heads are just afraid. les is probably afraid to face the ambiguousness of gender and sexuality.
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Les can you just explain what you're on about in a couple sentences? It's difficult to understand your long posts sometimes (I'm sure you'll say that's me being thick, but I don't care. and I'm not taking the piss, I really do find it difficult to read what you're saying sometimes)
I don't care if people think I'm not masculine enough or I'm too girly or I can't be a guy coz I have a squeeky voice. None of these things mean shit to me and I din't think I'm sensitive - obviously if people are talking about me then I'm gonna reply, especially if I think what they'er saying about me is wrong
Anyway, basically what I am saying is I don't care if OTHER people view me as not being masculine enough to be a guy. I know who and what I am myself, and I am cool with that.
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I wasn't taking the piss either- I'm assuming I was wrong, but I'm not totally sure. I'm with Lemon Aguilera, though, I'm prolly at least as much mentally male as female, but I'm pretty damn grounded in both my sex and my gender being female.
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I am not very masculine or female really. Sort of in the middle. But I definitely don't see myself as a woman just coz I'm a bit of a ponce :P
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And I don't think of myself as a man even though I love fucking, spend much time and effort on pursiung said activity, and think women are easy on the eyes but often far too batshit fucknuts to be worth the damn effort.
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I think I'm quite girly.
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I'm pretty neutral. I have a my girly moments and then not. Depends on who I'm with and what I'm doing.
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I'm pretty neutral. I have a my girly moments and then not. Depends what I'm on and who I'm doing.
fixed
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I'm pretty neutral. I have a my girly moments and then not. Depends what I'm on and who I'm doing.
fixed
:plus:
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Am I totally mistranslating this, or is Sir Les trying to say that in order to identify as female, one must act traditionally female/feminine, and in order to identify as male, one must act traditionally male/masculine? Because, shit, that would pretty much rob me of my gender.
No you don't. Were you though to consider yourself Transgender you would need to understand and appreciate yourself what the gender you identified yourself was about (anything less is just bullshit). I could say at this point being a man is having a penis and being a woman is having a vagina. This is a cop out. A lot of who we are is to do with cultural and societal mores and how we fall in line in behaviour and thinking. How we take this on without question and adopt the thinking as our own. Questioning, replacing and modifying this brings us closer to accepting that identity and taking that role. To what you HAVE to change that is a personal choice of course. Ought Soph Soph fart with impunity, wolf whistle girls in the street and scratch her genitals in an over the top caricature to adopt stereotypical bloke associated roles? No. At the same time if the only change Soph was to make was in the idea Soph was a not a girl and that Soph wanted to be known as the other gender, not have a feminine associated haircut or clothes, this is hardly more than lip service to being other than your physical gender. Somewhere between the two extremes is where Soph is. Some stuff Soph will replace and object to and some stuff Soph will not replace as it will not suit the way Soph will be comfortable with. In the meantime Soph will have this process to go through and have to question and defend pretty much all aspects of life from time to time.
Les can you just explain what you're on about in a couple sentences? It's difficult to understand your long posts sometimes (I'm sure you'll say that's me being thick, but I don't care. and I'm not taking the piss, I really do find it difficult to read what you're saying sometimes)
I don't care if people think I'm not masculine enough or I'm too girly or I can't be a guy coz I have a squeeky voice. None of these things mean shit to me and I din't think I'm sensitive - obviously if people are talking about me then I'm gonna reply, especially if I think what they'er saying about me is wrong
Anyway, basically what I am saying is I don't care if OTHER people view me as not being masculine enough to be a guy. I know who and what I am myself, and I am cool with that.
You are perfectly able to be who or whatever you want to be and have the right to defend that. Transgender is a way of being and not a lifestyle choice. However from the moment you are born society has been bombarding you with values and mores. In order to understand the gender that you identify as you need to understand what that is. If you don't and if you say,"No I am all good I will be whatever I am and call myself "he"", without understanding what "he" means or what "male" is about, then you will fall short of anything approaching "he" and "male".
i would be male. i took a gender test and came out as male. i also typically think in a male way and don't understand women at all. but i like having a female body, i mean i don't mind it, nor do i mind make up or being girly. people who have some weird gender stereotype in their heads are just afraid. les is probably afraid to face the ambiguousness of gender and sexuality.
I don't have "some weird gender stereotype in my head". I know that gender is ambiguous. Of course it is easy to accuse and harder to back isn't it Milla. "les is probably afraid to face the ambiguousness of gender and sexuality." Probably not. Back your bullshit Milla.
I don't think he himself knows what he's on about.
That is pure projection Bint. You have no fucking clue and this is why spam works for you so well and why you are constantly in a rut of despair and despondency. You are too stupid to take control of your situation and too idiotic to see what crap you are about to put yourself into. Don't know what you are on about? That is so you, you fucking loser.
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I don't see why I need to do or be anything other than myself.
No two men and no two women are the same and I don't understand what it is to be a man any more than I understand what it is to be a woman. That doesn't matter to me. I understand what I am and I know where I see myself on any kind of gender spectrum.
Plenty of biologically male guys are very feminine as well and don't fit the stereotype, yet that doesn't make them any less of [whatever they identify as]
You can all sit here all day saying I should do this or neeed to appreciate that etc etc etc. None of that means shit to me really. I'm happy with being somewher in the middle when it comes to some masculine-feminine scale
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I don't identify as male or female really. More neutral, I guess. My mum used to try and get me to wear girly clothes but I never liked them. Recently I said something about wearing guys clothes and she said that it was because of my sensory issues. Ok then... :zoinks:
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lol My mum thinks I wear guys clothes coz of sensory stuff as well. She thinks most stuf is down to my AS though
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The binary view gender is flawed and false. I tried to explain that. But it seems some people just don't get it.
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i'm a gay penguin
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This thread annoys me now. *stops watching*
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Gender itself is ambiguous. However it's social expectations of gender roles, that enforces that notion that by biological sex that all men are masculine, all women are feminine. If you try to deviate from expectation, you'll become alienated by those who strongly believe in those expectations. It's also hard to alter expectations to add diversity, because people feel secure about themselves in certainty, and having absolute conceptions of what is right or wrong, what is good or evil, what is safe or dangerous helps fulfil that certainty. When that certainty is threatened, they'll automatically perceive it as a threat or be so scared of it, they will prefer to destroy or hide it, rather than try to understand it.
You'll find that problem applies to nearly every issue of prejudice that exist.
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Buy hey, I didn't write the social rules. Personally, I find it petty and ridiculous to hold such negative views against others over things like that. I mean humanity has reached a level where prejudice of difference should be a dying concept, not recurring.
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Prejudice of difference will always be here. The best way is to grow a pair and ignore it, rather than trying to combat it.
Besides, pretty much everyone is prejudiced to some degree and it affects all walks of lives and viewpoints. For example, people almost instantly prejudice if you have a different viewpoint and try to tell you that what you think is wrong and what they think is right. They will look down on the people who disagree, similar to how people look down on blacks, similar to people who look down on smokers, etc.
This is why I think it's pretty silly to try to advocate for change and whatnot, if change happens it will never get rid of the underlying prejudice and will only mask it. People who advocated for change will still endure this prejudice.
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Prejudice of difference will always be here. The best way is to grow a pair and ignore it, rather than trying to combat it.
Besides, pretty much everyone is prejudiced to some degree and it affects all walks of lives and viewpoints. For example, people almost instantly prejudice if you have a different viewpoint and try to tell you that what you think is wrong and what they think is right. They will look down on the people who disagree, similar to how people look down on blacks, similar to people who look down on smokers, etc.
This is why I think it's pretty silly to try to advocate for change and whatnot, if change happens it will never get rid of the underlying prejudice and will only mask it. People who advocated for change will still endure this prejudice.
Or as likely, substitute it with another kind. Because advocating against prejudice by resorting to prejudice itself, only transfers the problem and doesn't eliminate it.
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lol My mum thinks I wear guys clothes coz of sensory stuff as well. She thinks most stuf is down to my AS though
So does my mum now. It seems really weird after getting told off for years about stuff I did.
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The binary view gender is flawed and false. I tried to explain that. But it seems some people just don't get it.
Yes you seem to be hanging onto this concept and lecturing us on how we are not getting it.
It is fantastic that you understand the concept that there is not fixed roles within the genders. There is flux and diversity and individualism between both. But then I have not said that and as much as you tout this line over and over ("explaining it over and over") I and others are not disputing it so I fail to see why you should felt obliged to get on your soapbox and lecture us on shit we understand already and don't question.
I am thinking this is some fallback position. "They (Non-transgender people) don't get it (what transgender means or feels like or anything else). I am sick of explaining it (rehashing irrelevances to what is being questioned, in order to try to taint the questionee with a false intolerance)"
This is not that subtle GA. You have stated your opinion on transgender issues and that is fine and you have shown great over-sensitivity which is fine. You are probably researched and have an educated opinion. That doesn't mean you have the only opinion worth considering does it? Seriously? That does not mean that any talk negatively or positively needs your endorsement or that if they are different from yours that the other person is intolerant or ignorant. Right?
OK let's try this on GA. You ARE over-sensitive and in an over-reaction to defending all transgendered people from the horrible transphobic comments. You are seeing Binary attitudes to gender stereotyping where they don't exist, and intolerance and bigotry where it does not exist.
Why?
You are too willing to condemn me and others who are not transgendered. You are making this an issue of transgender vs non-trangendered and on one side your opinion: clever tolerant, and all-knowing and on the other, binary, intolerance and ignorance. There is a word and it isn't nice. Tell me what it is GA. (This type of mental them and us bias).
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Or as likely, substitute it with another kind. Because advocating against prejudice by resorting to prejudice itself, only transfers the problem and doesn't eliminate it.
But that's the thing, that's all people can do.
Take bint for example, has naive notions of peace, equality, tolerance and love... but she herself is just as close minded, prejudiced and moronic as the people she stands against. If people tell her off for being skinny, she goes into a retarded rant on why you're stupid and on why she should be accepted.... then take the piss out of people who are fat cunts but adovcate the same thing she's advocating: tolerance and acceptance. Talk about double standards.
If she is going to play the open minded game like all other liberal retards, then she is in no position to defend transgenderism and all other things she believes in because of the fact that she is far from "open minded". I am not saying I'm open minded either, but I am basically saying that no one is open minded. She might aswell vote for the BNP, It's not going to make a difference. :orly:
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:santa:
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I've always admitted I'm sizist, don't see how that is me being a hypocrite ;)
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God help ye'. :zoinks:
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At least I won't be the one getting a heart attack/diabetes due to my obesity in a coupla years :zoinks:
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Good for you. :thumbup:
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At least I won't be the one getting a heart attack/diabetes due to my obesity in a coupla years :zoinks:
But if you are too thin, you heart muscle atrophies. so lose/lose with fat vs thin.
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At least I won't be the one getting a heart attack/diabetes due to my obesity in a coupla years :zoinks:
But if you are too thin, you heart muscle atrophies. so lose/lose with fat vs thin.
Good thing I'm not too thin then :thumbup:
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At least I won't be the one getting a heart attack/diabetes due to my obesity in a coupla years :zoinks:
You will get probably get heart disease at an early age because of your smoking.
My aunt has always been very thin and she became a diabetic when she was 14. Diabetes may be in part an autoimmune disease, so you could become diabetic as well.
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Oh fuck off Callaway
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At least I won't be the one getting a heart attack/diabetes due to my obesity in a coupla years :zoinks:
You will get probably get heart disease at an early age because of your smoking.
And various lung problems.
You're as unhealthy as I am, we'll probably die at the same time. :zoinks:
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And I'm extremely healthy in terms of fitness and lifestyle but I'm such a stress ball that I'll probably either die of a heart attack or spontaneosuly combust before I'm 40. We're all fucked. Hooray!!!
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At least I won't be the one getting a heart attack/diabetes due to my obesity in a coupla years :zoinks:
You will get probably get heart disease at an early age because of your smoking.
My aunt has always been very thin and she became a diabetic when she was 14. Diabetes may be in part an autoimmune disease, so you could become diabetic as well.
Bad news. Bint is going down. :'( Such a nice girl too.
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I'm sure she'll be there within 5 years. People eventually get fed up with her shit and leave.
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At least I won't be the one getting a heart attack/diabetes due to my obesity in a coupla years :zoinks:
You will get probably get heart disease at an early age because of your smoking.
And various lung problems.
You're as unhealthy as I am, we'll probably die at the same time. :zoinks:
who cares aboutliving till they're old and decrepit anyway?
at least she'll look better while she's still here :zoinks:
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* ponders how this looks like a contest between Shleed, Bint and PMS Elle, who will go first. :headslap: *
:vulcan:
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PMS Elle? ???
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PMS Elle? ???
And I'm extremely healthy in terms of fitness and lifestyle but I'm such a stress ball that I'll probably either die of a heart attack or spontaneosuly combust before I'm 40. We're all fucked. Hooray!!!
Yeah, she seemed to join in too.
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That's easy, I've won already :thumbup:
I'm a zombie.
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At least I won't be the one getting a heart attack/diabetes due to my obesity in a coupla years :zoinks:
You will get probably get heart disease at an early age because of your smoking.
And various lung problems.
You're as unhealthy as I am, we'll probably die at the same time. :zoinks:
who cares aboutliving till they're old and decrepit anyway?
at least she'll look better while she's still here :zoinks:
Me!!! I want to outlive my Gram. She's turning 93 in March. I plan to live a loooooong time. 8) My bucket list is pretty long so I need lots of time to get it all done.
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Bad news. Bint is going down.
...I thought guys liked it when girls did that.
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At least I won't be the one getting a heart attack/diabetes due to my obesity in a coupla years :zoinks:
You will get probably get heart disease at an early age because of your smoking.
And various lung problems.
You're as unhealthy as I am, we'll probably die at the same time. :zoinks:
who cares aboutliving till they're old and decrepit anyway?
at least she'll look better while she's still here :zoinks:
Me!!! I want to outlive my Gram. She's turning 93 in March. I plan to live a loooooong time. 8) My bucket list is pretty long so I need lots of time to get it all done.
:indeed: :plus:
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Plenty of things I wanna do. But not when I'm that old.
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Why not?
One set of my grandparents enjoyed their lives till the last bit. OK, they were pretty fit for their age, that will have helped.
My other gram was sick and poorly all of her life, but she lived every minute she had to the max. I do admire that woman. Lusting for life till her last breath, and witty too.
I would not mind growing old the way they did at all.
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Health reasons
I know a lot of old people live to be fit well into their old age, but for various reasons I (probably) won't be one of them
Easy to say this when you're young, I know. But I don;t think I want to grow too old, as I know my body won't be able to handle it
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Don't postpone things you really want to do now then.
Take your chances and go for it.
You still may grow into an old Soph, but not into an old Soph with regrets of all he never did.
Will make you a happier old bugger if you do happen to grow old.
And a more satisfied one if you do happen to go young.
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Having volunteered at a assisted living facility (old folks home), I can say that I don't want to live to that age. Alzheimer's is terrible and same goes for just about every case of dementia I have seen in the elderly. I am very proud of myself for not laughing while playing trivial pursuit with Alzheimer's patients.
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I don't want to die old, wrinkled and miserable.
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I don't want to die old, wrinkled and miserable.
I am as insane as I ever want to be right now. If I get really old, I will be scary insane.
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I don't want to die old, wrinkled and miserable.
I am as insane as I ever want to be right now. If I get really old, I will be scary insane.
Same. I'll be the old batshit psycho oldie woman from down the road. Kids will dare each other to ring my doorbell for a laugh. I'll smell of poo and cat piss 8)
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I don't want to die old, wrinkled and miserable.
Better to die young, smooth and miserable?
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I don't want to die old, wrinkled and miserable.
I am as insane as I ever want to be right now. If I get really old, I will be scary insane.
Same. I'll be the old batshit psycho oldie woman from down the road. Kids will dare each other to ring my doorbell for a laugh. I'll smell of poo and cat piss 8)
Who's poo?
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I don't want to die old, wrinkled and miserable.
Better to die young, smooth and miserable?
Yes :thumbup:
I don't want to die old, wrinkled and miserable.
I am as insane as I ever want to be right now. If I get really old, I will be scary insane.
Same. I'll be the old batshit psycho oldie woman from down the road. Kids will dare each other to ring my doorbell for a laugh. I'll smell of poo and cat piss 8)
Who's poo?
Mine :(
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Remind me not to visit. :P
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We'll send litigious instead.
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We'll send litigious instead.
:agreed:
Lit at that age....yeah he'd be right into that scene. :zoinks:
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http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/genetics/article6952050.ece
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http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/genetics/article6952050.ece
If you mutate enough genes we become bananas. This is nothing really new.
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Good luck on becoming a banana then :thumbup:
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No need, I already have one and its big enough.
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I just had a banana.
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I don't like bananas.
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http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/genetics/article6952050.ece
If you mutate enough genes we become bananas. This is nothing really new.
If becoming bananas is anything like going troppo (http://www.abc.net.au/dimensions/dimensions_health/Transcripts/s533413.htm) (also known as mango madness), this surely belongs more to the realm of urban myth than science. :green:
The author of the Times Online piece notes that practical application of these findings to humans is still quite a way off. Nevertheless, it's interesting news — if for no other reason than demonstrating, yet again, the enormous plasticity of human sexuality and the inadequacy of the male/female binary model in explaining it.
All joking aside, though, a short course of gene therapy would most definitely win out over painful and risky surgeries and/or medication with hormones.
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i'd rather change my exterior to make my life easier than fuck with who i am to be normal
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http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/science/genetics/article6952050.ece
If you mutate enough genes we become bananas. This is nothing really new.
If becoming bananas is anything like going troppo (http://www.abc.net.au/dimensions/dimensions_health/Transcripts/s533413.htm) (also known as mango madness), this surely belongs more to the realm of urban myth than science. :green:
The author of the Times Online piece notes that practical application of these findings to humans is still quite a way off. Nevertheless, it's interesting news — if for no other reason than demonstrating, yet again, the enormous plasticity of human sexuality and the inadequacy of the male/female binary model in explaining it.
All joking aside, though, a short course of gene therapy would most definitely win out over painful and risky surgeries and/or medication with hormones.
The risk with gene therapy is quite high, for one it hasnt been tested properly on humans. Not sure what the wider implications would be on someone too, this gene could be linked to something else too.
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^ Good point about unintended consequences. I'm not of the "It CAN be done, therefore it SHOULD be done" school of thought. But surely the notion of what is appropriate, and what is risky, is one best determined by the person undergoing treatment and having given informed consent.
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It would be a hell of a thing to go "Whoopsss!" about
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^ Good point about unintended consequences. I'm not of the "It CAN be done, therefore it SHOULD be done" school of thought. But surely the notion of what is appropriate, and what is risky, is one best determined by the person undergoing treatment and having given informed consent.
Think their sanity should factor into it.
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You have to think "cost-benefit" here. We gamble with our lives, all the time, in a variety of ways. "I only smoke a pack a day, where's the harm?" "One more drink, I should still be right to drive." "I'm only going 500 metres, what's the point of a seatbelt?" etc. We use all kinds of tricks, including substances, to make ourselves feel "normal" — whatever the hell that is supposed to mean. Why should anyone should be prevented from seeking whatever treatment they feel is appropriate? Humans commit all manner of stupidities in full knowledge of adverse consequences (legal penalties, premature death, disapproval from neighbours, etc.) If we are to fall into error, let it be on the side of permitting, not restraining, the act — especially where harm to third parties is not demonstrated.
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At least I'm attacking HIM, and not making disgusting little posts about a dog.
Good to see you have such high moral standards. :thumbup:
::)