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Author Topic: Gender pay gap at the BBC  (Read 1870 times)

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Offline Minister Of Silly Walks

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Gender pay gap at the BBC
« on: February 03, 2018, 04:05:30 PM »
http://www.smh.com.au/lifestyle/life-and-relationships/an-equal-pay-revolution-is-nigh-in-the-uk-australia-take-note-20180202-p4yza7.html

Dangerous work that, reading the news. 

Quote
An equal pay storm that has been brewing for several months since the BBC was forced to publish the salaries of its highest earners, revealing only a third are women and the top seven are all men, finally broke on Wednesday, dumping a torrential downpour of righteous anger at a Parliamentary Select Committee convened to look into the issue.

Quote
A subsequent review conducted by the BBC in response to the initial outcry over top earners’ pay inequality revealed a 9.6 per cent average gender pay gap across the BBC. “Better than average,” blustered the BBC when those figures were released. Not surprisingly, those comments did not quell the storm.

Quote
The BBC is a cautionary tale for many other large employers in the UK, who are bracing themselves for the aftermath of new legislation which is forcing them to publish their pay gaps by April of this year, something some have suggested will lead to many “BBC moments”.
“When men oppress their fellow men, the oppressor ever finds, in the character of the oppressed, a full justification for his oppression.” Frederick Douglass

Offline odeon

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2018, 04:16:21 PM »
About time.
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Offline Yuri Bezmenov

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #2 on: February 03, 2018, 07:43:19 PM »
Total fucking fake news.

Offline Minister Of Silly Walks

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2018, 12:39:29 AM »
“When men oppress their fellow men, the oppressor ever finds, in the character of the oppressed, a full justification for his oppression.” Frederick Douglass

Offline Al Swearegen

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2018, 02:48:47 AM »
Nope. Recently this anchor decided to quit in a huff over her salary being lower than her male co-anchor. She raised hell over it and the network let her go. Then it came out that his salary also included other components hers did not such as other yearly specials and such. She still thought they should be equal. There is the gender equality debate encapsulated.
I2 today is not i2 of yesteryear. It is a knitting circle. Those that participate be they nice or asshats know their place and the price to be there. Odeon is the overlord

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Think it is I2 of old? Even Odeon is not so delusional as to think otherwise. He may on occasionally pretend otherwise but his base is that knitting circle.

Censoring/banning/restricting/moderating myself, Calanadale & Scrapheap were all not his finest moments.

How to apologise to Scrap

Offline odeon

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2018, 03:06:06 AM »
The BBC numbers tell a different story.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."

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Offline Al Swearegen

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #6 on: February 04, 2018, 05:58:00 AM »
The BBC numbers tell a different story.

Meh, in the case of Lisa Wilkinson and Karl Stefanovic there was a big outrage and the News company made the case that it was not prepared to pay Lisa the same because in his contract Karl had more duties including various specials he had to do that Lisa did not. It was a non-issue. To her, they were paid unequally for the same job.

Because the media controls the discourse, this very reasonable explanation is lost in the spin and outrage that promote Lisa as the victim and brave woman pushing but on equal pay.

Having said that, one article DID raise an interesting point. Whilst they both needed to get make up for the set. She had to have her hair done each day and so this put an extra hour a day on her prep time. Now THAT IS something that ought to be taken into account. an hour a day 5 days a week 52 weeks a year does add up and is obviously time he does not have to concern himself with.

That all said and done these people are both earning 1 million + dollars a year so I am not going to weep too much over either of them and the 1 percenter issues they have.
I2 today is not i2 of yesteryear. It is a knitting circle. Those that participate be they nice or asshats know their place and the price to be there. Odeon is the overlord

.Benevolent if you toe the line.

Think it is I2 of old? Even Odeon is not so delusional as to think otherwise. He may on occasionally pretend otherwise but his base is that knitting circle.

Censoring/banning/restricting/moderating myself, Calanadale & Scrapheap were all not his finest moments.

How to apologise to Scrap

Offline Yuri Bezmenov

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #7 on: February 04, 2018, 07:28:35 AM »
The BBC numbers tell a different story.

Actually, they don't. You're making the same mistake you made with the Google employee numbers.

You just look at the surface numbers and don't scratch below the surface to see why there's a difference.

BBC has commissioned 3 different independent investigations over recent years and all 3 found that there were no gender bias in the wages of anyone who worked there.

THIS IS A FAKE STORY, PERIOD!

Offline odeon

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #8 on: February 05, 2018, 03:35:44 AM »
The BBC numbers tell a different story.

Actually, they don't. You're making the same mistake you made with the Google employee numbers.

You just look at the surface numbers and don't scratch below the surface to see why there's a difference.

BBC has commissioned 3 different independent investigations over recent years and all 3 found that there were no gender bias in the wages of anyone who worked there.

THIS IS A FAKE STORY, PERIOD!

How do you explain the fact that there is a 6.8% gap, then, according to their own numbers? How do you explain the fact that they will cut the salaries of some of their male journalists following the publication of their own study, the one where they claim there is no gender bias?

If you scratch below the surface a bit, you'll find a lot of criticism aimed at their studies. Yes, it's easier to just claim it's fake news but I'm guessing that you wouldn't if you were paid 6.8% less than a female colleague.

As for the Google numbers, you were the one to miss the division between tech and non-tech employees. Statistics are so easily misunderstood, aren't they? It happens to the best of us so it goes without saying that it happens to you. Happy to revisit the discussion if you can produce sources that back up your claims.
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Offline Al Swearegen

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2018, 03:57:09 AM »
The BBC numbers tell a different story.

Actually, they don't. You're making the same mistake you made with the Google employee numbers.

You just look at the surface numbers and don't scratch below the surface to see why there's a difference.

BBC has commissioned 3 different independent investigations over recent years and all 3 found that there were no gender bias in the wages of anyone who worked there.

THIS IS A FAKE STORY, PERIOD!

How do you explain the fact that there is a 6.8% gap, then, according to their own numbers? How do you explain the fact that they will cut the salaries of some of their male journalists following the publication of their own study, the one where they claim there is no gender bias?

If you scratch below the surface a bit, you'll find a lot of criticism aimed at their studies. Yes, it's easier to just claim it's fake news but I'm guessing that you wouldn't if you were paid 6.8% less than a female colleague.

As for the Google numbers, you were the one to miss the division between tech and non-tech employees. Statistics are so easily misunderstood, aren't they? It happens to the best of us so it goes without saying that it happens to you. Happy to revisit the discussion if you can produce sources that back up your claims.

I dunno? Fear? Public outrage? Allaying the sponsor's concerns? Being seen as Progressive?

Could be many reasons.
I2 today is not i2 of yesteryear. It is a knitting circle. Those that participate be they nice or asshats know their place and the price to be there. Odeon is the overlord

.Benevolent if you toe the line.

Think it is I2 of old? Even Odeon is not so delusional as to think otherwise. He may on occasionally pretend otherwise but his base is that knitting circle.

Censoring/banning/restricting/moderating myself, Calanadale & Scrapheap were all not his finest moments.

How to apologise to Scrap

Offline Lestat

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #10 on: February 05, 2018, 02:19:48 PM »
Statistics are all too often either the tools of the selfinterested when manipulating those they see as 'useful idiots', outright liars, or people who don't themselves understand the statistics but think they do.

(this isn't pointing any fingers at any specific people here btw) more, as a general principle relating to statistics themselves. 74% of all statistics are bollocks, if your talking about external genitalia that might possibly be about correct. But otherwise its still bollocks.

Statistics can be made to say what the person coming up with them WANTS them to say, all too often.
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Offline odeon

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #11 on: February 06, 2018, 04:14:30 PM »
The BBC numbers tell a different story.

Actually, they don't. You're making the same mistake you made with the Google employee numbers.

You just look at the surface numbers and don't scratch below the surface to see why there's a difference.

BBC has commissioned 3 different independent investigations over recent years and all 3 found that there were no gender bias in the wages of anyone who worked there.

THIS IS A FAKE STORY, PERIOD!

How do you explain the fact that there is a 6.8% gap, then, according to their own numbers? How do you explain the fact that they will cut the salaries of some of their male journalists following the publication of their own study, the one where they claim there is no gender bias?

If you scratch below the surface a bit, you'll find a lot of criticism aimed at their studies. Yes, it's easier to just claim it's fake news but I'm guessing that you wouldn't if you were paid 6.8% less than a female colleague.

As for the Google numbers, you were the one to miss the division between tech and non-tech employees. Statistics are so easily misunderstood, aren't they? It happens to the best of us so it goes without saying that it happens to you. Happy to revisit the discussion if you can produce sources that back up your claims.

I dunno? Fear? Public outrage? Allaying the sponsor's concerns? Being seen as Progressive?

Could be many reasons.

I take it that you don't have any sources either?
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."

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Offline Jack

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2018, 05:09:20 PM »
Statistics are all too often either the tools of the selfinterested when manipulating those they see as 'useful idiots', outright liars, or people who don't themselves understand the statistics but think they do.

(this isn't pointing any fingers at any specific people here btw) more, as a general principle relating to statistics themselves. 74% of all statistics are bollocks, if your talking about external genitalia that might possibly be about correct. But otherwise its still bollocks.

Statistics can be made to say what the person coming up with them WANTS them to say, all too often.

Statistics aren't bollocks; they're facts, often important and useful facts, and shouldn't be dismissed because sometimes there's fault in the analysis.

Offline Minister Of Silly Walks

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #13 on: February 06, 2018, 08:39:26 PM »
Statistics are all too often either the tools of the selfinterested when manipulating those they see as 'useful idiots', outright liars, or people who don't themselves understand the statistics but think they do.

(this isn't pointing any fingers at any specific people here btw) more, as a general principle relating to statistics themselves. 74% of all statistics are bollocks, if your talking about external genitalia that might possibly be about correct. But otherwise its still bollocks.

Statistics can be made to say what the person coming up with them WANTS them to say, all too often.

Statistics aren't bollocks; they're facts, often important and useful facts, and shouldn't be dismissed because sometimes there's fault in the analysis.

True. And there can also be faults in the methods used to gather the statistics.
“When men oppress their fellow men, the oppressor ever finds, in the character of the oppressed, a full justification for his oppression.” Frederick Douglass

Offline Jack

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Re: Gender pay gap at the BBC
« Reply #14 on: February 06, 2018, 11:09:17 PM »
Statistics are all too often either the tools of the selfinterested when manipulating those they see as 'useful idiots', outright liars, or people who don't themselves understand the statistics but think they do.

(this isn't pointing any fingers at any specific people here btw) more, as a general principle relating to statistics themselves. 74% of all statistics are bollocks, if your talking about external genitalia that might possibly be about correct. But otherwise its still bollocks.

Statistics can be made to say what the person coming up with them WANTS them to say, all too often.

Statistics aren't bollocks; they're facts, often important and useful facts, and shouldn't be dismissed because sometimes there's fault in the analysis.

True. And there can also be faults in the methods used to gather the statistics.
You mean like opinion surveys, or small sample sets?