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Author Topic: Calandale's turn in the spotlight  (Read 78882 times)

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Offline Calandale

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1305 on: February 12, 2008, 04:17:18 AM »
Are you referring to your inability to post?  I've already replied to your bug report topic on this- it has happened before and was a bug- so its likely that it was just a bug again.

I'd assume that the same cause was at fault both times.
two can play?

Quote

Was the existence of the secret do not prank list ever announced to the membership or was it all done in secret?

AFAIK it was never formally announced.
I brought its existence (though not who was
on it) up in a couple of public arguments, after
having whined (as 'twould be called) in the admin
forum about it NOT being announced.

purposefulinsanity

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1306 on: February 12, 2008, 04:24:23 AM »
Things like that are the reason why I've not just written you off as a crank like a lot of other people have. :laugh:

Given that the existence of the don't prank list was causing some heated debate when it was first mentioned I wonder why it was decided that one would be created in secret without the approval of the community??  And why the creation of such a list wasn't announced to the members so they could express an opinion about it? Yeah I understand that the members had apparently voted to say they'd prefer a dictatorship, but if the staff honestly believed we were really just reverting back to pre-WC rule why did anyone think it was acceptable to keep something like this a secret?

Offline Calandale

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1307 on: February 12, 2008, 04:30:53 AM »
I felt on shaky ground about the whole issue,
which is why I didn't just make the thread.

I THINK the idea was that even the knowledge
of the existence of such a thread was viewed as
somehow debilitating to those on it. I'm really not
sure why it was never publicized officially.

I'm NOT disturbed by the creation in secret.
It came down to an agreement among the
staff (with one exception) to not prank anyone
on it. But, given that there was no clear way
onto the list, it struck me as very odd. And,
my memory (which is faulty at times) tells me
that people were added, without being told
about it. One of those expressed (and no, I wouldn't
search down the post - even if that wouldn't give
the member on the list's name away) surprise at the
existence of such a list - which could have been feigned.

Offline odeon

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1308 on: February 12, 2008, 05:43:42 PM »
Things like that are the reason why I've not just written you off as a crank like a lot of other people have. :laugh:

Given that the existence of the don't prank list was causing some heated debate when it was first mentioned I wonder why it was decided that one would be created in secret without the approval of the community??  And why the creation of such a list wasn't announced to the members so they could express an opinion about it? Yeah I understand that the members had apparently voted to say they'd prefer a dictatorship, but if the staff honestly believed we were really just reverting back to pre-WC rule why did anyone think it was acceptable to keep something like this a secret?

As I remember (and I can't be arsed to check), the list was born out of some members asking admins, in private, to not be pranked. There were a lot of pranks at the time, and so a thread was started in the admin forum instead of the WC or whatever, in order to not list the names of these members in public where they would run the risk of being targets *because* of being on that list. Some members who did complain in public got pranked against their wishes, all while the culprits asked them to be good sports.

Nothing malicious, nothing secretive, just a desire to keep those names below the radar while letting the admins know that these people did not want to be pranked.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."

- Albert Einstein

Offline Calandale

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1309 on: February 12, 2008, 05:53:31 PM »


As I remember (and I can't be arsed to check)

And no one else could even see it, because the discussion
IS hidden.

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, the list was born out of some members asking admins, in private, to not be pranked.

I don't remember such being mentioned. We had played with a
public thread, which was a dangerous idea, as it would (and did)
draw derision from other members. Dunc suggested the private
list. It seemed a good idea, in and of itself, even to me - just an
agreement by staff NOT to prank. A couple of staff members put
their names up, as a trial. Then, people were being added - but the
existence of the list was never publicized. So, someone like Hadron,
who was not on the in with the staff, and had certainly not expressed
any desire to not be pranked wouldn't know about it. Now, hypothetically,
let's say that he really was afraid of being pranked, and chose to present
the false front, in order to mitigate damage - shouldn't he too have a
right to have been on it? There was no public announcement of such
a thread (except for what I insinuated) and there was no discussion about
sending each and every member a notification of its existence.

So, those on it were by staff whim, at some level.

Quote
Nothing malicious, nothing secretive, just a desire to keep those names below the radar while letting the admins know that these people did not want to be pranked.

Nothing malicious, I agree. I did not, and never will,
understand why the existence of the list was hidden.
Why only those whom certain staff selected might
have been contacted. And why one member who was
on the list, didn't know of its existence.

Offline odeon

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1310 on: February 12, 2008, 06:04:20 PM »
The fact that the list's existence was not revealed then (it is public enough now, it seems) simply happened, I think. Again, there was no malice, no evil plans. And considering that some of the admins then whined about anyone daring to complain about being pranked, it wasn't much of a stretch to assume that publishing that list would create more problems for anyone not willing to "be a good sport".

Not everyone liked to be pranked, remember? Some people left, or considered leaving, because of the pranks.

As for what Hadron did or did not know, ask him. I don't really care.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."

- Albert Einstein

Offline Calandale

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1311 on: February 12, 2008, 06:17:27 PM »
The fact that the list's existence was not revealed then (it is public enough now, it seems) simply happened, I think. Again, there was no malice, no evil plans. And considering that some of the admins then whined about anyone daring to complain about being pranked, it wasn't much of a stretch to assume that publishing that list would create more problems for anyone not willing to "be a good sport".

I'm NOT saying that the members should have been revealed.
Just that there should have been a means for the weakest here -
those without friendly staff having their best interests at
heart - perhaps those who even feel hounded by the friendly staff,
to have applied to the list.


Quote
As for what Hadron did or did not know, ask him. I don't really care.

I know. That's kinda the point. Why it should have been public.

Offline Christopher McCandless

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1312 on: February 12, 2008, 06:19:50 PM »
The fact that the list's existence was not revealed then (it is public enough now, it seems) simply happened, I think. Again, there was no malice, no evil plans. And considering that some of the admins then whined about anyone daring to complain about being pranked, it wasn't much of a stretch to assume that publishing that list would create more problems for anyone not willing to "be a good sport".
If people cannot be a good sport about a minor joke on an internet forum, I shudder to think how they take anything adverse irl. I thought this site was partially about toughening up people.
Quote
Not everyone liked to be pranked, remember? Some people left, or considered leaving, because of the pranks.
Wrong Planet is open to most of them, as I understand it.
Quote
As for what Hadron did or did not know, ask him. I don't really care.
I was aware after Cal implied it, and opposed it I recall.

Offline odeon

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1313 on: February 12, 2008, 06:20:22 PM »
The fact that the list's existence was not revealed then (it is public enough now, it seems) simply happened, I think. Again, there was no malice, no evil plans. And considering that some of the admins then whined about anyone daring to complain about being pranked, it wasn't much of a stretch to assume that publishing that list would create more problems for anyone not willing to "be a good sport".

I'm NOT saying that the members should have been revealed.
Just that there should have been a means for the weakest here -
those without friendly staff having their best interests at
heart - perhaps those who even feel hounded by the friendly staff,
to have applied to the list.

You, in other words.

Quote
Quote
As for what Hadron did or did not know, ask him. I don't really care.

I know. That's kinda the point. Why it should have been public.


That I don't care if Hadron knew or not? You're being weird.
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Offline odeon

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1314 on: February 12, 2008, 06:21:36 PM »
The fact that the list's existence was not revealed then (it is public enough now, it seems) simply happened, I think. Again, there was no malice, no evil plans. And considering that some of the admins then whined about anyone daring to complain about being pranked, it wasn't much of a stretch to assume that publishing that list would create more problems for anyone not willing to "be a good sport".
If people cannot be a good sport about a minor joke on an internet forum, I shudder to think how they take anything adverse irl. I thought this site was partially about toughening up people.
Quote
Not everyone liked to be pranked, remember? Some people left, or considered leaving, because of the pranks.
Wrong Planet is open to most of them, as I understand it.
Quote
As for what Hadron did or did not know, ask him. I don't really care.
I was aware after Cal implied it, and opposed it I recall.

Thankfully, none of the above is up to you.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."

- Albert Einstein

Offline Calandale

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1315 on: February 12, 2008, 06:24:03 PM »

If people cannot be a good sport about a minor joke on an internet forum, I shudder to think how they take anything adverse irl. I thought this site was partially about toughening up people.


Still, given the fact that the admins were immune
to pranks - notice that neither odeon nor callaway
allow them to persist against them - allowing the
regular members some defense seems only fair.

Offline Calandale

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1316 on: February 12, 2008, 06:26:17 PM »
The fact that the list's existence was not revealed then (it is public enough now, it seems) simply happened, I think. Again, there was no malice, no evil plans. And considering that some of the admins then whined about anyone daring to complain about being pranked, it wasn't much of a stretch to assume that publishing that list would create more problems for anyone not willing to "be a good sport".

I'm NOT saying that the members should have been revealed.
Just that there should have been a means for the weakest here -
those without friendly staff having their best interests at
heart - perhaps those who even feel hounded by the friendly staff,
to have applied to the list.

You, in other words.

I was a member of the staff, at that point.
I could fix anything I was annoyed about.
Not that I wouldn't allow a prank against me
to run for a while. I have SOME sense of decency
about these things.

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Quote
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As for what Hadron did or did not know, ask him. I don't really care.

I know. That's kinda the point. Why it should have been public.


That I don't care if Hadron knew or not? You're being weird.

No. That you care about some, and not others - which is natural.
AND that you only were liable to extend the offer to those you cared
about enough to think that they MIGHT have had some objection to
being pranked.

purposefulinsanity

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1317 on: February 12, 2008, 06:26:43 PM »
I wasn't suggesting that the list should have been made public, but it seems off that its very exsistence was kept secret- I do believe there was no malicious thinking behind keeping it a secret, but the fact that it didn't occur to staff to anounce it to the membership is worrying.  Not least because, as cal points out, how could anyone who didn't happen to be friendly with an admin get their name on the list, but also because it makes you wonder what else it isn't occuring to staff members to mention.  Obviously this isn't much of an issue, being married to a staff member I trust 100%  :laugh:, but you must see that it may cause concern for other members. Perhaps it was just overlooked because people were tired of all the drama ???

Offline Calandale

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1318 on: February 12, 2008, 06:32:46 PM »
It's NOT a matter of 'just didn't occur' though.
I brought this issue up, within the admin forum
LONG before I revealed anything about the list
to the membership.

I wasn't even given the usual - if you care, post a
thread about it. Given that the rules of the site
had just undergone some severe changes, and
my position was pretty fucking questionable (having
been briefly removed), I had reason not to just post
such without instruction.

purposefulinsanity

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Re: Calandale's turn in the spotlight
« Reply #1319 on: February 12, 2008, 06:50:31 PM »
Sorry I misunderstood Odeon when he said it 'just happened' and I'd forgotten you said you'd mentioned making its exsistence public to the rest of the staff. 

Questions for current staff here because it makes sense to put them here with the rest of the discussion on this (sorry Cal if you'd rather I didn't do this I'll post them elsewhere):
1)Is this secret don't prank me list still in use?
2) Will there be a public announcement regarding how to get on this list for those who aren't friends with a staff member/psychic?
3) Does the fact the list was set up without a vote on the issue, despite some objection being made to its exsistence, mean that such 'staff only' decisions will be made again in the future?

Just so we all know where we stand now.