Agenda 21

[Beardy McFuckface]

Being proud of your skin colour is stupid. Your skin colour does not give you any benefits.

That said, dark skin has some advantages in terms of avoiding sunburn.

[Beardy McFuckface]

Something like affirmative action, yes I find that racist since I find it patronising they can't hire ie. a black person for their skill and only doing so for the colour of his skin.

Wouldn't be as much of a problem if it was tweaked to declare that the person with higher qualification gets highest priority. So in a situation of a black having greater qualification than a white candidate, they are guaranteed the job strictly for the merit of his/her skill, rather than discarded because of their race. Ironically, isn't that what affirmative action should really be doing? Ensuring education is rewarded and equal opportunities are granted?

Affirmative action- what it actually is meant to do is protect minorities from discrimination. It's a fact that very few employers actually hire strictly on the merit of qualification. A lot of hiring has to do with perceived qualification, and also the willingness of the employer to work with someone. If someone is highly qualified but the employer dislikes them, it's within their right not to hire them.

Now, it is generally perceived as much easier for a person to relate to other people of their same community. If the majority of employers start out as male, white, upper/middle class, neurotypical, it is very likely they will favour people of their similar culture- mainly because it is who they are used to working with, and who they are used to serving.

I hate it when people assume that employers hire strictly based on qualification. That's a goddamn lie. It ain't unnatural to want to hire people who you feel comfortable with (or who your team will feel comfortable with), in fact that is good hiring practice.

The only problem is, the way society was- only a certain culture of people (male, white, upper/middle class), who have been favoured for centuries, are the people in the power positions. People don't open their minds if don't have too. They prefer comfort and constancy.

Anyone of any minority knows that in order for people such as that to hire someone outside of their general community, they need an INCENTIVE. Thats what affirmative action does. If nothing else, businessmen and politicians understand incentives...it is therefore logical to apply one for the quickest results.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/cchr/pdf/race_report_web.pdf
http://www.econ.brown.edu/fac/glenn_loury/louryhomepage/teaching/Ec%20137/pager_testers_nyc_discrimination.pdf
http://rollingout.com/politics/employers-prefer-white-felons-over-blacks-with-no-criminal-record-so-how-will-blacks-feed-their-families/

Some horrifying shite.  White felons can more easily get some jobs than black people with clean CORIs.

Such an example can't be fixed with affirmative action, especially if the discrimination still exists.

It's better to fix the discrimination rather than masking it. Sadly this may take a few generations as this society is still held back by previous generations.

[El]

Something like affirmative action, yes I find that racist since I find it patronising they can't hire ie. a black person for their skill and only doing so for the colour of his skin.

Wouldn't be as much of a problem if it was tweaked to declare that the person with higher qualification gets highest priority. So in a situation of a black having greater qualification than a white candidate, they are guaranteed the job strictly for the merit of his/her skill, rather than discarded because of their race. Ironically, isn't that what affirmative action should really be doing? Ensuring education is rewarded and equal opportunities are granted?

Affirmative action- what it actually is meant to do is protect minorities from discrimination. It's a fact that very few employers actually hire strictly on the merit of qualification. A lot of hiring has to do with perceived qualification, and also the willingness of the employer to work with someone. If someone is highly qualified but the employer dislikes them, it's within their right not to hire them.

Now, it is generally perceived as much easier for a person to relate to other people of their same community. If the majority of employers start out as male, white, upper/middle class, neurotypical, it is very likely they will favour people of their similar culture- mainly because it is who they are used to working with, and who they are used to serving.

I hate it when people assume that employers hire strictly based on qualification. That's a goddamn lie. It ain't unnatural to want to hire people who you feel comfortable with (or who your team will feel comfortable with), in fact that is good hiring practice.

The only problem is, the way society was- only a certain culture of people (male, white, upper/middle class), who have been favoured for centuries, are the people in the power positions. People don't open their minds if don't have too. They prefer comfort and constancy.

Anyone of any minority knows that in order for people such as that to hire someone outside of their general community, they need an INCENTIVE. Thats what affirmative action does. If nothing else, businessmen and politicians understand incentives...it is therefore logical to apply one for the quickest results.

http://www.nyc.gov/html/cchr/pdf/race_report_web.pdf
http://www.econ.brown.edu/fac/glenn_loury/louryhomepage/teaching/Ec%20137/pager_testers_nyc_discrimination.pdf
http://rollingout.com/politics/employers-prefer-white-felons-over-blacks-with-no-criminal-record-so-how-will-blacks-feed-their-families/

Some horrifying shite.  White felons can more easily get some jobs than black people with clean CORIs.

Such an example can't be fixed with affirmative action, especially if the discrimination still exists.

It's better to fix the discrimination rather than masking it. Sadly this may take a few generations as this society is still held back by previous generations.

What alternatives would you suggest?

(If you already posted an answer to this, link me to it?  I did read a bit in the spaces between what I quoted and here, but I skimmed a lot.)

[Beardy McFuckface]

What alternatives would you suggest?

Fixing issues with institutionalised racism in a direct manner, ie. try to make interviews as unbiased as possible (focus more on ability than race/gender etc.), improve education in minority sections, etc.

[El]

What alternatives would you suggest?

Fixing issues with institutionalised racism in a direct manner, ie. try to make interviews as unbiased as possible (focus more on ability than race/gender etc.), improve education in minority sections, etc.

Well, OK, yes, but that will take somewhere between a long time, and until hell freezes over.  What about the interim?

[Beardy McFuckface]

There's no quick fix for the interim. This kinda stuff will take a few generations.

[RageBeoulve]

Being proud of your skin colour is stupid. Your skin colour does not give you any benefits.

That said, dark skin has some advantages in terms of avoiding sunburn.

Not being proud of every aspect of yourself is stupid. Living a life with a mediocre opinion of your own body and mind does not give you any benefits. That said, there are a lot just like you in this generation. Self hating, pathetic cunts.

[Beardy McFuckface]

I don't hate or like my skin colour. I fail to see the reason to.

I'm proud of my abilities, which is something that does matter.

[sg1008]

I've never felt proud or ashamed of my skin colour. That said, I do feel proud of some interesting markings on my body- birth marks, strange scars, freckles. etc.

Di you know that the shape of your butt is actually the result of scarring from when it was originally folded over and fused together?

Your butt crack is a scar LOL.

Yes I am proud of my body for it's genetic decision making accomplishments. I mean- imagine what went on in the womb that half of the top part of my foot ended up white skinned, and part of the sole ended up brown? Whoa.

It is an accomplishment indeed. ...Although, for my foot, I like to think my DNA got confused for a second.

[RageBeoulve]

I don't hate or like my skin colour. I fail to see the reason to.

I'm proud of my abilities, which is something that does matter.

Because its part of you. To hell with racism.

[RageBeoulve]

I've never felt proud or ashamed of my skin colour. That said, I do feel proud of some interesting markings on my body- birth marks, strange scars, freckles. etc.

Di you know that the shape of your butt is actually the result of scarring from when it was originally folded over and fused together?

Your butt crack is a scar LOL.

Yes I am proud of my body for it's genetic decision making accomplishments. I mean- imagine what went on in the womb that half of the top part of my foot ended up white skinned, and part of the sole ended up brown? Whoa.

It is an accomplishment indeed. ...Although, for my foot, I like to think my DNA got confused for a second.

Reminds me of beavis and butthead calling 911 and saying they have a huge crack in their asses.

[Beardy McFuckface]

I don't hate or like my skin colour. I fail to see the reason to.

I'm proud of my abilities, which is something that does matter.

Because its part of you. To hell with racism.

The way I see it is that my colour is only really an arbitrary reflection of light at a specific wavelength. I cannot be proud of something so arbitrary, especially if I can appear in different colours under various wavelengths of light. I'm ghost white in IR, yet purple in UV. Hell, I'm see through in X-ray wavelengths!

[El]

There's no quick fix for the interim. This kinda stuff will take a few generations.

There's the issue.  It's a little bit harsh to say "Sorry, you're going to have to deal with absolutely no compensation for the discrimination you and your children and your children's children will face, because anything short of slow social change is a bandaid solution."

[Beardy McFuckface]

No one's saying people should put up with it. I'm just saying such quick fixes like affirmative action only really harms in the long run. For example, bad education services leaves a lot of minorities ill-equipped for the jobs they've a chance to get into due to affirmative action, even though they should have been. Sorting out proper education would be better than quotas or leniency due to race, since they will be much better prepared and thus become more productive workers.

What people should start doing is fixing the problems I outlined earlier, make companies employ purely by ability (how the person presents themselves and showing their skills) of the person rather than race/gender etc. and in general teach people to stop being pricks about race. This may take a while, but it's better to start here than to do nothing.

[Adam]

Being proud of your skin colour is stupid. Your skin colour does not give you any benefits.

That said, dark skin has some advantages in terms of avoiding sunburn.

Not being proud of every aspect of yourself is stupid. Living a life with a mediocre opinion of your own body and mind does not give you any benefits. That said, there are a lot just like you in this generation. Self hating, pathetic cunts.

Not being proud of our skin colour does not have to mean hating your skin colour or being ashamed of it

It's stupid to be proud of ANYTHING that you had no control over. I am not proud of being white, having green eyes or being born in the UK. I am GLAD I was born in the UK, sure, and there are plenty of things I like about it. But I didn't have to pass a test to be born here. I am proud of what I have achieve. Not what I just happen to be.