propaganda and lies about the NHS

[TheoK]

Isn't there already ASAN? I know over here we have our own chapter, ASAN_AU.

Although in those groups, you always get the crackpots of like that hang out at WP etc.

Yeah, they are busy running around warning of the non-existent danger of a cure for Autism. As for having a useful impact on our lives though, they have done nothing at all.

 

[Christopher McCandless]

there are plenty of aspie groups and organisations

and i agree about relatives of people with ASDs having too much of an impact. whenever I read about AS or autism in the media, it's always parents of autistic kids, about autistic kids, about how many kids get autistm etc. what do they think autistic kids grow up to be?

also a lot of parents of AS kids seem to come up with a load of crap a lot of the time imo

obviously kids are important, i'm not disputing that. but it would make more sense to listen to people who actually have AS than to parents who have some weird ideas about their kids

The problem with the aspie groups is they are not looking at how we can unite and help ourselves (what we really need!) - instead they look at the fringe obsessions.

Though the NAS we could easily get a lot of power within, if we bothered. I intend to stand as a candidate next year for their council - if we can get a lot of smart aspies to stand, then we can take control rather quickly. Having resources like that is when we can start to change things.

[Phlexor]

Explain these fringe obsessions and explain what you mean by helping ourselves, your interpretation of it that is.

[Christopher McCandless]

Explain these fringe obsessions and explain what you mean by helping ourselves, your interpretation of it that is.

Fringe Obsessions  - I mean those which whilst apparently being a massive part of the Autism rights movement, we get no benefit from campaigning for them. Examples include fighting a cure for Autism, competing to be the most "high functioning" / "low functioning", Amanda Baggs "this is my language", trying to make an Autistic Culture and so on. Whilst all those might provide an obsession to tick the days away, they make no impact towards improving our lives.

As for helping ourselves, the idea would be to look for and lobby for improvements and changes made to society, setting up a network in order to get around the nepotism and cronyism which runs our society, looking at technological innovations which would allow us to fit in more without changing ourselves (essentially rendering the social game irrelevant) and disrupting changes which occur to our detriment. This all could be wrapped up inside a social meritocracy movement relatively easily.

[Phlexor]

Explain these fringe obsessions and explain what you mean by helping ourselves, your interpretation of it that is.

Fringe Obsessions  - I mean those which whilst apparently being a massive part of the Autism rights movement, we get no benefit from campaigning for them. Examples include fighting a cure for Autism, competing to be the most "high functioning" / "low functioning", Amanda Baggs "this is my language", trying to make an Autistic Culture and so on. Whilst all those might provide an obsession to tick the days away, they make no impact towards improving our lives.

As for helping ourselves, the idea would be to look for and lobby for improvements and changes made to society, setting up a network in order to get around the nepotism and cronyism which runs our society, looking at technological innovations which would allow us to fit in more without changing ourselves (essentially rendering the social game irrelevant) and disrupting changes which occur to our detriment. This all could be wrapped up inside a social meritocracy movement relatively easily.

In other words, it should be about your fringe obsession then? 

I don't see how that's any different.

[odeon]

Quite a leap to claim that self dx is more reliable, though.

I think at an older age it might be - I am usually pretty quick to tell if someone is on the spectrum. Mind I may not catch everyone, but I have never been wrong when I say yes. The reason being is I have 20 years of experience, I know most of the ways people try to hide it and their reasons for doing so.

Yes, you have a point, obviously. A lot of us are v good at spotting other aspies.

I was thinking more about the adolescent syndrome sufferers at WP, all of whom have dx'd themselves with AS. Most of them are wrong. Social ineptitude or a sense of not belonging does not equal autism spectrum disorder.

[odeon]

But self DX and amateur DX are worse. I think it only hurts our cause and/or public image.

Most self-dx'ers are wrong. Most amateur dx'ers in general, likewise. That said, I think Hadron's got a point in that some of us can often spot an aspie. It's not the same as actually dx'ing one, though, and he won't ever make any money from it because spotting one or two is very different from anything resembling an actual diagnosis.

The self-dx'ers definitely hurt whatever image we have left with the public.

[Christopher McCandless]

Explain these fringe obsessions and explain what you mean by helping ourselves, your interpretation of it that is.

Fringe Obsessions  - I mean those which whilst apparently being a massive part of the Autism rights movement, we get no benefit from campaigning for them. Examples include fighting a cure for Autism, competing to be the most "high functioning" / "low functioning", Amanda Baggs "this is my language", trying to make an Autistic Culture and so on. Whilst all those might provide an obsession to tick the days away, they make no impact towards improving our lives.

As for helping ourselves, the idea would be to look for and lobby for improvements and changes made to society, setting up a network in order to get around the nepotism and cronyism which runs our society, looking at technological innovations which would allow us to fit in more without changing ourselves (essentially rendering the social game irrelevant) and disrupting changes which occur to our detriment. This all could be wrapped up inside a social meritocracy movement relatively easily.

In other words, it should be about your fringe obsession then? 

I don't see how that's any different.

Key difference, I am about solving actual problems - the big one being that we are not afforded anything like the opportunities we would get if we were not "disabled". I am never going to ask that we get afforded a load of social jobs despite being not very good at socialising. What I am suggesting is that we do not get denied jobs that we could do with reasonable adjustments, and the same principle goes with opportunities. It is a real problem that only 15% of us are employed (excluding low functioning people here obviously). Though of course there are those of us whom are quite happy to continue sitting on their arses all their lives, I guess.

[Christopher McCandless]

But self DX and amateur DX are worse. I think it only hurts our cause and/or public image.

Most self-dx'ers are wrong. Most amateur dx'ers in general, likewise. That said, I think Hadron's got a point in that some of us can often spot an aspie. It's not the same as actually dx'ing one, though, and he won't ever make any money from it because spotting one or two is very different from anything resembling an actual diagnosis.

The self-dx'ers definitely hurt whatever image we have left with the public.

I would say I am spotted more than a couple, though I have the advantage of being in an environment where I am likely to meet a lot of Aspies, not that I ever directly mention this to them. But I do agree that the WP self-diagnosers are a problem - though I think we have to get away from the idea merely raising awareness will somehow change things for us for the better. If anything, I suspect it is going to make our situation a lot worse, the general public are too thick to understand the intricacies, so we will end up with a round of inaccurate stereotypes, along with the expectations which go with them.

[odeon]

But would you reliably be able to dx someone who's not a student or part of that social setting? Say, someone past 30? Or, going the other way, would you be able to dx a six-year-old boy? There are a number of conditions that can (and should, because it's not--or at least should not--be an intellectual game) be considered. Making the wrong dx will harm that boy.

[Christopher McCandless]

But would you reliably be able to dx someone who's not a student or part of that social setting? Say, someone past 30? Or, going the other way, would you be able to dx a six-year-old boy? There are a number of conditions that can (and should, because it's not--or at least should not--be an intellectual game) be considered. Making the wrong dx will harm that boy.

Well there was a girl at uni whom I strongly suspected was an Aspie (on meeting) and lo and behold her brother gets a diagnosis a while down the line, so I could if I did a meet the relatives. But there are cases that I have suspected. That said - I wouldn't dream of saying something unless I was absolutely sure.

[matthe]

i didnt realize...ok then

[Phlexor]

You do know that people with an abusive childhood can present the same as someone with aspergers. So how does your untrained eye deal with that fact?

[Christopher McCandless]

You do know that people with an abusive childhood can present the same as someone with aspergers. So how does your untrained eye deal with that fact?

Your assuming I can't tell the difference.

[Phlexor]

You do know that people with an abusive childhood can present the same as someone with aspergers. So how does your untrained eye deal with that fact?

Your assuming I can't tell the difference.

No, I'm assuming you're arrogant