Drugs Live (people taking ecstacy on TV)

[midlifeaspie]

Very short acting, and totally unsuitable for self-medication. Propofol just knocks you right out. I've had it once, for induction of anaesthesia, in combination with fentanyl for my knee surgery and it hit like a ten ton tank.

Its been abused/taken recreationally by anaesthetists before quite a lot of times, and frequently has killed even those with expertise in its use. EXTREMELY steep dose-response curve. Plus its pretty much active by IV only.

Once again, you miss the point

[Lestat]

No, I got your point, but was pointing out the idiocy of self-medication with propofol. I wouldn't even think of using propofol recreationally or medically.

It was sort of pleasant, for all of about 15 seconds, before that, and the heavy dose of fent KO'ed me, but using it oneself is completely rediculous. Even given by a doc, the stuff is highly dangerous. Isn't propofol what was largely responsible for the death of whacko jacko?: (good riddance to the creepy, plastic-faced paedo IMO, but thats                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                               

[Callaway]

No, I got your point, but was pointing out the idiocy of self-medication with propofol. I wouldn't even think of using propofol recreationally or medically.

It was sort of pleasant, for all of about 15 seconds, before that, and the heavy dose of fent KO'ed me, but using it oneself is completely rediculous. Even given by a doc, the stuff is highly dangerous. Isn't propofol what was largely responsible for the death of whacko jacko?: (good riddance to the creepy, plastic-faced paedo IMO, but thats                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             

Yes, he got a doctor to administer it, but he wasn't hooked up to equipment to monitor his breathing and when the doctor left the room to go to the bathroom or something, he stopped breathing.

I have taken propofol a few times, but only under the care of an anaesthesiologist.

[Lestat]

It is a very effective induction anaesthetic, thats for sure.

I've had it just the once, for my knee op. Got given a shot of fentanyl, and one of propofol, and lol, felt a bit short-changed, as the propofol knocked me out cold before I could even enjoy the rush of the fent properly

But its dangerous stuff, with an extremely steep dose-response curve.

Not surprising the plastic paedophile carked it, that doc was one irresponsible fuck, had nutcase nonce on a whole fucking shitload of opioids, benzos and other downers. I'm actually surprised even without the propofol, that he survived all the stuff getting pumped into his bloodstream.

[midlifeaspie]

. . . on a whole fucking shitload of opioids, benzos and other downers.

That IS nuts.  Somebody responsible should have stepped up and done something.  Didn't he have parents who were watching this all go down and simply turned a blind eye to it?  It's not like he had a chemistry lab set up in their home or something, but almost as bad.

[Lestat]

Whacko jacko the plastic paedophile didn't live with his folks AFAIK, but in his own bizarre kiddie-shagger playground 'neverland'

Where he invited children over to sleep in his bed with him.

Always thought jackson was an epic creepazoid, thinking he was peter pan, inviting little children to sleep in his bed, giving them 'jesus juice' aka wine and other booze.

Not sorry to see him go.

[TheoK]

Michael Jackson wasn't 

[Lestat]

I don't usually use the term 'freak', but plastic paedo bwoy certainly was.

And the way he kept his kid covered with a face veil. That must have been so humiliating for the kid, having a mentally screwed up nonce with a plastic face for a father, and being dressed up like a bloody muslim.

Bad enough having a kiddie fiddler for a father, without being forced to dress like some filthy camelfucker that worships one too Poor kid, having a name like 'blanket' and being dressed in a bleedin' burka, sheesh.

[renaeden]

So is it possible to get restless arm?? I used to get what I think was that at night as I was trying to go to sleep. It was so bad that I had to get up and walk around. What stopped it was lowering the dose of haloperidol I was on at the time - and I wasn't even on that high a dose.

[Lestat]

Antipsychotics are known for causing akathisia (the name for the nasty, nasty thing that is basically RLS, all over, everywhere)

I've had it be caused by mirtazepine, got put on it for sleep, as it was just about the only thing the stingy pricks would give out when I was inside. I took a fraction of the lowest dose pills, and christ, I just wanted to die.

Its known to have a lot to do with both low dopamine levels and excessive                                                                                                                                                noradrenaline. As for haldol, nasty, poisonous stuff IMO. Never taken it, never would either. Eew.

[renaeden]

It wasn't like akathisia - I get that mildly now and I am ok with it, it just makes my rocking more noticeable. It was more like getting a slowly building up feeling of electrification in my arm and then I would shiver to get rid of it. And then it would start up again. It was almost unbearable.

I have been on mirtazepine, all I wanted to do was eat and sleep on that. It did nothing for my depression.

Haloperidol, yeah that was an experience. The side effects were so bad that I had to take benztropine to stop them. Parkinson-like shakes were noticeable and I had twitches too. But I switched over to ziprasidone because of the weight gain I experienced on haloperidol.

[Lestat]

Thats what akathisia is ren. You get it essentially now and then, sorta randomly?

Sorry to hear that *hugs* its fucking awful. I didn't know mirtazepine was an alpha2 adrenoreceptor antagonist (alpha2 is whats called an autoreceptor, autoreceptors act as negative feedback switches basically, when levels of a neurotransmitter become too high, they start activating the relevant autoreceptor, assuming their is one for that neurotransmitter system, and it essentially tells the brain 'too much floating around here, stamp on the breaks') Which is why in this case, an adrenergic antagonist actually increases the level of (nor)adrenergic neurotransmitter release. An example of one for NA would be yohimbine, sometimes taken as a sexual stimulant for some bizarre reason. I was wrongfully locked up (no, not drug charges), and of course, didn't have the resources pharmacologically speaking, or internet connection/copy of the BNF that I'd have access to otherwise to find out that mirtazepine, aside from being a crazy potent antihistamine (actually, IIRC, it is THE most powerful sedating type antihistaminergic agent used clinically, the binding affinity/IC:50 is absolutely fucking nuts) its also an alpha2 adrenoreceptor antagonist. If I'd have known that I would never have taken it, and could have predicted the awful reaction to it before it ever had a chance to happen .

Sure as hell didn't help me sleep, didn't make me hungry either, just triggered  an extremely severe episode of akathisia, and caused severe myoclonic episodes, twitching, shaking, muscle fasciculations and anxiety straight from the foulest reeking pit in all of Tartarus. It was so bad I would cheerfully have offed myself to stop it had I the means to do it.

The DA antagonists are nasty, potentially highly dangerous drugs, and I see them rx'd for some reasons that IMO they should NEVER be given out for, such as by docs for sleep who are too tight to write a script for benzos, never happened to me, never will either; as I would simply flat out refuse to have anything to do with them. And sometimes even heard of them being given to TODDLER age kids, for fucks sake. Which is bloody rediculous. Some of the side effects can be permanent, tardive dyskinesia for instance, or tardive akathisia even. I can't imagine living with the latter. I'd definitely off myself if I was stuck with it, and permanently. Or in the case of neuroleptic malignant syndrome, potentially even lethal. IIRC haldol can also form an MPTP-like metabolite that is like MPTP, selectively destructive towards dopamine neurons in the substantia nigra, Which is the part of the brain using dopaminergic neurons to control/allow movement, resulting in very, very severe, chemically-induced parkinson's if enough are damaged or destroyed.

IMO benztropine should be dished out with any script for the antipsychotics, so patients do not  have to wait to see their doc to get hold of some if the side effects do happen.

Its a damn shame how ineffective drugs for schizophrenia currently on the market can be. Glutamatergic agents are currently being researched though which should be a lot less all-round noxious. 

[renaeden]

I don't get that arm thing anymore, thankfully. I haven't since I stopped the haloperidol. I thought it was linked to when I injured my arm my leaning on the arm of a chair for ages while using the computer and sort of compressing the nerves near my elbow. After I did that I had to sleep with my elbow sort of turned inwards or it felt like I was making the injury worse. It took two years for that to get better.

Just wondering what it is that makes me rock then. Is that akathisia? I have noticed that since I have been on antipsychotics that I absolutely have to rock while I am standing up, back and forth.

[ZEGH8578]

Extacy is a drug I haven't tried, nor do I have much interest in trying. Stimulants never did much for me anyway :I
The few times I tried coke, I ended up just strolling back to my room to computergame or browse online. I was probably allready high on weed, so I was feeling fine allready. Whatever feel-good-y effect the cocaine had, was probably allready there :I

[Lestat]

Yes ren, thats pretty much it. Almost like a sensation of being...sort of inner tension, taken to extremes, like having an electric charge that has to be grounded by movement..only as soon as one ceases moving, back it comes.

Fucking awful. I'd sooner pull my toenails out with pliers than ever go through that again.