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Author Topic: The Dutch finally admit to warcrimes.  (Read 2580 times)

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Offline Dexter Morgan

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Offline 'andersom'

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Re: The Dutch finally admit to warcrimes.
« Reply #76 on: December 20, 2011, 04:54:27 PM »
Wow, that happens when kids are getting bigger, I completely missed the news about the arresting of that man.

I do still like Zwarte Piet though.

The origin of the figure of him is not one clear one, certainly not this one story of that teacher Jan Schenkman alone.

There are many myths connected with him, and, some have to do with slavery indeed.

There is the uncle Tom like myth, of St Nic buying a little Ethiopian boy free from slavery. And, out of gratitude the boy stayed with st Nic. Not a strong myth about Zwarte Piet, but, it's there.

Much stronger is the myth that he is a Moor, and, a Moor was no good, taking over Spain, with their religion, and their threat to the christian population. They may have done in slavery, catching and selling christian kids. (That gives some dread to the story about kids being taken by Piet in his big bag, and makes some sense about where the really bad kids would go)

Before that, there was the connection of Zwarte Piet and the Devil. Good guy bad guy scenario. St Nic is in command, but, bad kids........

And before that, the German Myth of Odin, riding the skies on his horse Sleipnir, accompanied by his ravens, may be connected with it.

It's an old tradition, and, it has evolved in different ways over Europe.

The soot version of St Nicolas helper is real and very clear in a region in Germany.


Doesn't change the fact that Zwarte Piet did get a west-indies accent in the Netherlands, and, an appearance as in pictures from old mission booklets, when I was young. And, that he was stereotyped as dim-witted. Zwarte Piet keeps changing though. There are more, they are smarter. And, sometimes they come in all colours of the rainbow.
He completely lost the aspect of being frightening too.

I don't mind the figure of Zwarte Piet. It is evolving, and will keep on evolving. And, when the figure of Zwarte Piet brings up the question of slavery, that's a good thing IMO. It is too easy to forget that the economical heigh-days of the Netherlands were there because of shipping slaves. Let the question pop up, again and again, and let the uneasy truth come up every time it is asked.

Zwarte Piet I have no issue with. I hope there will not be a culture commission making the fest of St Nic into something unchangeable. it needs to evolve to stay alive and to make sense.

Arresting a man who is critical, and who pops the question about slavery, that I do have problems with.  And, big ones too.
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Re: The Dutch finally admit to warcrimes.
« Reply #77 on: December 20, 2011, 05:32:16 PM »
Black Peter was brought up in the movie Collateral by the Colombian kingpin so the legend obviously is used in places other than Netherlands. I won't hold that old legend against the Dutch. I can't find that scene but here is Vincent zapping two other badguys with his HK USP45.  :thumbup: I happen to have a USP45 and a USPc45.  :)


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Re: The Dutch finally admit to warcrimes.
« Reply #78 on: December 20, 2011, 05:48:24 PM »
Here is Vincent attempting a room clearing exercise at a nightclub. Note how the 12 + 1 capacity of the USP45 comes in handy when combined with a tactical reload.


Offline 'andersom'

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Re: The Dutch finally admit to warcrimes.
« Reply #79 on: December 20, 2011, 05:59:42 PM »
^ Aaah, that's why I have a problem with crowds.  :hyke:
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Re: The Dutch finally admit to warcrimes.
« Reply #80 on: December 20, 2011, 06:03:03 PM »
^ Aaah, that's why I have a problem with crowds.  :hyke:
:indeed: You never can tell who will get disruptive.

Offline 'andersom'

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Re: The Dutch finally admit to warcrimes.
« Reply #81 on: December 20, 2011, 06:06:16 PM »
^ Aaah, that's why I have a problem with crowds.  :hyke:
:indeed: You never can tell who will get disruptive.

Funny, the shooting did not make me nauseous, the mind-boggling moving without a direction of the crowd, while still dancing undisrupted, did though.
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Re: The Dutch finally admit to warcrimes.
« Reply #82 on: December 20, 2011, 06:26:14 PM »
^ Aaah, that's why I have a problem with crowds.  :hyke:
:indeed: You never can tell who will get disruptive.

Funny, the shooting did not make me nauseous, the mind-boggling moving without a direction of the crowd, while still dancing undisrupted, did though.
Maybe you should have been a femme Nikita instead of a postie.  :dunno:

Offline "couldbecousin"

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Re: The Dutch finally admit to warcrimes.
« Reply #83 on: December 20, 2011, 06:27:49 PM »
^ Aaah, that's why I have a problem with crowds.  :hyke:
:indeed: You never can tell who will get disruptive.

Funny, the shooting did not make me nauseous, the mind-boggling moving without a direction of the crowd, while still dancing undisrupted, did though.
Maybe you should have been a femme Nikita instead of a postie.  :dunno:

 Exactly, who would ever suspect a sweet little Dutch lady of being an assassin?  :laugh:
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Offline 'andersom'

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Re: The Dutch finally admit to warcrimes.
« Reply #84 on: December 20, 2011, 06:36:08 PM »
^ Aaah, that's why I have a problem with crowds.  :hyke:
:indeed: You never can tell who will get disruptive.

Funny, the shooting did not make me nauseous, the mind-boggling moving without a direction of the crowd, while still dancing undisrupted, did though.
Maybe you should have been a femme Nikita instead of a postie.  :dunno:

 :chin: I am between careers at the moment, and not sure where to head.......

I can do upside down chocolate moo things!