Al, I wrote the following last night, but got interrupted by a long phone call. I think it's still worth saying. In fact , it's all the more worth saying , in the light of your argument with Odeon
Al, no I actually meant all the above-stated opions. Think what you like, but I don't intend to engage in an argument about whether I meant what I said, and interrogation as to why would I say it, given that i really think something else? As I have said before, I 've had more than enough of people insisisting that they know my mind better than I do, and pressing me into agreeing with their version of the " truth" I had that all the fucking time when I was a kid . I am not willing to take it from anyone now, least of all a fellow Aspie, who ought to damn well know better.
Was gonna go on to say , I'm glad we found some points of agreement, would rather build on those. However, this does chime in with what Odeon said about bullying. He's right. I'm sure you don't think of it that way, but your behaviour really is a form of bullying. It's just the sort of thing I have in mind when I say that I was bullied more often (and far more traumatically) by well-intentioned adults than by other kids. I'm sure they believed that their actions were fully justified, too. I 'm sure that they never for a monent realised that they were bullies.
But really , Al, being pressed and pressed and pressed to conform to Al's mental model of one's own inner self is no different, in effect, than being pressed and pressed and pressed and pressed to conform to the NT model. Once somebody earns your wrath, then you unremittingly offer them the exact kind of thing that we come to these boards to escape from. It goes way beyond name-calling and attacks a person at their core.
I'm sure that McJ would be very flattered to find that his words from 2006 are being enshrined in stone and regarded as gospel. Pity he's not here to reconsider them in the light of subsequent developments. It's even more of a pity that Wolfie (who co-founded the original Intensity, along with McJ) is no longer here to comment. Looks like we;ll just have to think for ourselves, doesn't it? Looks like we'll just have to ask
ourselves if this site is working out as intended?
I see you didn't see fit to bold the majority McJ's mission statment, which is a pity, because it's a lot more posirtive and constructive that you tend to give him credit for. You've invariably focussed instead on his projected means to that end, rather than the end in itself. So, here it is again:
We believe in the right to speak freely.
We believe that People with AS have not been allowed to speak freely. And that society has been a bully which has forced their silence. as a result people with AS seem to be a little on the ultra sensitive side. We would like to give voice to People with AS, since the silence has been enforced by society for far to long.
intensity? is a place where freedom reigns supreme in the marketplace of ideas. we encourage everybody to speak so that together we may form a collage of ideas and work out the truths as percieved by the AS Community. Then we plan on taking those truths and become advocates for them. and we will stand together and be counted, and we will speak up.
The price of speech is not free. Each person will be held accountable for their words and challenged by the Community. The off chance that you might be embarrassed for what you say, is the price of free speech. People have no right to censor what another thinks, and abolish them before they get the right to speak. that is what we have battled our entire lives and its over.
we demand the right here. and we make use of that right. right or wrong, you will not be silenced by those who wish to keep you from being counted.
we are not disabled by AS, we are challenged. and we challenge you, to help us overcome those hurdles, and challenge us
I think that there's a tiny little flaw in that, which has come to acquire a lot of significance. McJ just didn't happen to consider, at the time of writing, that one way in which NT's tend to oppress our freedom of speech is by imposing their own narrative over ours and insist ing that they are right and we are wrong, even regarding our own subjective experience.
Intensity was clearly supposed to be a refuge from NT bullying, not somewhere where NT bullying is replicated. But that's easier said than done isn't it? And it obviously doesn't work out as intended all the time. The present instance being one massive case-in-point, I'm sorry to say.
As to the parts you saw fit to bold: I think that's all well-and-good except for the word "encourage" , which was a bloody stupid.word to use We
permit these things, we
tolerate these things because the alternative would be a lot worse, but it's to be hoped that they don't completely displace constructive discussion, isn't it? Or else what the heck is the point?
In practice, actual bullying
has occured on I2, especially in the "good old days" . The "wrath of the community" has sometimes unremittingly fallen upon one person , not because they didn't "back their wrds" but rther because they had offended other people's sense of morality. People have been driven away by that kind of mob rule. And people have been driven away by other forms of bullying , and al;so by excessive trolling completely takling over the board. Sometimes the culptiits have been reluctantly banned for the sake of preserving the community. And you're right in what you often say : there's been no consistent policy on this . There's no policy at all as such. It's generally done as a last resort, once a situation becomes intolerable, but that's very subjective, isn't it?
IMO, no system can ever work as intended for every situation encountered, because systems are rigid and inflexible, whereas life is complex, dymamic and constrantly surprising us. We therefore need one last freedom: the freedom to break our own rules rather than commit or perpetuate an atrocity (Ooh! that's almost to paraphase Orwell's sixth rule on good writing! *chuckle*)
Al, I sincerely hope this doesn't add up to: Odeon has to ban you. You'd be a grievous loss to the community . You've made any number of thoughtful and supportive contributions to this site. Also, you're right: it would come across hypocrital on his part, give that the trolling was mutual. But , on the other hand, what you're doing is actually worse than simple trolling and name-calling, and I wouldn't really blame any Admin who came to that conclusion eventually. That it falls to Odeon to make that decision is a great pity.
In view of that, I have one last practical suggestion to make: that Pyraxis take over control of the site, on a tempoary basis, until either these problems with Al are resolved one wayor another, or else she gives up on trying to resolve them . It seems we pretty much all have confidence in Pyraxis, and any judgement she might make, even if harsh, would leave a better taste in the mouth. I, for one, don't want to see Odeon in the position of having to actually ban Al. I think that would leave a bad taste in everybody's mouth (Odeon included) and we;'d never hear the end of the repercussions. Ofc, that
could also result in Odeon being banned, sinbinned or what-have-you. Hmm. Well
that could be a laugh. I hope Odeon is willing to take that risk?
