Suicide

[Callaway]

I should note I never said people should have the right to commit suicide. I'm undecided on that, personally.

How could you argue that people don't have the right to commit suicide, given that you have tried to kill yourself twice and made a detailed plan to do so more recently?

Are you assuming that I was thinking logically and rationally during those times?

No, of course you weren't rational, but the fact that you tried it implies that you believe you have a right to try it.

[Kaelyrhn]

It doesn't really imply anything.

[bodie]

I have seen some awful nurses.  I do not defend any nurse who acts unprofessionally.   What i will say is they are not superhuman.  Expecting them to NOT have feelings like 'anger'  is a bit far fetched.

It must be bizarre to work somewhere where you have a ward full of people literally fighting for their lives,  and then another ward where people are trying to end it.

I can't quite get my head around the whole suicide issue as i have never ever felt that way or spent any time dwelling on it.  The only thing i am sure about is i believe they have the right to do it.

[Kaelyrhn]

I think we're mostly talking about ER/ED nurses, so only one ward. I also believe (but could be wrong) you need extra training to work on a psych ward.

[bodie]

Psych nurses should have special training,  as they are dealing with very vulnerable people.

Where i live,  the nhs is in a piss poor state.  My friend has a god daughter,  Katy,   who took an overdose and was taken to A&E.  She didn't even see a psych nurse,  or anyone in that field.  She was dealt with by a junior doc, who hardly spoke a word of English and was given an appointment for psych evaluation some two days later.

That is really shit.  She is ok now.  This was a while back. 

[Zippo]

Psych nurses should have special training,  as they are dealing with very vulnerable people.

Where i live,  the nhs is in a piss poor state.  My friend has a god daughter,  Katy,   who took an overdose and was taken to A&E.  She didn't even see a psych nurse,  or anyone in that field.  She was dealt with by a junior doc, who hardly spoke a word of English and was given an appointment for psych evaluation some two days later.

That is really shit.  She is ok now.  This was a while back.

thats some piss-poor work right there.

[Kaelyrhn]

Mental Health is lacking in lots of nations. It's such an invisible illness and many people just don't understand it unless they have some personal experience with it. The negative stigma, and ablest privilege certainly doesn't make it easy for those with a mental illness to actually talk about it either.

[odeon]

A suicidal person is often the victim of an ILLNESS. that is why they have done it.

Whereas someone who eats,drinks,smokes etc is often simply just choosing to put their life/health at risk

Do you live in a large city or near one? Why do you put your life at risk?

[odeon]

If you say you should have the right to try to off yourself, fine, but should the doctors have to save your sorry arse every time?

Of course they should. It's their job.

Should they prioritise you rather than some poor kid with asthma?

Like I said, whoever is in the most immediate danger should be prioritised. If the asthmatic kid is in the most immediate danger then definitely focus on them.

Next strawman.

That itself should be a fallacy. Dismissing counter arguments by incorrectly calling them fallacious.

Try again. The original argument against what I said was a typical strawman, therefore the one following was one too.

[odeon]

I should note I never said people should have the right to commit suicide. I'm undecided on that, personally.

Others have argued for that right in this thread. They have also claimed that not everyone attempting suicide is mentally unstable. So if they are sane and want to die, why should society have save them? And also, how does one distinguish between the ones that attempted suicide based on (supposedly) rational thought and the ones that didn't?

[Kaelyrhn]

I should note I never said people should have the right to commit suicide. I'm undecided on that, personally.

Others have argued for that right in this thread. They have also claimed that not everyone attempting suicide is mentally unstable. So if they are sane and want to die, why should society have save them? And also, how does one distinguish between the ones that attempted suicide based on (supposedly) rational thought and the ones that didn't?

If we can't tell the different, then we should err on the side of the assumption that they are all mentally ill.

[Adam]

A suicidal person is often the victim of an ILLNESS. that is why they have done it.

Whereas someone who eats,drinks,smokes etc is often simply just choosing to put their life/health at risk

Do you live in a large city or near one? Why do you put your life at risk?

  ridiculous comparison

I don't have much choice in the matter

Drinking/smoking etc though - I do. Unless of course it's an addiction, but then, suicide from depression is also from a mental ILLNESS

[odeon]

Why is it ridiculous? Because it's difficult for you to do something about it? Weak excuse.

[Adam]

It's a ridiculous comparison because I don't CHOOSE to live where I live

I do choose (for the most part) what i eat, whether I drink, whether I smoke etc though

['andersom']

What you eat is partly destined by the indoctrination by your parents. 

Parents should stop feeding their kids. Indoctrination is wrong.