This reminds me of something

[Al Swearegen]

OK so there was a time that I used to troll a little. The owner of the trolll site I was on was incensed.
He was loggedonto a forum for Moderators and Administrators to get support and share and so on. He used the opportunity for a bit of non-cost advertising. Someone else there would was an administrator of a flame forum basically denounced his site and talked up hers and made hers sound much more appealing and the better choice for wayward trolls and troublemakers to be sent.
He was livid. She had been a previous member on his troll site and whilst she left in a snit 6 months before his had, had no cause to have anything to do with 'S" since.
So now he asked a group of us on his forum, who wanted to go and troll her. Objective? Cause shit on the forum and flame and/or troll her. (He was not much of a troll himself. To him saying "You all suck. You lick balls. LOL" and then an automatic ban was good trolling and 20 people doing the sam,e 20 times as good. Thankfully most on his site were a little more creative and inspired).

Support was low 6 of us went on the site. Automatically we found that they locked down the forum to newbies and had a 'waiting room" type purgatory for new members. When they "proved themselves" able to face their fratermity house type of flaming and not break the rules and give back as good as, they were allowed in the forum proper.

We were down to 4. We found her of course but it was a strange arrangement oin there. She was surrounded by a tight little clique of maybe 6 or 7 core members and many well-wishers. For the most of the members they were textual punching bags and/or sycophants.
The power structure and culture were with S and her cohorts.

Getting to her was not going to be easy. Then one of the trolls got bored and within a couple of days the other left. Me and TB were the two left, feeling out the dynamics. We decided that to get to "S" we had to do it subtlely and sneakily by changing the forum culture and dynamics to favour us. They were a nasty bunch of arseholes.

We did three things together before he got banned - I found a picture of one of the vocal supporters of this group BD (of him doing a big teeth bared snarl) and TB found a picture of a guy putting a vibrator to his mouth. The end result after merging both was beautiful. Tb did similar with a picture he or i fouund of another of the more aggressive ladies on there. Not exactly petite her profile shot with a sweet straight file was merged with the face of a pig and "Sybersow" became my avatar. TB also started to push for another mod (one we favoured) and for "S" to be demodded.

We had a point of reference to get at a couple of them and also stir up the people who were copping it from that group.

I was by myself and copping it from all sides but that did not bother me. I took the time to read thread after thread. I started in on one about her alluded to drug use from earlier threads. I found absolute gold in the form of an old unsettled non-reconciled argument between two of them from months before. With a careful stoking of flames they predictably started in on each other.

I renewed my push for support of a new mod to replace "S" They finally got her not as a replacement but 'D" was in as another mod. The power shift and culture and dynamics were changing. 'S" was starting to act erratically. People sensed blood in the water and people who normally copped it started fighting back. I went in hard. We started getting stuff to come through "our mod' rather than S or her friend the other mod.

Finally "S" did soething really stupid. Her bikie boyfriend was coming out of prison for shooting and killing someone. He and her would take back the place and we better look out because he was a hardass.

It was beautiful. I encouraged her to being him. As I suspected. He was likely physically able to intimidate but without someone in his immediate vicinity he was unable to carry through any physical threat and he lack any ability to flame. I kicked his arse and a few others followed and he quit the forum in under 3 days. She was pounced on even by her supposed friends.

She quit. I quit too. After 3 months and 600+ posts.

[renaeden]

Sounds like it was all mind games. I really don't see the point of doing something like this unless the end result is a better forum for everyone.

[Al Swearegen]

* Digging up dirt to use against a Mod/Admin
* Changing the culture to fit you
* Using of personal information to harass and upset
* Working to bring people over to your side and drive a wedge between different factions or members of the forum
* Being indifferent to moral infractions in an effort to get change or dominance
* Working to your designs in a subtle and manipulative way.
* Disrespecting the forum and its members.
* Seeking to undermine the forum
* using the objective to ultimately say "Hey guys your forum sucks...youu have to make changes (irrespective of the fact that you caused problem through your actions)

It is funny too. I did this all with the expressed intent of trolling an Admin and i did not give a shit about the board nor its people.
The fact that the board is still going strong and stronger now. The members are now not totally under any mods thumb. D is there still and is running the show. I have posted there a bit in the last 6 months and am not disliked. Most who remember my efforts from 3 years ago accept it all turned out ok.
So that was why I did it and what i hoped to get out of it and why i did not care.

I see similar things happening here at I2 and it makes me reflect on this.

Anyone else see similarities going on here? if you do what do you think the motives are?

[Al Swearegen]

Sounds like it was all mind games. I really don't see the point of doing something like this unless the end result is a better forum for everyone.

It was, but by side effect, not intent.
The intent was to pwn "S" for being a pain in the arse to RB our troll forum's owner. Sure there was kudos in being able to display a good result but there was NO investment in the forum. It was just a place that she was, and was feeling unassailable.
It was simply a "screw with us and we screw with you".

[Pyraxis]

I don't see the similarities, at least not in direct parallels to people here. Similar in having a lot of trolling and jockeying for power.

Was S the owner of her site or just one of the mods?

['Butterflies']

Oh fuck Les. It looks like you wrote that with me in mind.

Adam is right. You do seem a bit obsessed with me. I must have really got under your skin

[Adam]

I'm sure that was a brilliant novel, Les (you are a great writer, after all), but I just dont have the attention span for it right now. sorry

btw, butterflies saying she was the main character in it makes me think it must be a romantic comedy. Am I right?

[Al Swearegen]

I don't see the similarities, at least not in direct parallels to people here. Similar in having a lot of trolling and jockeying for power.

Was S the owner of her site or just one of the mods?

One of the mods. Though the owner/admin Frank was not really more than a drop in visitor. S pretty much had cart blanche

[Al Swearegen]

Oh fuck Les. It looks like you wrote that with me in mind.

Adam is right. You do seem a bit obsessed with me. I must have really got under your skin

Had been talking about this to someone in a remember when way the other day and then thought, "Oh wow Butterlies whole "change the site it has lost its way" was kind of similar to what i was doing there" then I thought...wonder what else is similar?
That is where this came from. I find it interesting. Must you really have got under my skin? No, but if you thought you were a bigger deal than you were, you may think so. (I don't know what you think of course, you are just as likely to be making another ridiculous claim).

Oh just out of interest. With your the members have to change in order to change the site type of approach you were raising, is butterflies the intensitysquared member prepared to change herself to change the site. I mean you seem to favour the "I can not change anything about me or adapt and you are 'stuck" with me as i am" kind of attitude. Does that mean that you are saying others apart from you can change the site and that you will not? (You have said this kind of thing and more than happy to back this claim IF you want  )

Just interested?

['Butterflies']

Oh fuck Les. It looks like you wrote that with me in mind.

Adam is right. You do seem a bit obsessed with me. I must have really got under your skin

Had been talking about this to someone in a remember when way the other day and then thought, "Oh wow Butterlies whole "change the site it has lost its way" was kind of similar to what i was doing there" then I thought...wonder what else is similar?
That is where this came from. I find it interesting. Must you really have got under my skin? No, but if you thought you were a bigger deal than you were, you may think so. (I don't know what you think of course, you are just as likely to be making another ridiculous claim).

Oh just out of interest. With your the members have to change in order to change the site type of approach you were raising, is butterflies the intensitysquared member prepared to change herself to change the site. I mean you seem to favour the "I can not change anything about me or adapt and you are 'stuck" with me as i am" kind of attitude. Does that mean that you are saying others apart from you can change the site and that you will not? (You have said this kind of thing and more than happy to back this claim IF you want  )

Just interested?

Not your most coherant effort, but at least you kept it short, so I'll try and answer your main question.

I don't really want the site to change, as such. I want the site to go back to how it used to be.

We all have aspects of our personalities which are unlikely to change. Some of us are honest enough to admit this. There are parts of my personality that I would love to change. TBH the aspects of my personality that I would like to change are not the aspects of my personality that you are likely to have a problem with.

Of course I'm not prepared to "change myself to change a website." Unfortunately, no website is important enough for me to change who I am for.

If you were trying to ask me, "am I prepared to change my behaviour on this website, to help this website?" Then that would depend on certain issues, such as. What am I being asked to change? Who is asking me to change? And why are they asking me to change?

If someone I respected, PMd me, explaining that they felt my behaviour was wrong, and asking me to try and change, then I would give serious consideration to their request.

If someone like you expresses unhappiness at my behaviour, then I am unlikely to care. I am even less likely to care, when the only person really criticizing me, is a person that is cleary holding a grudge over something that happened months ago.

[Parts]

 

[Al Swearegen]

Oh fuck Les. It looks like you wrote that with me in mind.

Adam is right. You do seem a bit obsessed with me. I must have really got under your skin

Had been talking about this to someone in a remember when way the other day and then thought, "Oh wow Butterlies whole "change the site it has lost its way" was kind of similar to what i was doing there" then I thought...wonder what else is similar?
That is where this came from. I find it interesting. Must you really have got under my skin? No, but if you thought you were a bigger deal than you were, you may think so. (I don't know what you think of course, you are just as likely to be making another ridiculous claim).

Oh just out of interest. With your the members have to change in order to change the site type of approach you were raising, is butterflies the intensitysquared member prepared to change herself to change the site. I mean you seem to favour the "I can not change anything about me or adapt and you are 'stuck" with me as i am" kind of attitude. Does that mean that you are saying others apart from you can change the site and that you will not? (You have said this kind of thing and more than happy to back this claim IF you want  )

Just interested?

Not your most coherant effort, but at least you kept it short, so I'll try and answer your main question.

I don't really want the site to change, as such. I want the site to go back to how it used to be.

We all have aspects of our personalities which are unlikely to change. Some of us are honest enough to admit this. There are parts of my personality that I would love to change. TBH the aspects of my personality that I would like to change are not the aspects of my personality that you are likely to have a problem with.

Of course I'm not prepared to "change myself to change a website." Unfortunately, no website is important enough for me to change who I am for.

If you were trying to ask me, "am I prepared to change my behaviour on this website, to help this website?" Then that would depend on certain issues, such as. What am I being asked to change? Who is asking me to change? And why are they asking me to change?

If someone I respected, PMd me, explaining that they felt my behaviour was wrong, and asking me to try and change, then I would give serious consideration to their request.

If someone like you expresses unhappiness at my behaviour, then I am unlikely to care. I am even less likely to care, when the only person really criticizing me, is a person that is cleary holding a grudge over something that happened months ago.

It was very coherent. Problems in comprehension are all on your side.

Interesting answer. Especially the bit about the grudge. The "grudge" is non-existent and the clarity of the grudge even less so Especially when this has been explained already. (When you stated, in one of your more egotistical moments, I either i have a grudge or I fancy you, I think I prefer you to cling to this moronic rationale. It doesn't repulse me as much)

['Butterflies']

Oh fuck Les. It looks like you wrote that with me in mind.

Adam is right. You do seem a bit obsessed with me. I must have really got under your skin

Had been talking about this to someone in a remember when way the other day and then thought, "Oh wow Butterlies whole "change the site it has lost its way" was kind of similar to what i was doing there" then I thought...wonder what else is similar?
That is where this came from. I find it interesting. Must you really have got under my skin? No, but if you thought you were a bigger deal than you were, you may think so. (I don't know what you think of course, you are just as likely to be making another ridiculous claim).

Oh just out of interest. With your the members have to change in order to change the site type of approach you were raising, is butterflies the intensitysquared member prepared to change herself to change the site. I mean you seem to favour the "I can not change anything about me or adapt and you are 'stuck" with me as i am" kind of attitude. Does that mean that you are saying others apart from you can change the site and that you will not? (You have said this kind of thing and more than happy to back this claim IF you want  )

Just interested?

Not your most coherant effort, but at least you kept it short, so I'll try and answer your main question.

I don't really want the site to change, as such. I want the site to go back to how it used to be.

We all have aspects of our personalities which are unlikely to change. Some of us are honest enough to admit this. There are parts of my personality that I would love to change. TBH the aspects of my personality that I would like to change are not the aspects of my personality that you are likely to have a problem with.

Of course I'm not prepared to "change myself to change a website." Unfortunately, no website is important enough for me to change who I am for.

If you were trying to ask me, "am I prepared to change my behaviour on this website, to help this website?" Then that would depend on certain issues, such as. What am I being asked to change? Who is asking me to change? And why are they asking me to change?

If someone I respected, PMd me, explaining that they felt my behaviour was wrong, and asking me to try and change, then I would give serious consideration to their request.

If someone like you expresses unhappiness at my behaviour, then I am unlikely to care. I am even less likely to care, when the only person really criticizing me, is a person that is cleary holding a grudge over something that happened months ago.

It was very coherent. Problems in comprehension are all on your side.

Interesting answer. Especially the bit about the grudge. The "grudge" is non-existent and the clarity of the grudge even less so Especially when this has been explained already. (When you stated, in one of your more egotistical moments, I either i have a grudge or I fancy you, I think I prefer you to cling to this moronic rationale. It doesn't repulse me as much)

OK then Les. You say you don't hold a grudge against me. I think you do.

It's pretty easy to find out who is right. I will not attack or attempt to insult you without further provocation.
If you are able to stop attacking me, stop writing essays about me, and stop appearing to try to persuade people that I am a bad, nasty, despicable person, etc. then you will be showing that you possibly do not have a grudge against me.

If you continue to attack me, write essays about me, and appear to try and persuade people that I'm a bad person, then it will be clear that you do hold a grudge against me.

[Al Swearegen]

Oh fuck Les. It looks like you wrote that with me in mind.

Adam is right. You do seem a bit obsessed with me. I must have really got under your skin

Had been talking about this to someone in a remember when way the other day and then thought, "Oh wow Butterlies whole "change the site it has lost its way" was kind of similar to what i was doing there" then I thought...wonder what else is similar?
That is where this came from. I find it interesting. Must you really have got under my skin? No, but if you thought you were a bigger deal than you were, you may think so. (I don't know what you think of course, you are just as likely to be making another ridiculous claim).

Oh just out of interest. With your the members have to change in order to change the site type of approach you were raising, is butterflies the intensitysquared member prepared to change herself to change the site. I mean you seem to favour the "I can not change anything about me or adapt and you are 'stuck" with me as i am" kind of attitude. Does that mean that you are saying others apart from you can change the site and that you will not? (You have said this kind of thing and more than happy to back this claim IF you want  )

Just interested?

Not your most coherant effort, but at least you kept it short, so I'll try and answer your main question.

I don't really want the site to change, as such. I want the site to go back to how it used to be.

We all have aspects of our personalities which are unlikely to change. Some of us are honest enough to admit this. There are parts of my personality that I would love to change. TBH the aspects of my personality that I would like to change are not the aspects of my personality that you are likely to have a problem with.

Of course I'm not prepared to "change myself to change a website." Unfortunately, no website is important enough for me to change who I am for.

If you were trying to ask me, "am I prepared to change my behaviour on this website, to help this website?" Then that would depend on certain issues, such as. What am I being asked to change? Who is asking me to change? And why are they asking me to change?

If someone I respected, PMd me, explaining that they felt my behaviour was wrong, and asking me to try and change, then I would give serious consideration to their request.

If someone like you expresses unhappiness at my behaviour, then I am unlikely to care. I am even less likely to care, when the only person really criticizing me, is a person that is cleary holding a grudge over something that happened months ago.

It was very coherent. Problems in comprehension are all on your side.

Interesting answer. Especially the bit about the grudge. The "grudge" is non-existent and the clarity of the grudge even less so Especially when this has been explained already. (When you stated, in one of your more egotistical moments, I either i have a grudge or I fancy you, I think I prefer you to cling to this moronic rationale. It doesn't repulse me as much)

OK then Les. You say you don't hold a grudge against me. I think you do.

It's pretty easy to find out who is right. I will not attack or attempt to insult you without further provocation.
If you are able to stop attacking me, stop writing essays about me, and stop appearing to try to persuade people that I am a bad, nasty, despicable person, etc. then you will be showing that you possibly do not have a grudge against me.

If you continue to attack me, write essays about me, and appear to try and persuade people that I'm a bad person, then it will be clear that you do hold a grudge against me.

You know this is quite a strange proposition.

I will let you know why.

As long as you write shitty things that I disagree with I will call you on it. That is nothing to do with having a grudge or not and what I do with all people on here and since before you ever came here. Now you like to categorise this as 'grudge behaviour'. On that basis you are going to lay down terms and conditions as to how i behave? Something like that?

I am aware that you could similarly say, and likely with as much false conviction

"OK then Les. You say you don't fancy me. I think you do.

It's pretty easy to find out who is right. I will not attack or attempt to insult you without further provocation.
If you are able to stop attacking me, stop writing essays about me, and stop appearing to try to persuade people that I am a bad, nasty, despicable person, etc. then you will be showing that you possibly do not fancy me."

This premise too would be equally as silly. It is just an attempt at controlling what and how i post. Very transparently silly.

How about this. It proves nothing and thank you for your suggestion but I am not prepared to entertain your illogical premise nor your want to control my actions.

How about this as an alternative, you stop behaing in a shitty manner and i will not call you on it. Same as I would do for anyone else here?

I like this one better. What do you say....not controlling enough, nor helping your irrational premises? Sorry. Guess I am not prepared to humour bullshit.