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Author Topic: Have you seen this billboard?  (Read 3116 times)

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midlifeaspie

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #60 on: June 08, 2011, 02:48:51 PM »
The argument with the pro-life lobby is that all they want to do is get the child out of the mother, but they don't give a fuck about what happens afterwards.

 :indeed:

Unless that kid grows up to want an abortion.


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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #61 on: June 08, 2011, 02:54:50 PM »
The argument with the pro-life lobby is that all they want to do is get the child out of the mother, but they don't give a fuck about what happens afterwards.

 :indeed:

Unless that kid grows up to want an abortion.



Or stem cell treatment
"Eat it up.  Wear it out.  Make it do or do without." 

'People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.'
George Bernard Shaw

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #62 on: June 08, 2011, 02:56:47 PM »
Abortion is free in UK.  It is provided for all women regardless of social stance therefore would be an option for
homeless ladies.

I think you can get an abortion here at 23 weeks, although the process is made a bit more difficult due to
the procedure they use.

I used to believe that it was ok for any woman to have an abortion at any time. :zombiefuck:  I have become
much more thoughtful about it since having the urchin.  Actually the moment i found out i was having him
my attitude changed and i was "anybody comes anywhere near this baby i will fucking kill you"  I must
have been the most awkward customer at my midwife's check up's.

My views on it now are it should still definately be upto the mother, and no one else and no later than 12 weeks.
Despite this i do feel for the Dad's and think we should not expect them to just walk away so easily or 'man-up'
and i feel that there should be some counselling for them too. 

blah blah blah

midlifeaspie

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #63 on: June 08, 2011, 03:05:43 PM »
My latest is only 10 weeks along so this puts me in the situation of being able to consider this in real time.  If my wife suddenly left me and had an abortion ....... I don't know

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #64 on: June 08, 2011, 08:22:56 PM »
I think that Todd Holmes will have trouble proving in court that Nani Lawrence got an abortion, since she has been quoted as saying that she had a miscarriage and even Greg Fultz now says that he is not sure about this fact.
Haven't noticed her quoted as saying anything, only the account of friends, and know he has made statements of not knowing. Still for his attorney to make a public statement of truth as the basis of his defense, am wondering if he might have some proof. Seems he would have to. Though with the billboard, tweets, and who knows what else, she still has case for harassment depending on the what else.

I saw it about one and a third minutes into that YouTube video I posted a few pages ago.  The newscaster says that Nani Lawrence claimed she had a miscarriage and that now Greg Fultz is not sure whether or not she had an abortion, although he still believes she did.  Then he sent them that email sayng that he wasn't really playing himself on the billboard, he was merely portraying a character.


Osensitive1

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #65 on: June 08, 2011, 09:26:05 PM »
As is often the case,  the serious point in my post was overlooked. *
Sorry just now responding to this. Looked like a long apology so didn't read the whole thing the first time around. Didn't over look the serious part; in fact responded to it. You were talking about the perspective of the guy, and I pointed out his perspective was one of not knowing.

Offline Al Swearegen

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #66 on: June 09, 2011, 06:25:48 AM »
It is a strange topic because regardless of what is said a sad thing that comes out of it is that when it comes to Mother's rights to abort the baby society said unanimously "Yes, of course she has the right. It is her right" then if asked what are the Father's rights?", society falls rather silent on this point.

Simply put and by any reading, Women have rights in this discourse and Men don't.

Sad, huh?
I2 today is not i2 of yesteryear. It is a knitting circle. Those that participate be they nice or asshats know their place and the price to be there. Odeon is the overlord

.Benevolent if you toe the line.

Think it is I2 of old? Even Odeon is not so delusional as to think otherwise. He may on occasionally pretend otherwise but his base is that knitting circle.

Censoring/banning/restricting/moderating myself, Calanadale & Scrapheap were all not his finest moments.

How to apologise to Scrap

Offline Callaway

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #67 on: June 09, 2011, 08:24:24 AM »
It is a strange topic because regardless of what is said a sad thing that comes out of it is that when it comes to Mother's rights to abort the baby society said unanimously "Yes, of course she has the right. It is her right" then if asked what are the Father's rights?", society falls rather silent on this point.

Simply put and by any reading, Women have rights in this discourse and Men don't.

Sad, huh?

You're right that it's sad, but I think that it has to be that way because all a father has to do to make a baby is to ejaculate and he could choose to walk away from the mother and baby after that point with no risk to his life or health, while becoming a mother involves a much greater personal investment.  She's the one who has to put her life and health at risk to gestate this baby, so choosing to go through with it or not must be her own personal decision and nobody else's.

After the baby is born, both parents do have rights, which is why a mother can't sign away a father's rights to the baby, but while the baby can live only as a parasite inside the mother, the mother's rights have to trump the father's.


Offline Al Swearegen

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #68 on: June 09, 2011, 08:44:32 AM »
It is a strange topic because regardless of what is said a sad thing that comes out of it is that when it comes to Mother's rights to abort the baby society said unanimously "Yes, of course she has the right. It is her right" then if asked what are the Father's rights?", society falls rather silent on this point.

Simply put and by any reading, Women have rights in this discourse and Men don't.

Sad, huh?

You're right that it's sad, but I think that it has to be that way because all a father has to do to make a baby is to ejaculate and he could choose to walk away from the mother and baby after that point with no risk to his life or health, while becoming a mother involves a much greater personal investment.  She's the one who has to put her life and health at risk to gestate this baby, so choosing to go through with it or not must be her own personal decision and nobody else's.

After the baby is born, both parents do have rights, which is why a mother can't sign away a father's rights to the baby, but while the baby can live only as a parasite inside the mother, the mother's rights have to trump the father's.



Yes it is a funny topic Father's rights. When my ex decided to keep the kids off me for 9 months. She had right to the kids and I had none. They had been born and I had been an active and involved parent. Yet I had no "right" to see them.

I had to accept the fact that I could not see my children.

I had to endure a length and financially crippling court procedure (and a stress induced heart attack) to see them.
I had to do this and hold myself out by my commitment and actions as being worthy to have the right to be a Dad.
Funny one really.
In all of this her actions as a woman and  mother were not called into dispute and have never been.
She had rights and I had none.

A Father "could" do all of these things. They "could" walk away. "I" could have walked away. I did not and I would not yet my ability to was enough as the hypothetical father could to invalidate the rights.

I think things are not transparent and as cut and dried and that there definitely is a lot to be said for the inequities that society fall silent on. It won't change and to point them out really does nothing except shine a torch to a sad plight.

I will say whenever i hear stories of Father abducting kids and the like I often think, even in the ones with horrific consequences, "I know the media and society at large will take her side but I wonder what he went through and what she did to him to drive him to do what he did?"
I2 today is not i2 of yesteryear. It is a knitting circle. Those that participate be they nice or asshats know their place and the price to be there. Odeon is the overlord

.Benevolent if you toe the line.

Think it is I2 of old? Even Odeon is not so delusional as to think otherwise. He may on occasionally pretend otherwise but his base is that knitting circle.

Censoring/banning/restricting/moderating myself, Calanadale & Scrapheap were all not his finest moments.

How to apologise to Scrap

Offline Adam

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #69 on: June 09, 2011, 09:29:21 AM »
That's all a totally seperate issue though

When a woman gets pregnant, it is entirely her decision whether or not to get an abortion, and legally that is how it should be

midlifeaspie

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #70 on: June 09, 2011, 09:36:29 AM »
That's all a totally seperate issue though

When a woman gets pregnant, it is entirely her decision whether or not to get an abortion, and legally that is how it should be

Maybe on your side of the pond.  In several states a female under the age of 18 has to get her parents permission to get an abortion.

Offline Adam

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #71 on: June 09, 2011, 09:39:23 AM »
Hadn't thought about under-18s

I'm not actually sure about that

I know there's been a lot of stuff in the news before with people complaining about under 18s being given contraception without parental knowlegde/consent

Personally I believe NO ONE should be able to force a person to give birth against their will (assuming the pregnancy is still at an early stage)

and that includes parents

midlifeaspie

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #72 on: June 09, 2011, 09:47:31 AM »
Personally I believe NO ONE should be able to force a person to give birth against their will (assuming the pregnancy is still at an early stage)

State governments do a pretty good job here.  Many states don't have a single abortion provider anywhere in the state.  If a woman can afford to have one, and afford to take time off work to make a road trip to a neighboring state (and owns a car or knows someone who does) then she can get an abortion.  Otherwise she is just SOL.

Offline Al Swearegen

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #73 on: June 09, 2011, 09:50:07 AM »
That's all a totally seperate issue though

When a woman gets pregnant, it is entirely her decision whether or not to get an abortion, and legally that is how it should be

It is very much tied in context.

If the man has no rights and the woman has rights then acknowledging this is not a bad thing and justifying it rather pointless I feel.
I think perhaps just saying well someone has to lose out and society has deemed the Father to be the one to lose out. It also shows that this is not confinded to whether or not to give rights to unborn children.
I2 today is not i2 of yesteryear. It is a knitting circle. Those that participate be they nice or asshats know their place and the price to be there. Odeon is the overlord

.Benevolent if you toe the line.

Think it is I2 of old? Even Odeon is not so delusional as to think otherwise. He may on occasionally pretend otherwise but his base is that knitting circle.

Censoring/banning/restricting/moderating myself, Calanadale & Scrapheap were all not his finest moments.

How to apologise to Scrap

midlifeaspie

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Re: Have you seen this billboard?
« Reply #74 on: June 09, 2011, 09:53:37 AM »
That's all a totally seperate issue though

When a woman gets pregnant, it is entirely her decision whether or not to get an abortion, and legally that is how it should be

It is very much tied in context.

If the man has no rights and the woman has rights then acknowledging this is not a bad thing and justifying it rather pointless I feel.
I think perhaps just saying well someone has to lose out and society has deemed the Father to be the one to lose out. It also shows that this is not confinded to whether or not to give rights to unborn children.

Society does give a mixed message when they state that Father's have no rights and no say in what happens up until the moment the child is born, and then are legally obligated from that moment on.