Discuss GalileoAce

[Alex179]

Editing your birth certificate in the case of adoption is also a lie.   Basically trying to reverse who your real parents are and change it to some people who adopted you and not your real birth parents.   The legal purposes are another thing entirely, and are also complete bullshit.

Lol, well, if we're going to start talking about questions of morals, ethics, and what's right, why the hell are we talking about a legal document (or any part of the legal/governmental system)?

Besides, wouldn't the government still keep the original copy of the birth certificate, and simply file revised copies along side it?

They usually keep stuff like that, at least here in the US I would think they do.    I doubt they would destroy his original birth certificate just to make him feel better about himself.

I want to find my original one and frame it.  (If I could have it reinstated that would also be super cool, though I doubt it would actually happen.)

The problem here is that you're basically forcing your partner to change their sexual orientation since you have changed sex. Why should people need to do that? If you're not into a particular sex, then it shouldn't be a crime for doing so.

When the hell did this turn into GA forcing Ren to be a lesbian?  I thought he was forcing her to make an extremely difficult choice (essentially, to live, no matter what, in some far-less-than-ideal scenario).

I don't pretend that the legal system is right, at least not in my eyes.   We only started talking about birth certificates because GA stated that changing his was important.

What was it that makes you so proud about your original birth certificate that you would want to frame it?

GA is just forcing Ren to deal with his sex change.   If she is pansexual, it won't matter.   She married him as a man, not a woman, so it might cause problems.   I don't like the idea of marrying under false pretenses.   He is obviously not going to be the man she married.

[El]

I don't pretend that the legal system is right, at least not in my eyes.   We only started talking about birth certificates because GA stated that changing his was important.

What was it that makes you so proud about your original birth certificate that you would want to frame it?

GA is just forcing Ren to deal with his sex change.   If she is pansexual, it won't matter.   She married him as a man, not a woman, so it might cause problems.   I don't like the idea of marrying under false pretenses.   He is obviously not going to be the man she married.

Not pride, exactly.  My bio dad is certainly preferable to the father whose name is on my birth certificate.

Yes, GA is indeed putting ren into a situation where she is forced to deal with his sex change one way or another.  He's not forcing her to be pansexual or a lesbian or bisexual or whatever the hell would be applicable, though, which is *my* point.

[Adam]

and you can tell me I'm not X,Y or Z and I can not give a shit what you think 

That is what perception is all about.   As long as it doesn't get to you and you remain happy and content, you should be fine.

you seem to be under the impression that trans people choose hormones and/or surgery because of other people's perception of them/

That is all gender is about, perception, so yes they do.

Wow, you know an awful lot about me and my life, for an entirely different person

[ProfessorFarnsworth]

you seem to be under the impression that trans people choose hormones and/or surgery because of other people's perception of them/

That is all gender is about, perception, so yes they do.

I thought it would be more for attaining physical identity compatible to the psychological self-image of their gender in most cases. Basically the mind thinks it is a specific gender intrinsically, but is alienated by it's own physical form not matching it's mental profile.

[GalileoAce]

you seem to be under the impression that trans people choose hormones and/or surgery because of other people's perception of them/

That is all gender is about, perception, so yes they do.

I thought it would be more for attaining physical identity compatible to the psychological self-image of their gender in most cases. Basically the mind thinks it is a specific gender intrinsically, but is alienated by it's own physical form not matching it's mental profile.

That makes sense...I think.

[TheoK]

you seem to be under the impression that trans people choose hormones and/or surgery because of other people's perception of them/

That is all gender is about, perception, so yes they do.

I thought it would be more for attaining physical identity compatible to the psychological self-image of their gender in most cases. Basically the mind thinks it is a specific gender intrinsically, but is alienated by it's own physical form not matching it's mental profile.

If you were born a man you were "meant" to be a man. It's the self-image that needs to be corrected, if anything.

[Adam]

I'd rather fuck around with my body a little to align it to my gender than the opposite (fuck around with my brain to make it fit my body)

[TheoK]

Your gender is not a disease of any kind. It's like AS. It's not a disease either, but some Aspies try to adapt to fit the perception of the NT mindset.

[odeon]

The people that raise you do the parenting, but they aren't your biological parents.   

What's the difference, from a practical point of view, if the adoptive parents did it basically from day one?

They had no role in giving birth or actually making the baby.   This isn't a parents that raised me certificate, or a gender I changed to certificate.   It is about birth and what the status of a person was at that time.   This isn't a difficult concept. 

And yet you completely missed my point, which had *nothing* to do with a piece of paper stating dull facts about your birth.

[odeon]

you seem to be under the impression that trans people choose hormones and/or surgery because of other people's perception of them/

That is all gender is about, perception, so yes they do.

I thought it would be more for attaining physical identity compatible to the psychological self-image of their gender in most cases. Basically the mind thinks it is a specific gender intrinsically, but is alienated by it's own physical form not matching it's mental profile.

If you were born a man you were "meant" to be a man. It's the self-image that needs to be corrected, if anything.

That may not always be the case. For example: http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034

[Adam]

Alot of people are actually intersex is one way or another. And in a lot of cases the person has no idea about it till they get tests done for something else and it shows up. What I mean is it's notas simple as "if you're born looking like a boy then you're male, fullstop." Obviously, that's the case with the majority, but there's a very significant minority where that isn't the case. And when you consider that we all start off the same way anyway (whether we develop to be M or F), it's not that surprising there are so many who don't fit into categories they're assigned

[odeon]

That sounds logical to me.

[Adam]

omg I said "alot" 

[Callaway]

you seem to be under the impression that trans people choose hormones and/or surgery because of other people's perception of them/

That is all gender is about, perception, so yes they do.

I thought it would be more for attaining physical identity compatible to the psychological self-image of their gender in most cases. Basically the mind thinks it is a specific gender intrinsically, but is alienated by it's own physical form not matching it's mental profile.

If you were born a man you were "meant" to be a man. It's the self-image that needs to be corrected, if anything.

That may not always be the case. For example: http://jcem.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/85/5/2034

That's a very interesting article, Odeon.  Thanks for the link.

[Callaway]

Alot of people are actually intersex is one way or another. And in a lot of cases the person has no idea about it till they get tests done for something else and it shows up. What I mean is it's notas simple as "if you're born looking like a boy then you're male, fullstop." Obviously, that's the case with the majority, but there's a very significant minority where that isn't the case. And when you consider that we all start off the same way anyway (whether we develop to be M or F), it's not that surprising there are so many who don't fit into categories they're assigned

 

Like Caster Semenya, for example.