I call out Les

['Butterflies']

A nasty insult was made at someone you consider to be your friend.

You have done nothing but use that insult to your own advantage, both to present YOU as the innocent victim, and to attack me.

What I said was wrong. No doubt about it, but I'm now pretty sickened by by your efforts to milk that insult on someone else.

I called her rancid. No woman is going to want to see that insult being discussed on a public message board, but yet, you have no compunction about using that slur to score points.

You claim that she would want you to use that nasty insult to score points, but yet you show no evidence to back up th claim.

I'm now beginning to see Pandora as a true victim in this, not so much because of my slur, but because of your determination to use her to score points.

[Al Swearegen]

Don't sweat over it Butterflies. You don't give a shit about Pandora and have said so in any case. I doubt whether you give a shit about who you have a go at so why bother? I think you need a nap.

We have a callout already to finish off

http://www.intensitysquared.com/index.php/topic,18371.0.html

Probably better not trying to attach personality and some understanding to a woman you know fuck all about and recently called "rancid". Makes you look insincere and stupid.

By the way "You claim that she would want you to use that nasty insult to score points, but yet you show no evidence to back up the claim."

I made that claim? No I didn't you just introduced it then. Best get back to the other callout and finish that up and get some sleep.

Tomorrow when you come back on the board hopefully you will see what a stupid gesture this was. Well maybe. You have been surprising me lately. Not all in a good way to be honest but variety is the spice of life and all that.

[Al Swearegen]

Butterflies I am going to have to leave you to your fail now. Bed beckons but to give you a little something to work with whilst I am asleep:

I called her rancid. No woman is going to want to see that insult being discussed on a public message board, but yet, you have no compunction about using that slur to score points.

First reference to me using this as a points scoring exercise

You claim that she would want you to use that nasty insult to score points, but yet you show no evidence to back up th claim.

Second reference to me using this as a points scoring exercise and a claim that I want to use what you said as a points scoring exercise. One I never actually made anywhere, and was invented by you in this same post above.

I'm now beginning to see Pandora as a true victim in this, not so much because of my slur, but because of your determination to use her to score points.

The last claim of me using it as a points scoring exercise that BECAUSE of the claim I never made that you just invented. Pandora is a victim in this and that your slur was nothing in comparison to the claim I made that I did not make that you just invented?

Butterflies this made no more sense than your Strawman argument. In fact it made even less. 
I don't think this is your thing. I don't think you really have any idea what you are on about and it shows.
I think pretending to care is not working for you either.
I can not give you advice on this. I have finished laughing at your fail and I guess you can abandon it as a silly idea or try bravely to salvage it. I would go the former, were I you,  but I will enjoy the latter too.

Have fun Butterflies.

['Butterflies']

Don't sweat over it Butterflies. You don't give a shit about Pandora and have said so in any case. I doubt whether you give a shit about who you have a go at so why bother? I think you need a nap.

We have a callout already to finish off

http://www.intensitysquared.com/index.php/topic,18371.0.html

Probably better not trying to attach personality and some understanding to a woman you know fuck all about and recently called "rancid". Makes you look insincere and stupid.

By the way "You claim that she would want you to use that nasty insult to score points, but yet you show no evidence to back up the claim."

I made that claim? No I didn't you just introduced it then. Best get back to the other callout and finish that up and get some sleep.

Tomorrow when you come back on the board hopefully you will see what a stupid gesture this was. Well maybe. You have been surprising me lately. Not all in a good way to be honest but variety is the spice of life and all that.

I have done the decent thing and apologized to her for my part in this. I think you have stooped very low in using her, and I really think you owe her an apology as well.
You are not acting as her friend. I would never want to be treated by a friend in the way you have treated her. In fact, if a friend treated me as you have treated her, they would not be my friend.

You've hassled me to do the decent thing. Now, be a man and do the decent thing yourself.

[Al Swearegen]

Don't sweat over it Butterflies. You don't give a shit about Pandora and have said so in any case. I doubt whether you give a shit about who you have a go at so why bother? I think you need a nap.

We have a callout already to finish off

http://www.intensitysquared.com/index.php/topic,18371.0.html

Probably better not trying to attach personality and some understanding to a woman you know fuck all about and recently called "rancid". Makes you look insincere and stupid.

By the way "You claim that she would want you to use that nasty insult to score points, but yet you show no evidence to back up the claim."

I made that claim? No I didn't you just introduced it then. Best get back to the other callout and finish that up and get some sleep.

Tomorrow when you come back on the board hopefully you will see what a stupid gesture this was. Well maybe. You have been surprising me lately. Not all in a good way to be honest but variety is the spice of life and all that.

I have done the decent thing and apologized to her for my part in this. I think you have stooped very low in using her, and I really think you owe her an apology as well.
You are not acting as her friend. I would never want to be treated by a friend in the way you have treated her. In fact, if a friend treated me as you have treated her, they would not be my friend.

You've hassled me to do the decent thing. Now, be a man and do the decent thing yourself.

The decent thing for a friend to do is to defend your friend. You slurred her and you apologised for the slur. (To be honest an expression of remorse, regret, or acceptance of wanting to do things differently was probably enough).
Matters not a damn what you consider friendship worthy but rather what Pandora does. If you say it is bad treatment and she copnsiders it fair or worthy then who really gives a fuck what your values are? Is this correct or not?
Oh the other thing is I am sending her an email tonight to get her opinion on the matter.

The truth of the matter is ytou coming in playing Pandora's defender is absurd. It speaks of insincerity and looks that you want an out with the least amount of accountability, whilst looking as good as you possibly can in the situation and trying to attach some shit to me on the way out.

Looks very much like this. Why? I think you, me and everyone looking at this post knows why. We are not THAT stupid Butterflies. You are rather transparent.

So that out the way why not address wjhat I wrote in my second post here?

['Butterflies']

The decent thing for a friend to do is to defend your friend. You slurred her and you apologised for the slur. (To be honest an expression of remorse, regret, or acceptance of wanting to do things differently was probably enough).
Matters not a damn what you consider friendship worthy but rather what Pandora does. If you say it is bad treatment and she copnsiders it fair or worthy then who really gives a fuck what your values are? Is this correct or not?
Oh the other thing is I am sending her an email tonight to get her opinion on the matter.

The truth of the matter is ytou coming in playing Pandora's defender is absurd. It speaks of insincerity and looks that you want an out with the least amount of accountability, whilst looking as good as you possibly can in the situation and trying to attach some shit to me on the way out.

Looks very much like this. Why? I think you, me and everyone looking at this post knows why. We are not THAT stupid Butterflies. You are rather transparent.

So that out the way why not address wjhat I wrote in my second post here?

No Les. The decent thing is not to defend a friend at the cost of their dignity.

Do you know what rancid means when refering to a woman? It means nothing, but implies several things. Ugly, low moral fibre, dirty, and a lack of freshness in the vital areas.
This is the insult that you have chosen to post about several times a day. You could have let it be burried, but instead you chave chosen to bring it to the front of the site. Anyone who reads the site is now likely to read about Pandoras "issues," even though they may well not even have a shred of truth.

If a man defended me in this way, I would take him outside and kick every tooth out of his head.

If you are so convinced that you have done Pandora a service by promoting a well burried insult to headline news, then bring her onto the site to tell us she approves herself. If you do, then I will personally apologize to her.

And please stop using terms like "We are not THAT stupid Butterflies," and "I think you, me and everyone looking at this post knows why." Speak for yourself. I don't think you need to tell everyone else what they think.

[Al Swearegen]

The decent thing for a friend to do is to defend your friend. You slurred her and you apologised for the slur. (To be honest an expression of remorse, regret, or acceptance of wanting to do things differently was probably enough).
Matters not a damn what you consider friendship worthy but rather what Pandora does. If you say it is bad treatment and she copnsiders it fair or worthy then who really gives a fuck what your values are? Is this correct or not?
Oh the other thing is I am sending her an email tonight to get her opinion on the matter.

The truth of the matter is ytou coming in playing Pandora's defender is absurd. It speaks of insincerity and looks that you want an out with the least amount of accountability, whilst looking as good as you possibly can in the situation and trying to attach some shit to me on the way out.

Looks very much like this. Why? I think you, me and everyone looking at this post knows why. We are not THAT stupid Butterflies. You are rather transparent.

So that out the way why not address wjhat I wrote in my second post here?

No Les. The decent thing is not to defend a friend at the cost of their dignity.

Do you know what rancid means when refering to a woman? It means nothing, but implies several things. Ugly, low moral fibre, dirty, and a lack of freshness in the vital areas.
This is the insult that you have chosen to post about several times a day. You could have let it be burried, but instead you chave chosen to bring it to the front of the site. Anyone who reads the site is now likely to read about Pandoras "issues," even though they may well not even have a shred of truth.

If a man defended me in this way, I would take him outside and kick every tooth out of his head.

If you are so convinced that you have done Pandora a service by promoting a well burried insult to headline news, then bring her onto the site to tell us she approves herself. If you do, then I will personally apologize to her.

And please stop using terms like "We are not THAT stupid Butterflies," and "I think you, me and everyone looking at this post knows why." Speak for yourself. I don't think you need to tell everyone else what they think.

I seriously doubt you would Butterflies. I think this is all just an overly desperate ploy.
As to whether I will try to convince Pandora to come to the site that she has been slurred and her fiance upset from for the " benefit" of having you apologise to her, are you fucking stupid?
I will of course email her and discuss it. I have no problem with this.
She knows my form and what I do and do not defend and on what terms and to what tenancity. This falls in line with those values that she actually likes about me.
That sdaid I am happy to take HER cue on this and not yours. Makes sense huh?
Doesn't really help you in your bid to dominate the discourse or get me to modify my standpoint or behaviour, I know, but tough.
Anyone readiong this will not see "Pandora's issues I am sure. But rather a heated discussion that you have desperately tried to pass off as of no importnace and now have gone full circle embracing the severity and are seeking to push the ownership of the slight against her away from yourself.

Be back soon.

[Al Swearegen]

You know I think that the only person's dignity that has been crestfallen is your own. You made the comment and had a "so who cares?" attitude about it. You tried to push all responsibility and accountability away from you to him. 'He said so therefore" type comments, to alleviate any accountability
That did not cut it with me. Still doesn't.
You tried to saying I was being mnanipulating and had an absurd weak strawman argument, in an effort to make my position look silly and dubious.
I don't think anyone bought that.
Then you tried the "I am a bad girl, so what approach?"
That went nowhere.
Then there was the appeal to agree to disagree and get things over with.
I simply said no.
Finally a "seen the light" backflip of epic proportions. As you give an apology with Academy Awards worthy sincerity. You are a good troll Butterflies I have never said otherwise. You then to give further weight to your sincerity decide to make up for the loss of dignity, chose to look at a completely left field avenue to passing of some measure of blame. Why be the only person in the wrong. All you did is made a "harmless throwaway comment", surely I am much worse for defending a friend rather than leaving a slight uncontested.

Obvious troll is obvious Butterflies.

Loss of dignity is projection.

You don't like me talking on behalf of the collective whole, on basis that I do not actually know all their values or what their thoughts are?
Sure happy to drop the "we" inferences, if you drop the inferences of what Pandora (who you know in no other way other than a person you once called "Rancid") would do think or feel. That is fair isn't it? To demand otherwise would be hypocritical wouldn't it? No?
Actually this is an example of pointing out a possible hypocritical claim. You may want to look back on that sarcastic inference of my hypocrisy that you made against me in the other thread.
Then again if you struggle to back any "claim" it may serve you better making underhanded insinuations/allusions/implications/inferences and not too strong lest they become claims you can not back.

['Butterflies']

I have went to the bother of asking a fair few real life people if they would be happy with you acting the way you are, if they were Pandora. They have been unanimous that they would be disgusted by your behaviour. You could easily back your point though, simply by bringing Pandora to the site to show her everything that has gone on. If you're right, then it won't harm you. She'll be so pleased that you've taken a well-hidden insult about her hygiene, and made sure that everyone on the site is likely to know about it.
So, what are you waiting for? It can only enhance your relationship with her, right? This point is well within your power to prove.
Until then, I will continue to tell you that to use Pandora to score points in a fight is cynical, but to continually drag up a rather degrading insinuation about her lack of feminine hygiene is cruel beyond anything that has been done to her on this site, by me or Steve. Do the decent thing Les and apologize to her.


You claim that this whole argument is you defending Pandora. No right thinking person would ever choose to defend someone in the way you have "defended" Pandora. It seems to me that you are butthurt at me, and are prepared to use a so-called friend to score points.
So I ask myself, why?
I keep coming back to the same conclusion. You appear to like to play the big-man and tell Squid when to apologize, and appear to be happy to see him give you the respect you feel you are due and humbly apologize.
You tried the same thing with me, and I was dismissive of you. Since then you have been determined to drag this on. I think you are butthurt because I didn't give you the respect you seem to think you deserve.
Of course, that is an opinion, and am therefore unable to present "facts" that back my case, before you start another tedious rant at me to "Back my claims"


And my last point is, you question my  "seen the light backflip of epic proportions." There is no backflip. I had no real issue about what I said about Pandora to wind up Steve in a well-hidden post,  and felt no need to apologize.
Now that Pandora has been turned into "big news" by your pretence of defending her, I feel terrible for her. She is being continuously degraded, simply so that you can attempt to make a point. For that, she deserves a hell of a big apology from everyone involved.

Les. You should be ashamed of yourself.

[Al Swearegen]

I have went to the bother of asking a fair few real life people if they would be happy with you acting the way you are, if they were Pandora. They have been unanimous that they would be disgusted by your behaviour. You could easily back your point though, simply by bringing Pandora to the site to show her everything that has gone on. If you're right, then it won't harm you. She'll be so pleased that you've taken a well-hidden insult about her hygiene, and made sure that everyone on the site is likely to know about it.
So, what are you waiting for? It can only enhance your relationship with her, right? This point is well within your power to prove.
Until then, I will continue to tell you that to use Pandora to score points in a fight is cynical, but to continually drag up a rather degrading insinuation about her lack of feminine hygiene is cruel beyond anything that has been done to her on this site, by me or Steve. Do the decent thing Les and apologize to her.


You claim that this whole argument is you defending Pandora. No right thinking person would ever choose to defend someone in the way you have "defended" Pandora. It seems to me that you are butthurt at me, and are prepared to use a so-called friend to score points.
So I ask myself, why?
I keep coming back to the same conclusion. You appear to like to play the big-man and tell Squid when to apologize, and appear to be happy to see him give you the respect you feel you are due and humbly apologize.
You tried the same thing with me, and I was dismissive of you. Since then you have been determined to drag this on. I think you are butthurt because I didn't give you the respect you seem to think you deserve.
Of course, that is an opinion, and am therefore unable to present "facts" that back my case, before you start another tedious rant at me to "Back my claims"


And my last point is, you question my  "seen the light backflip of epic proportions." There is no backflip. I had no real issue about what I said about Pandora to wind up Steve in a well-hidden post,  and felt no need to apologize.
Now that Pandora has been turned into "big news" by your pretence of defending her, I feel terrible for her. She is being continuously degraded, simply so that you can attempt to make a point. For that, she deserves a hell of a big apology from everyone involved.

Les. You should be ashamed of yourself.

You should be ashamed of yourself for such a cheap trolling tactic Butterflies.

I think you are and perhaps a bit humiliated to boot.

You have asked a lot of friends? Great! Good to hear? Have you asked Pandora what she thinks? No?

I have. On the basis of this and not in the basis of your beat up, I will act. If she indicates that she appreciates my efforts, then answer me this. (it is not a hard one) "Why does what you and your friend's opinion on this matter?"

If she says no, then obviously I will apologise and unreservedly and you can be as ashamed of me as you like, either way.
Sound like a deal? Great! Glad it meets your approval.

Define "pretense of defending her". I really don't think you can, apart from alluding to a slight that we don't know that she has felt or a carrying on about your slur being miniscule in proportion to my defending a friend instead of letting it go unaswered.
It makes no sense does it Butterflies?

Once more, no I will not persuade my friend to come here. I have told her what has gone on. If she volunteers I will be more than a little protective and supportive of her if she comes on board. I will not force or make her. Friends do not do this.


But again are you the one who slurred her originally? Are you the one playing her public defender? Are you the one deeming to know what she would think with no more knowledge of her than, that she was a fiance of someone you traded insults with and someone you slurred? What else do you know about her that would supercede what I may? Go on, tell class.



You know what is REALLY funny?

This strawman argument

Person A has position X.
Person B disregards certain key points of X and instead presents the superficially similar position Y. Thus, Y is a resulting distorted version of X and can be set up in several ways, including:
Presenting a misrepresentation of the opponent's position

:lol: :lol:
It's often used used as a term to describe an ugly girl here.

For instance, you might say, "have you seen Jemima? She's fucking rancid"

But yes, It is properly used to describe something like meat or milk that has gone off

So that is the representation of rancid we are all working with "used as a term to describe an ugly girl". Got it. Thanks for explaining

but to continually drag up a rather degrading insinuation about her lack of feminine hygiene is cruel beyond anything that has been done to her on this site

So this is the new representation to rancid you are now introducing as pertaining to female hygiene. Again thanks.

Make good sense to do this right Butterflies?

No. It's a piss weak straw man argument.

Thanks again.

It's not that I'm a hypocrite though, honestly

Why embarass yourself be being trollish and sly? It comes off as so insincere.

[Al Swearegen]

I have went to the bother of asking a fair few real life people if they would be happy with you acting the way you are, if they were Pandora. They have been unanimous that they would be disgusted by your behaviour. You could easily back your point though, simply by bringing Pandora to the site to show her everything that has gone on. If you're right, then it won't harm you. She'll be so pleased that you've taken a well-hidden insult about her hygiene, and made sure that everyone on the site is likely to know about it.
So, what are you waiting for? It can only enhance your relationship with her, right? This point is well within your power to prove.
Until then, I will continue to tell you that to use Pandora to score points in a fight is cynical, but to continually drag up a rather degrading insinuation about her lack of feminine hygiene is cruel beyond anything that has been done to her on this site, by me or Steve. Do the decent thing Les and apologize to her.


You claim that this whole argument is you defending Pandora. No right thinking person would ever choose to defend someone in the way you have "defended" Pandora. It seems to me that you are butthurt at me, and are prepared to use a so-called friend to score points.
So I ask myself, why?
I keep coming back to the same conclusion. You appear to like to play the big-man and tell Squid when to apologize, and appear to be happy to see him give you the respect you feel you are due and humbly apologize.
You tried the same thing with me, and I was dismissive of you. Since then you have been determined to drag this on. I think you are butthurt because I didn't give you the respect you seem to think you deserve.
Of course, that is an opinion, and am therefore unable to present "facts" that back my case, before you start another tedious rant at me to "Back my claims"


And my last point is, you question my  "seen the light backflip of epic proportions." There is no backflip. I had no real issue about what I said about Pandora to wind up Steve in a well-hidden post,  and felt no need to apologize.
Now that Pandora has been turned into "big news" by your pretence of defending her, I feel terrible for her. She is being continuously degraded, simply so that you can attempt to make a point. For that, she deserves a hell of a big apology from everyone involved.

Les. You should be ashamed of yourself.

Aha.

Here is what she ACTUALLY thinks (Part of a reply email sent tonight)

> But anyway, I fully agree that you did the right thing in defending me
> against the slurs such as being rancid. {an honest descriptor of what she feels towards you} doesn't even know me -
> she already said she thought I was ugly and then dirty as well. I might not
> be a fashion plate but I do bathe regularly and use deodorant

So. In light of what you wrote above. Let's break this down shall we?

I have went to the bother of asking a fair few real life people if they would be happy with you acting the way you are, if they were Pandora. They have been unanimous that they would be disgusted by your behaviour.

Are your friends Pandora? Do you have a many year relationship with her to base decisions that you make?
I do. I told you she would be ok with this and you chose to not only ignore it but to try to force me into acting in a way that is not in my expectations of how to treat my friend Pandora. It sounds like pure ego tripping "do this now for ME because i demand you should apologise and if you don't , you are X, Y, Z" was any of this what Pandora wanted, or was it what Butterflies wanted?

Why is that?

You could easily back your point though, simply by bringing Pandora to the site to show her everything that has gone on. If you're right, then it won't harm you.

I don't need to though do I Butterflies? She has seen what has been posted. Why does she need to come on the site? Are you silly enough to presume I have any fear or concern that she might? Why is that?

What harm exactly are you talking about and how does it apply?

by the way i have innvited her and i do not think she will come. Even to wait on you and your apology. I don't think she cares enough about you to bother. I can see how this could be true. Can you?

She'll be so pleased that you've taken a well-hidden insult about her hygiene, and made sure that everyone on the site is likely to know about it.

Given her reply, how much do you think this is in any way the slightest consideration to her or me? Come on tell class.

So, what are you waiting for?

Probably for a certain member of this forum to stop issuing pointless and unheeded orders and get over herself. Do you think this is a fair call?

 It can only enhance your relationship with her, right?

Wrong. my relationship with pandora is fine and does not need your seal of approval or for me to jump through your hoops. I need not friendship enhancement nor friendship enhancement advice from you. It is rather silly to imply that i do. isn't it? Why do you suspect that i do or need your advice? You read the status quo rather badly don't you think?

This point is well within your power to prove.

In my power to prove? Again butterflies, get over yourself. Tell me what needs proving.

Until then, I will continue to tell you that to use Pandora to score points in a fight is cynical, but to continually drag up a rather degrading insinuation about her lack of feminine hygiene is cruel beyond anything that has been done to her on this site, by me or Steve.

That time is now. So what exactly are YOU going to do now that the time is upon you?

Do the decent thing Les and apologize to her.

Apologise for what exactly. She appreciates what i have done in acknowledgement of what has been posted. So tell me what I am to apologise for and what it is that is to be made decent by doing so. struggling? Thought you may be.

You claim that this whole argument is you defending Pandora. No right thinking person would ever choose to defend someone in the way you have "defended" Pandora. It seems to me that you are butthurt at me, and are prepared to use a so-called friend to score points.

Really? Interesting. It is quite a presumption.
Either I am not a right thinking person then but have miraculously got it right.
OR
You are simply wrong and have tried second guessing me in the face of me telling you very explicitedly that I know my friends and what would or would not be appreciated and that my defending Pandora would be appreciated and YOU chose to cast aside this inferring I either was lying or had no sound understanding of my friends values.

I think the second option is a bit more compelling.

So I guess the question of why ignore what I had said over and over to you and carry on like you have with making this callout in the first instance? Do you have a clue? Wanna share?

BTW so-called friend seems very much like appreciative friend and nothing "so-called" about it. Why is this/ Why did you use this term and the implications surrounding it? Sounds a bit silly, in light of things now, huh?

So I ask myself, why?
I keep coming back to the same conclusion. You appear to like to play the big-man and tell Squid when to apologize, and appear to be happy to see him give you the respect you feel you are due and humbly apologize.
You tried the same thing with me, and I was dismissive of you. Since then you have been determined to drag this on. I think you are butthurt because I didn't give you the respect you seem to think you deserve.

Well as you seem to be wrong about pretty much everything as far as i see, I can see nothing less in this than a whine. It sounds kind of 'You dragged this out too long. You should have stopped but you didn't. you feel like a big man now Les?  " Sounds like butthurt to me. Could be wrong and it is just my opinion.

The truth? No I think this is just another callout like many callouts. I had an issue with you and i took it up with you. I saw you make a lot of dubious claims and i called you on them. I have no idea why you bring Squiddy into this/ Seems a little silly but no sillier than the claim you made that I had said i tried to score points in respect to Pandora. I believe that was in this very superflous and silly callout that you made.

Of course, that is an opinion, and am therefore unable to present "facts" that back my case, before you start another tedious rant at me to "Back my claims"

Indeed, why start making an actual case for anything you said. You have got pretty much everything else wrong on this callout so far. Haven't you Butterflies?

And my last point is, you question my  "seen the light backflip of epic proportions." There is no backflip. I had no real issue about what I said about Pandora to wind up Steve in a well-hidden post,  and felt no need to apologize.

Right.

Now that Pandora has been turned into "big news" by your pretence of defending her, I feel terrible for her. She is being continuously degraded, simply so that you can attempt to make a point. For that, she deserves a hell of a big apology from everyone involved.

It appears not afterall regardless of your thoughts on this. You interpret it the same way as i do?

Les. You should be ashamed of yourself.

For what exactly? She has no issue with what I have done. Tell me and everyone viewing your public announcement what I have to feel ashamed about. No?


Take your time with this one Butterflies.

The monumental fail in this callout may take a while to appreciate. I told you from the very first couple of responses in this callout that it was an abject failure didn't i. You should have taken note. But then you should have taken note when i expressed that i knew my friend and that you did not.

['Butterflies']

I do apologize to her, and feel bad that words that I used to wind up Steve have now found their way back to her. For that, I do feel horrible.

However, I have no reason whatsoever to believe that you have accurately described the full situation to her. I find it hard to believe that she would feel the same way if she saw how you had reacted and dredged up her situation.

 She already has a fair idea of what has went on, so there is no reason for you not to bring her to the site. You are obsessed with people backing everything up, so back youself by bringing her to the site to see yours, and my actions.
You have my word that if she does come onto this site, she will recieve a very full apology from me.

Until then, your claims that she supports your actions mean less than nothing.

[Al Swearegen]

I do apologize to her, and feel bad that words that I used to wind up Steve have now found their way back to her. For that, I do feel horrible.

However, I have no reason whatsoever to believe that you have accurately described the full situation to her. I find it hard to believe that she would feel the same way if she saw how you had reacted and dredged up her situation.

 She already has a fair idea of what has went on, so there is no reason for you not to bring her to the site. You are obsessed with people backing everything up, so back youself by bringing her to the site to see yours, and my actions.
You have my word that if she does come onto this site, she will recieve a very full apology from me.

Until then, your claims that she supports your actions mean less than nothing.

Three things here that I do not thing you really appreciate.

1. There really is no reason at all for her to come here, though i have asked her.

2. Apart from an invitation I can no more force her to come over than that and I simply wouldn't. You can of course say this is not what I should do as a friend but we have seen where that silly argument has gone haven't we?

3. I think she has no real interest in coming on her to recioeve the apology from you and i am surprised that you find this surprising

['Butterflies']

Three things here that I do not thing you really appreciate.

1. There really is no reason at all for her to come here, though i have asked her.

2. Apart from an invitation I can no more force her to come over than that and I simply wouldn't. You can of course say this is not what I should do as a friend but we have seen where that silly argument has gone haven't we?

3. I think she has no real interest in coming on her to recioeve the apology from you and i am surprised that you find this surprising

While your only evidence that she approves of your actions is a snippet of a conversation you had off-site, it is impossible to take it seriously.
It would be far too easy to (possibly) slightly misrepresent my actions, and to hugely misrepresent yours.

I still think your actions with regard to your friend have been crass. I have continued to ask around, and am unable to find anyone who would like to be defended in the way you have defended Pandora.

If a man had a tiny penis, or was impotent, do you think he would be happy to have a well-hidden jibe about his manhood turned into a 2 thread, 6 page long epic that everyone on the site is now aware of? Do you really think he would be happy if it was his friend that was responsible for making sure everone was aware of it?
I think not, and for that reason, I think you have shown yourself to be a poor friend.

In fact. If you were having this argument with someone else, I would currently be wracking my brains trying to come up with a polite way to ensure that you never defended me, without hurting your feelings telling you.

[Al Swearegen]

Three things here that I do not thing you really appreciate.

1. There really is no reason at all for her to come here, though i have asked her.

2. Apart from an invitation I can no more force her to come over than that and I simply wouldn't. You can of course say this is not what I should do as a friend but we have seen where that silly argument has gone haven't we?

3. I think she has no real interest in coming on her to recioeve the apology from you and i am surprised that you find this surprising

While your only evidence that she approves of your actions is a snippet of a conversation you had off-site, it is impossible to take it seriously.
It would be far too easy to (possibly) slightly misrepresent my actions, and to hugely misrepresent yours.

I still think your actions with regard to your friend have been crass. I have continued to ask around, and am unable to find anyone who would like to be defended in the way you have defended Pandora.

If a man had a tiny penis, or was impotent, do you think he would be happy to have a well-hidden jibe about his manhood turned into a 2 thread, 6 page long epic that everyone on the site is now aware of? Do you really think he would be happy if it was his friend that was responsible for making sure everone was aware of it?
I think not, and for that reason, I think you have shown yourself to be a poor friend.

In fact. If you were having this argument with someone else, I would currently be wracking my brains trying to come up with a polite way to ensure that you never defended me, without hurting your feelings telling you.

As much as you would have it otherwise, Pandora is not a man with a tiny penis.

Nor for that matter is pandora rancid. So your anology needs a little work doesn't it?

The "thinking" you seem to have done so much of in relation to this post seems a bit excessive for you to be still getting it so wrong and yet you are.

Pandora was reading this site. I was not providing her with snippets. Nor was I misrepresenting myself.

I told you that you did not know my friend and that I did and you ignored this fact before and after you made this callout.
Why you are still trying to hold onto the hope that you are not wrong, you simply are. Sad i know.

As to whether my actions were crass, it depends entirely on how they were recieved by her doesn't it?
How were they recieved by her?