Women Blast CDC's Advice To Use Birth Control If Drinking Alcohol

[El]

New advice from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention aimed at preventing fetal alcohol syndrome has created quite a stir.

The CDC estimates that about 3 million women "are at risk of exposing their developing baby to alcohol because they are drinking, sexually active and not using birth control to prevent pregnancy."

About half of all pregnancies are unplanned. And according to the CDC report issued Tuesday, about 3 in 4 women "who want to get pregnant as soon as possible do not stop drinking alcohol when they stop using birth control."

So the CDC is now advising women to stop drinking if they are trying to get pregnant or not using birth control with sex. That's right, abstain from drinking.

The way this advice was communicated has struck many women as severe and condescending. "CDC to younger women: Better take your birth control before you drink that glass of wine," read one headline.

The Internet let forth a tsunami of derision. One columnist for The Washington Post quipped, "That's the last time I drink merlot alone in my apartment. I don't want herpes."

Indeed, the CDC did also point out that drinking can make a woman more vulnerable to injuries or violence and sexually transmitted diseases. But many commenters pointed out that there was no report warning men that drinking can lead to violent behavior and STDs.

"The way [the CDC] stated this is very extreme," says Emily Oster, an economist at Brown University who wrote a book on the sometimes anxiety-producing advice that women are given during pregnancy.

Oster says the CDC has an important message to convey. Some women undoubtedly are unaware of the risks of alcohol during the early weeks of pregnancy when they may not even know they're pregnant.

But given the tone and the judgment woven into the messaging, Oster says, it touched a nerve.

The backlash also reignited the controversy about whether any amount of alcohol is safe during pregnancy.

The American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists released a statement Tuesday pointing to its policy that recommends women completely abstain from alcohol during pregnancy.

But this doesn't mean that having a few drinks in the early weeks of pregnancy — before a woman realizes she's pregnant — is harmful.

"I practiced for 30 years," says Hal Lawrence, an OB-GYN and CEO of ACOG. He says he would see women who'd had a glass of wine or two before they knew they were pregnant, "and generally you can reassure those [women] that it's not an issue."

But Lawrence does say the best advice is to avoid alcohol completely during pregnancy. "Alcohol exposure in any of the trimesters [of a pregnancy] can have some impacts on ... the fetus."

The CDC now appears to be extending that advice to thinking about getting pregnant, too.

"We really urge women, and their partners and friends — to be supportive of that idea: I'm not going to drink for a while because I'm thinking of getting pregnant," said the CDC's Anne Schuchat during a briefing announcing the new guidance.

Aaaaand alcoholic feminists everywhere are getting (pardon the pun) super-pissed about this.

It, to be fair, does not help that they did deliver the information in a mixed and kind of condescending way, as in this infographic (it's the upper left part that people seem to be latching onto extra-hard):



The strength of the backlash, though... this is one of those things where I get that the pushback is extreme because it's a pushback against broader societal problems, and the CDC should have just stuck to one damn issue at a time in terms of women drinking, but they're not actually wrong, they're just saying it badly.  I don't think a lot of the offense with this one is genuine- I think a lot of it is women wanting to feel like they can drink while pregnant and not feel like they're doing something potentially harmful to the fetus.  I've seen it before, in women who were thinking about getting pregnant (or actually were pregnant) and wanted to drink anyway.  Getting offended doesn't make drinking while pregnant suddenly a good idea medically.

I still get exasperated when someone dares to suggest that women are still safest doing things like not walking alone at night in dangerous areas or not leaving drinks alone at clubs, and the backlash is OMG VICTIM-BLAMING.  FFS, the intended message is not always "...and if she doesn't she deserves to be assaulted."  I understand that that is still a very real attitude and it's problematic, but risk reducing behaviors are still important and useful and for chrissake we women all fucking do these things and think about them anyway.

(This is probably the most potentially offensive thing I have posted in years, lol)

[Al Swearegen]

I am indifferent to this. I stopped listening to the alcohol and sex debate the moment they started pushing the line about if you are drinking and you have sex, you cannot consent. It is rape....of course it strangely ONLY applies to women. If a man and a woman are BOTH drunk then the man is a rapist and the woman is a victim.

Frankly I am not surprised that some institutions are treating women like idiots. The above is the very reason. Women are being taught that they have no agency with sex and don't know their own minds and there is a social push to hammer this wrongthink into law and push the victim/oppressed narrative.

Then when society takes its cue from this and treats women like they are stupid and without agency, then these same people rebel against the narrative they generated in the first place.

(Yes of course "I" believe women HAVE agency and are NOT idiots, but this is the message we get.)

[El]

I am indifferent to this. I stopped listening to the alcohol and sex debate the moment they started pushing the line about if you are drinking and you have sex, you cannot consent. It is rape....of course it strangely ONLY applies to women. If a man and a woman are BOTH drunk then the man is a rapist and the woman is a victim.

Frankly I am not surprised that some institutions are treating women like idiots. The above is the very reason. Women are being taught that they have no agency with sex and don't know their own minds and there is a social push to hammer this wrongthink into law and push the victim/oppressed narrative.

Then when society takes its cue from this and treats women like they are stupid and without agency, then these same people rebel against the narrative they generated in the first place.

(Yes of course "I" believe women HAVE agency and are NOT idiots, but this is the message we get.)

It does suss out a little if one person is basically OK and the other person is unconscious or totally and obviously fucking obliterated.  But yes, both drunk and willing at the time =/= rape has happened, assuming they both knew what they were actually drinking (or at least that neither was deliberately fucking around with the other's drinks- basically, yaknow, neither was being a predatory scumbag).

The main focus of this from the CDC is SUPPOSED to just be the alcohol and pregnancy debate.  Problem is they're not so much going about it like they're a health agency telling women the straight, perhaps unwanted truth about alcohol and pregnancy, and more going about it like parents trying to keep their teenager from drinking at prom and citing ALL the scary things around alcohol that they can possibly think of.

Part of the reason there really is a point to saying it kind of the way they're saying it if you take away the other stupid "and here's MORE reasons not to drink, ladies!" bullshit out is this very, very stupid idea that there's a difference between having hetero, PIV sex (where neither of you is known to be unable to conceive) sans contraception or birth control just because, yaknow, it's fun to have sex, vs. "trying to get pregnant."  If you're doing it bareback and not on birth control, whether or not you want to make a baby doesn't affect whether you're gonna get knocked up. 

If you reel it back to the fact that people actually fucking have the dumbass mindset that it somehow makes some kind of contraceptive difference if you're "trying" to get pregnant vs having PIV sex and hoping you don't get pregnant, it makes sense to point out that yeah, if you aren't taking measures to not be pregnant, please take measures to not accidentally get knocked up and produce a kid with FAS.  That's still kind of unsayable in a way that won't piss people off, but that's the intended takeaway, and again, getting offended by it doesn't mean there's not actually a solid reason that that's good advice.  Of course it would be best if it was also pointed out than Plan B and abortion are also options that you may want to consider extra-hard if you know already this is a high-risk pregnancy because of exposure to alcohol, but then again, it would be best if that actually WAS an option to women across the States (and the world).  Meanwhile the religious crazies would flip the fuck out if you dared talk about abortion as a good idea, so you can't say that, either.

[Jack]

If this were strictly about pregnancy it would have come across better, not only alcohol but drugs and smoking.  It's probably fairly common for fetal health to be considered only after pregnancy is confirmed. Though it's about women and alcohol.

[Al Swearegen]

I am indifferent to this. I stopped listening to the alcohol and sex debate the moment they started pushing the line about if you are drinking and you have sex, you cannot consent. It is rape....of course it strangely ONLY applies to women. If a man and a woman are BOTH drunk then the man is a rapist and the woman is a victim.

Frankly I am not surprised that some institutions are treating women like idiots. The above is the very reason. Women are being taught that they have no agency with sex and don't know their own minds and there is a social push to hammer this wrongthink into law and push the victim/oppressed narrative.

Then when society takes its cue from this and treats women like they are stupid and without agency, then these same people rebel against the narrative they generated in the first place.

(Yes of course "I" believe women HAVE agency and are NOT idiots, but this is the message we get.)

It does suss out a little if one person is basically OK and the other person is unconscious or totally and obviously fucking obliterated.  But yes, both drunk and willing at the time =/= rape has happened, assuming they both knew what they were actually drinking (or at least that neither was deliberately fucking around with the other's drinks- basically, yaknow, neither was being a predatory scumbag).

The main focus of this from the CDC is SUPPOSED to just be the alcohol and pregnancy debate.  Problem is they're not so much going about it like they're a health agency telling women the straight, perhaps unwanted truth about alcohol and pregnancy, and more going about it like parents trying to keep their teenager from drinking at prom and citing ALL the scary things around alcohol that they can possibly think of.

Part of the reason there really is a point to saying it kind of the way they're saying it if you take away the other stupid "and here's MORE reasons not to drink, ladies!" bullshit out is this very, very stupid idea that there's a difference between having hetero, PIV sex (where neither of you is known to be unable to conceive) sans contraception or birth control just because, yaknow, it's fun to have sex, vs. "trying to get pregnant."  If you're doing it bareback and not on birth control, whether or not you want to make a baby doesn't affect whether you're gonna get knocked up. 

If you reel it back to the fact that people actually fucking have the dumbass mindset that it somehow makes some kind of contraceptive difference if you're "trying" to get pregnant vs having PIV sex and hoping you don't get pregnant, it makes sense to point out that yeah, if you aren't taking measures to not be pregnant, please take measures to not accidentally get knocked up and produce a kid with FAS.  That's still kind of unsayable in a way that won't piss people off, but that's the intended takeaway, and again, getting offended by it doesn't mean there's not actually a solid reason that that's good advice.  Of course it would be best if it was also pointed out than Plan B and abortion are also options that you may want to consider extra-hard if you know already this is a high-risk pregnancy because of exposure to alcohol, but then again, it would be best if that actually WAS an option to women across the States (and the world).  Meanwhile the religious crazies would flip the fuck out if you dared talk about abortion as a good idea, so you can't say that, either.

I guess what I am trying to say is that I can totally understand with the current climate how an agency like this would treat women as silly children on these issues and without the agency and intelligence to make decisions on her own sexual matters.

It is abhorrent. It is aggravating. In many ways the sexual liberations that the women in their 60's and 70's fought for has converted into safe spaces and fear generated insecurities around anything sexual.



Point in case. If you can not see a bunch of things wrong with this and No it is not talking about "passed out women". This is society.

So unlike you, I understand the context and the condescension completely, whilst being, like you,  appalled by it.

[Icequeen]

Raise your hand if an alcoholic beverage contributed to your conception.

*raises hand*

Seriously this crap is getting ridiculous.

Pretty soon sex will be a thing of the past for anyone wanting a child.
They will require 6 months of pre-parenting classes, a full background check including character references, monthly drug and alcohol screening, and your child will be conceived and supported in a sterile lab until "delivery" time...then you will then be subject to a prior inspection to make sure you have a suitable child safe environment prepared.

Good grief.

[Gopher Gary]

God invented alcohol so ugly people can breed too. 

[Al Swearegen]

Raise your hand if an alcoholic beverage contributed to your conception.

*raises hand*

Seriously this crap is getting ridiculous.

Pretty soon sex will be a thing of the past for anyone wanting a child.
They will require 6 months of pre-parenting classes, a full background check including character references, monthly drug and alcohol screening, and your child will be conceived and supported in a sterile lab until "delivery" time...then you will then be subject to a prior inspection to make sure you have a suitable child safe environment prepared.

Good grief.

Exactly.
"Social Progressives"/Feminists love it, because they get to redefine what is socially acceptable and become the authorities on this.
Government loves it because by it allows them to become more Authoritarian than they were before. ("You want to give up rights and responsibilities? Great! How can we censor, ban, marginalise and oppress you in the name of protecting you?")

Here is another thing http://dailysurge.com/2015/10/california-trains-kids-to-ask-for-consent-every-10-minutes-during-sex/

If you can bear to listen to this horrid voice, you will see where they are taking consent and how infantised and fragile they are painting women in general.

She is NOT an outlier either and taking this to logical conclusions.

Its nauseating

[Icequeen]

That is nauseating. 

Too many questions for me...takes the fun right out of it.

[MLA]

Raise your hand if an alcoholic beverage contributed to your conception.

*raises hand*

Seriously this crap is getting ridiculous.

Pretty soon sex will be a thing of the past for anyone wanting a child.
They will require 6 months of pre-parenting classes, a full background check including character references, monthly drug and alcohol screening, and your child will be conceived and supported in a sterile lab until "delivery" time...then you will then be subject to a prior inspection to make sure you have a suitable child safe environment prepared.

Good grief.

It'll help the overpopulation problem

[MLA]

Raise your hand if an alcoholic beverage contributed to your conception.

*raises hand*

Seriously this crap is getting ridiculous.

Pretty soon sex will be a thing of the past for anyone wanting a child.
They will require 6 months of pre-parenting classes, a full background check including character references, monthly drug and alcohol screening, and your child will be conceived and supported in a sterile lab until "delivery" time...then you will then be subject to a prior inspection to make sure you have a suitable child safe environment prepared.

Good grief.

Exactly.
"Social Progressives"/Feminists love it, because they get to redefine what is socially acceptable and become the authorities on this.
Government loves it because by it allows them to become more Authoritarian than they were before. ("You want to give up rights and responsibilities? Great! How can we censor, ban, marginalise and oppress you in the name of protecting you?")

Here is another thing http://dailysurge.com/2015/10/california-trains-kids-to-ask-for-consent-every-10-minutes-during-sex/

If you can bear to listen to this horrid voice, you will see where they are taking consent and how infantised and fragile they are painting women in general.

She is NOT an outlier either and taking this to logical conclusions.

Its nauseating

Thing is, she isn't really talking to you.  She is mostly talking to young girls who don't know any better.

[Gopher Gary]

That is nauseating. 

Too many questions for me...takes the fun right out of it.

May I touch your butt? 

[odeon]

I tried watching it. I really did.

['andersom']

I didn't even try. Looking at the face while still standing still is already too much in my face.