Intensity Squared History Guide Joint Project Discussion

[Calavera]

Odeon, Callaway, Pyraxis, and whoever was there at the time, where exactly should I insert the bit about the controversial thread (made by jman) into the history post?

[Callaway]

I'm not sure what happened here, but I'm sure Callaway did it

 :lol:

I wasn't an admin on the old Intensity nor one of the founders on the Neurolands, so I had no access to do anything.  I was one of the people who were on the Drivel to discuss what we were going to do regarding Intensity after the supposed hacking, though.

[Pyraxis]

What Dunc thought about Alex is a matter of record. Who hacked Intensity isn't. Either back up your shit or shut up, Pyraxis.

Edit: I just realised that I'm playing into your strawman, right here. You'll have to prove it was hacked to begin with, don't you?

Not sure what you mean by the strawman, but I can see that if we pursued this fully, it would end up like your callout with Mechanima. I would keep saying things and you would keep insisting I wasn't backing up my words to your satisfaction. I said what I wanted to say, I'll continue doing so, and if that doesn't constitute backing my shit up to you, tough luck.

[Callaway]

Odeon, Callaway, Pyraxis, and whoever was there at the time, where exactly should I insert the bit about the controversial thread (made by jman) into the history post?

The anonymous thread which Jman started, titled something like "Which WP female would you fuck?" happened shortly before the supposed hacking.

I thought that Neuroman tried to set up the debate between Vivi and McJagger after the supposed hacking, not before.  My understanding at the time was that was the only way Neuroman would bring Intensity back up as part of the Neurolands. 

Another point perhaps worth mentioning is that at that time Neuroman seemed a very different person than the way WolFish seems now.  He seemed much more sensitive.

[odeon]

What Dunc thought about Alex is a matter of record. Who hacked Intensity isn't. Either back up your shit or shut up, Pyraxis.

Edit: I just realised that I'm playing into your strawman, right here. You'll have to prove it was hacked to begin with, don't you?

Not sure what you mean by the strawman, but I can see that if we pursued this fully, it would end up like your callout with Mechanima. I would keep saying things and you would keep insisting I wasn't backing up my words to your satisfaction. I said what I wanted to say, I'll continue doing so, and if that doesn't constitute backing my shit up to you, tough luck.

Bullshit. You don't have the proof, only accusations, and you know it. Want to address Callaway's point if not mine?

[odeon]

What Dunc thought about Alex is a matter of record. Who hacked Intensity isn't. Either back up your shit or shut up, Pyraxis.

Edit: I just realised that I'm playing into your strawman, right here. You'll have to prove it was hacked to begin with, don't you?

Not sure what you mean by the strawman, but I can see that if we pursued this fully, it would end up like your callout with Mechanima. I would keep saying things and you would keep insisting I wasn't backing up my words to your satisfaction. I said what I wanted to say, I'll continue doing so, and if that doesn't constitute backing my shit up to you, tough luck.

Oh, and your strawman was treating your assumption of the site being hacked as a basis of your post.

[odeon]

Intensity Squared is not a nation. It's an online forum.

And so far, most of the post there is from your own words.

Er, your point?

For what it's worth, I suspect that a few hundred years from now, this period, the beginning of mass global communication and the online societies that have sprung up because of it, will be seen as a cultural phenomenon with equal validity to geographically-organized historical societies.

Er, *your* point?

For what it's worth, it is only your words. You insinuate you know more, you say that Nman advised you on this, but you don't have proof. You never did but this is not the first time you went after Lucifer. If you had actually had any you would have shown it a long time ago.

If we are just talking about accusations without proof, McJagger thought that Intensity wasn't really hacked at all, he thought that Neuroman just deleted Jman's infamous thread and turned off the site.  McJagger accessed Intensity through a PM link, although he could only access the admin panel at first.  He saw that Intensity's board had been turned off, so he turned it back on again.  He spent five minutes or so looking around and saw that everything was fine with the site except Jman's thread, which had been deleted.  Then, since he still thought at that time that the site had been hacked and worrying that his personal computer might be vulnerable, he turned off Intensity's board again and logged off.  Then he posted about what he had found out in the founders forum on the Neurolands. Within twelve hours his ability to access the site at all was removed.

I remember McJ mentioning that at some point, now that you mention it.

[odeon]

Oh, and yet another thing, Pyraxis: regarding objectivity, facts and all that, care to address that part about the facts behind Dunc's opinions about the plank vs yours about Lucifer hacking Intensity? As if they were comparable, which they are not, but I'm willing to play your game for this instance.

[Pyraxis]

Bullshit. You don't have the proof, only accusations, and you know it. Want to address Callaway's point if not mine?

Correct. I don't have proof. What I don't get is why you keep harping on it when I thought we agreed on that several pages back. There was an issue with the database, it might or might not have been caused intentionally but there's no real way to tell. How did it get so far under your skin?

Callaway might be right about the sequence of events, that Nman tried to arrrange the McJ/Vivi callout after Intensity went down for the first time. At this point I'm tempted to not even bother looking it up, just for the sake of needling you. I think she has access to the threads on Nlands as well, and more patience for archiving.

But  here.

I see a threat from McJ on March 28, 2006 that he wants Intensity back up within 24 hours and Vivi to not have any say over whether it stayed, so at that point it was both down and the callout had been announced.

There's a thread on WrongPlanet here from March 29, 2006 where a lot of people are offering to back an independent site and Dunc is offering the Drivel as a place to talk about it.

Per McJ (SB2) somebody PM'ed Vivi on March 26, objecting to that thread about fucking WP members. On March 28 Intensity went down and Shima suspected hackers and McJ saw someone had manually disabled it from the admin panel. It was up again later that day and it sounds like that's when the callout was announced. Vetivert (Vivi) says she will respond on the Drivel, not wp. I think that was a previous incarnation of the Drivel and it won't be in the archives anymore. On March 29 Nman says he made a unilateral decision about Intensity and that he at that point trusts Vivi more than McJ. En una isla (shima) tells them to take the discussion back to Nlands and implies that she as another founding member of nlands is also hurt that nman is not considering their POV.

[Pyraxis]

Oh, and yet another thing, Pyraxis: regarding objectivity, facts and all that, care to address that part about the facts behind Dunc's opinions about the plank vs yours about Lucifer hacking Intensity? As if they were comparable, which they are not, but I'm willing to play your game for this instance.

What aspect did you want addressed? It seemed clear to me. Though maybe I should have been more specific that McJ was the most outspoken about accusing Lucifer and I personally only suspected it later. At the time I suspected Nman of taking it down deliberately and didn't know about any hacking. In my original post about the history I didn't specify who made any of the accusations, because I wanted to give the impression that the whole thing was a chaotic panic. It was much later after working with Nman to try and get the database back up that I saw his old chatlogs with Lucifer and started to get a better picture of what was going on, on an interpersonal level.

[Callaway]

Bullshit. You don't have the proof, only accusations, and you know it. Want to address Callaway's point if not mine?

Correct. I don't have proof. What I don't get is why you keep harping on it when I thought we agreed on that several pages back. There was an issue with the database, it might or might not have been caused intentionally but there's no real way to tell. How did it get so far under your skin?

Callaway might be right about the sequence of events, that Nman tried to arrrange the McJ/Vivi callout after Intensity went down for the first time. At this point I'm tempted to not even bother looking it up, just for the sake of needling you. I think she has access to the threads on Nlands as well, and more patience for archiving.

But  here.

I see a threat from McJ on March 28, 2006 that he wants Intensity back up within 24 hours and Vivi to not have any say over whether it stayed, so at that point it was both down and the callout had been announced.

There's a thread on WrongPlanet here from March 29, 2006 where a lot of people are offering to back an independent site and Dunc is offering the Drivel as a place to talk about it.

Per McJ (SB2) somebody PM'ed Vivi on March 26, objecting to that thread about fucking WP members. On March 28 Intensity went down and Shima suspected hackers and McJ saw someone had manually disabled it from the admin panel. It was up again later that day and it sounds like that's when the callout was announced. Vetivert (Vivi) says she will respond on the Drivel, not wp. I think that was a previous incarnation of the Drivel and it won't be in the archives anymore. On March 29 Nman says he made a unilateral decision about Intensity and that he at that point trusts Vivi more than McJ. En una isla (shima) tells them to take the discussion back to Nlands and implies that she as another founding member of nlands is also hurt that nman is not considering their POV.

I don't have access to the Neurolands founder's forum.  Do you?

I see Shima's point.  My understanding is that several people including Shima, Tigerlily, McJagger, Hermit, and Neuroman founded the Neurolands together, so why was Neuroman making any unilateral decisions concerning it and as much as I like Vivi, what was he doing dragging her into the middle of a decision concerning Intensity, which was McJagger's site, not hers?

[Calavera]

Wow, it's become even more intense.

No wonder the name.

[Pyraxis]

I don't have access to the Neurolands founder's forum.  Do you?

The threads I'm looking at are in Deleted Threads and in a forum called The Attic. I don't see a founder's forum. I know there was a forum deleted by shima the day nman gave me admin access to nlands, because it had private information. Could that have been it?

[Callaway]

I don't have access to the Neurolands founder's forum.  Do you?

The threads I'm looking at are in Deleted Threads and in a forum called The Attic. I don't see a founder's forum. I know there was a forum deleted by shima the day nman gave me admin access to nlands, because it had private information. Could that have been it?

I don't know whether it was or not, but I can't see Deleted Threads or The Attic, either.

[odeon]

Bullshit. You don't have the proof, only accusations, and you know it. Want to address Callaway's point if not mine?

Correct. I don't have proof. What I don't get is why you keep harping on it when I thought we agreed on that several pages back. There was an issue with the database, it might or might not have been caused intentionally but there's no real way to tell. How did it get so far under your skin?

It got under my skin? Hardly. I object when you accuse someone without proof and when you continue to imply it after, as you say, you thought we agreed several pages ago. I realise you feel I'm being difficult when I ask you to back it up or shut up, but that's the nature of this place.

Callaway might be right about the sequence of events, that Nman tried to arrrange the McJ/Vivi callout after Intensity went down for the first time. At this point I'm tempted to not even bother looking it up, just for the sake of needling you. I think she has access to the threads on Nlands as well, and more patience for archiving.

Needling me? /shrugs

I guess you are the one with an agenda, not me.

But  here.

I see a threat from McJ on March 28, 2006 that he wants Intensity back up within 24 hours and Vivi to not have any say over whether it stayed, so at that point it was both down and the callout had been announced.

Proving what? That McJ was pissed?

There's a thread on WrongPlanet here from March 29, 2006 where a lot of people are offering to back an independent site and Dunc is offering the Drivel as a place to talk about it.

Which he often did back then. Proving what?

Per McJ (SB2) somebody PM'ed Vivi on March 26, objecting to that thread about fucking WP members. On March 28 Intensity went down and Shima suspected hackers and McJ saw someone had manually disabled it from the admin panel. It was up again later that day and it sounds like that's when the callout was announced. Vetivert (Vivi) says she will respond on the Drivel, not wp. I think that was a previous incarnation of the Drivel and it won't be in the archives anymore. On March 29 Nman says he made a unilateral decision about Intensity and that he at that point trusts Vivi more than McJ. En una isla (shima) tells them to take the discussion back to Nlands and implies that she as another founding member of nlands is also hurt that nman is not considering their POV.

Proving what?