Steve Jobs

[Squidusa]

I will say shit about the dead if I didn't like them to begin with. I think it's the height of hypocrisy to give respect to someone you once hated simply because they're dead, it's not respectful at all and if anything it's really just a shit attempt to take the bad luck off of yourself.

A couple of examples of this:
- People didn't mind shitting on Micheal Jackson, but then mourned over his death and tried to make it look like they loved him to bits. Bullshit, a while back they were pissing on him for fiddling with kids. I pissed on him too and I still think he probably did it.
- Irish people back in WWII denounced Hitler and tried to distance themselves from him.... yet they (including the Government) paid respects to him during his funeral. Just wow. (This is why I never can be patriotic of this country, it's ran by retards and voted by retards, but that's another topic/rant.)

This is a bit of an odd question , but would you apply this to soldiers who kill enemy soliders?

Same with the whole samurai belief of respecting your dead enemies and etc. 

Not trying to make a point , merely wondering what you consider hypocritical and what not, for the most part I agree with you , I wouldn't bad mouth a dead person infront of people who may have liked them unless I really dislike them also , but I see the hypocrisy.

(Apologies if ths made no sense , I'm fucking knackered.  )

[Zippo]

I will say shit about the dead if I didn't like them to begin with. I think it's the height of hypocrisy to give respect to someone you once hated simply because they're dead, it's not respectful at all and if anything it's really just a shit attempt to take the bad luck off of yourself.

A couple of examples of this:
- People didn't mind shitting on Micheal Jackson, but then mourned over his death and tried to make it look like they loved him to bits. Bullshit, a while back they were pissing on him for fiddling with kids. I pissed on him too and I still think he probably did it.
- Irish people back in WWII denounced Hitler and tried to distance themselves from him.... yet they (including the Government) paid respects to him during his funeral. Just wow. (This is why I never can be patriotic of this country, it's ran by retards and voted by retards, but that's another topic/rant.)

This is a bit of an odd question , but would you apply this to soldiers who kill enemy soliders?

Same with the whole samurai belief of respecting your dead enemies and etc. 

Not trying to make a point , merely wondering what you consider hypocritical and what not, for the most part I agree with you , I wouldn't bad mouth a dead person infront of people who may have liked them unless I really dislike them also , but I see the hypocrisy.

(Apologies if ths made no sense , I'm fucking knackered.  )

im with squiddy for the most one on this subject... how ever i strongly believe in honoring MOST fallen men... people worthy of honor.... i would not honor hitler himself, how ever i would honor some of his soldiers... the ones who fought honerably for what they believed in rather than just raping and pillaging. the japanese and russians especially... they fought for the most part with honor... or at least i heard of less brutal storys about them.

honoring those you care for is another thing i believe in... do not mistake honor for worship though. i in no way think steve jobs is a god and in no way feel he is really worth my time to worry about his life beyond death (if there is such a thing). i would honor him as someone who helped shape the world today. but in no way would i praise him... i would say i more respect him than anything, along with those soldiers who fought in world war two. those who did not get off on the violence but only fought to save there country and there fellow man.

[Frolic_Fun]

This is a bit of an odd question , but would you apply this to soldiers who kill enemy soliders?

That is an odd question, one I don't frankly get. Does is imply if I hate the soldiers for killing enemy soldiers?

Same with the whole samurai belief of respecting your dead enemies and etc. 

The respect was that the enemy showed skill in fighting and died an honorable death. However, I'm talking about people who will say shit to a person and then pretend they were best friends when the person dies. At least with samurais, they showed genuine respect rather than pretending to be best friends as if nothing happened.

Not trying to make a point , merely wondering what you consider hypocritical and what not, for the most part I agree with you , I wouldn't bad mouth a dead person infront of people who may have liked them unless I really dislike them also , but I see the hypocrisy.

If I didn't like the person then I would not change my opinion if they were dead. Nothing to do with their family so I would not get involved with that, I'd stay out of it.

['Butterflies']

I'm kinda in the middle on this. I have no problem being honest about the dead. Steve Jobs' business practises and products should be open to criticism, just as much as they are open to praise. Even now that he is dead.

Personally I've always seen this "don't speak ill of the dead" thing as something that involves personal relationships, and being able to let go of a grudge against a person who is now dead. There is no point in any kind of one-upmanship with a corpse, but neither should you feel the need to lie.
For example, most people know my views on Craving Rod. If I found out he had died, I would be honest and say that I neither liked, nor respected him. However, I would not explain that I thought he was a truly worthless human, and that I believe the world is slightly richer for his passing.
There is no point in bitching about the dead, but pretending they were great people in hypocritical.

[Squidusa]

This is a bit of an odd question , but would you apply this to soldiers who kill enemy soliders?

That is an odd question, one I don't frankly get. Does is imply if I hate the soldiers for killing enemy soldiers?

Same with the whole samurai belief of respecting your dead enemies and etc. 

The respect was that the enemy showed skill in fighting and died an honorable death. However, I'm talking about people who will say shit to a person and then pretend they were best friends when the person dies. At least with samurais, they showed genuine respect rather than pretending to be best friends as if nothing happened.

Not trying to make a point , merely wondering what you consider hypocritical and what not, for the most part I agree with you , I wouldn't bad mouth a dead person infront of people who may have liked them unless I really dislike them also , but I see the hypocrisy.

If I didn't like the person then I would not change my opinion if they were dead. Nothing to do with their family so I would not get involved with that, I'd stay out of it.

It was actually , and on reading my post realise I make absolute 0% , apologies I've finished for college for the week and the tiredness has set in. 

I think what I meant to ask was , Do you think soldiers should not boast about how many of the enemy they have killed? / slag off the people they have killed?

Thanks for your other answers though , was interested in your general beliefs surrounding respecting the dead.

[Parts]

[midlifeaspie]

Heh heh

[odeon]

Damn, that must suck really badly getting fired from your own company.

From wikipedia:
After losing a power struggle with the board of directors in 1985, Jobs left Apple and founded NeXT, a computer platform development company specializing in the higher-education and business markets.
Apple's 1996 buyout of NeXT brought Jobs back to the company he co-founded, and he served as its interim CEO from 1997, then becoming permanent CEO from 2000 onwards, spearheading the advent of the iPod, iPhone and iPad

Does that clear things a little?.

Gee, I wonder why he got fired from Apple in the first place?

Turned out it was a bad move to fire him. While he was gone it was a miracle Apple survived. They should thank Microsoft.

[odeon]

and did you accomplish half of the shit any of the people here were mentioned did ? or did you get fired for being weird ?

I know what you're trying to get to here. That I'm not "qualified" to say anything about Steve Jobs, is that correct?

Maybe there is hope for you yet. You really aren't.

[P7PSP]

- People didn't mind shitting on Micheal Jackson, but then mourned over his death and tried to make it look like they loved him to bits. Bullshit, a while back they were pissing on him for fiddling with kids. I pissed on him too and I still think he probably did it.

This example appears to be very inaccurate to me. From the time that MJ was initially accused of molesting boys there were his fans/supporters who refused to believe bad about him and people who believed he was guilty and detested him and probably a few who didn't care enough to form a firm opinion.

The same crowd who detested him were not necessarily the people lionizing him after he died. I believe he was a kiddie fiddler. I was not a fan of his music after 5th and 6th grade (Jackson 5 era) so I had no vested interest in kidding myself that a grown man who arranged sleepovers with 10 year old boys didn't appear to be up to no good.

 I believe most, if not all, of his most fervent supporters were fans who wanted the allegations to be untrue so they could enjoy his music without guilt.

[odeon]

All I know is that Michael Jackson's nose died several years before he did.

[eris]

If someone dies I'll have the same opinion of them as when they were alive, but won't say so in front of people who cared about that person. Why punish the mourners when it is the dead person you dont like ? If they are dead there is nothing left so might as well just let it go. It's more about letting others mourn and have their own opinion. If someone is dead, it's kinda over, so I stop caring.

[Callaway]

Heh heh

Good one.

[Calavera]

All I know is that Michael Jackson's nose died several years before he did.

According to him, he had a nose surgery so he could breathe better and sing higher notes.

Yeahhhhhh, right.

[P7PSP]

All I know is that Michael Jackson's nose died several years before he did.

According to him, he had a nose surgery so he could breathe better and sing higher notes.

Yeahhhhhh, right.

As a youngster he appeared to be a standard issue black kid.



After many years of cosmetic surgery.