Author Topic: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!  (Read 1973 times)

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ozymandias

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #15 on: September 25, 2008, 08:43:58 AM »
I try my best to keep my own little corner of the planet, clean and green, recycle, reuse, as much as possible.  But, this bullshit green fad is really cynical commercialism on the big corporations part.  If the majority of humanity wasn't such sheep, we wouldn't have all the problems we do now.

**ozymandias shakes his head and decides to take a walk down his road and pick up the trash that litters the roadside since the the last time he picked up the crap.  Two days ago.**

Offline Trigger 11

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #16 on: September 25, 2008, 12:42:49 PM »
This thread is very interesting to me. At an early age, I’m talking before I even hit double digits, I became a self-proclaimed environmentalist. Growing up as one during the excess of the 80’s resulted in being made fun of quite a bit. So much of what I was taught at an early age made me sick. Stuff like the Earth was provided for man to do as he wished, and other nonsense. I decided I would do whatever I could do to reduce my impact on the environment. It started off with recycling everything and anything I could. Gradually as I got older and much more wise, I was able to start reducing my waste. I would ask myself, “Even if the packaging is recyclable, is there an alternative that has even less impact?” In high school I was vocal about environmentalism, which made me even less popular. Apparently, making suggestions on how to be “more responsible” kind of pisses people off.

One of my first jobs was working for a landscaping crew that cut all of the grass alongside the roads and on the medians in Virginia Beach, VA. My buddy and I were the “blowers.” Ha ha! I know what you’re thinking. Anyway, our first task was to clear the roads of litter before the mowers came through. Then we would be taken back to the beginning of the road and start blowing the grass clippings back up into the grass and off of the road. Being environmentally conscious, we alternated days in which one of us carried a recycle bag, in addition to a trash bag. On a weekly basis we would fill up the entire bed of my buddy’s pick-up truck and take it down to the City recycling facility. We were not told to do this. It was not in the contract with the City. It was just something that my friend and I decided should be done and we were willing to make the effort. The City ended up praising us while taking credit for what we did of our own accord.

In college, I participated in environmental activities and promoted environmental causes. Now that I was living on my own and buying my own stuff, I realized how much waste there was in plastic and paper bags at grocery, and other, stores. I made a conscious decision to no longer get bags and started bringing my own hemp and canvas bags. Since I made that decision 17 years ago, I have not once gotten a plastic or paper bag. Early on, I took a lot of flack. For “security” reasons, the merchants would claim they “have to” put my merchandise in their bag. This made no sense to me. If I bought it, and I had a receipt, where is the problem? When a merchant would not back down, I simply walked away and did not pay for the stuff. In more recent years I have become known as the eccentric “bag man” in this town. I love the fact that when I go to Europe, mostly Germany, many merchants do not even have bags and you are expected to bring your own. It in fact saves them money and is environmentally responsible as well. Why this is so hard to catch on, I cannot understand. Oh…wait a minute. Americans are lazy, selfish fucks, so if there is any effort to “being green” the rest of us can fuck off.

With the popularity of “being green” growing, it has become accepted and followed, to some extent anyway, by many more people. I don’t see this as a bad thing, but part of me is buggered by the fact I was preaching this same stuff 20 years ago and nobody would listen. But I digress. It is more important that people are starting to take a more responsible attitude towards their impact to the planet. I am also not bothered so much by the commercialism of “being green”, as one of the arguments me and my fellow environmentalists used to make was that companies could make money off of this if they would just commit to it. Unfortunately, humans are inherently selfish, which is one of the reasons I abhor Capitalism. Look at where the US economy is now! Greedy mortgage companies took advantage of people who had no business taking out such huge loans, especially with variable interest rates. Now, I have to pay to bail out the large financial institutions who wrote these mortgages. But that is a whole other topic. Because of Capitalism and greed, which are really the same thing, you have companies taking advantage of the popularity of “being green” and making up crap to make a profit. That is bullshit! But at the same time, if we have to deal with some of that in order to get a larger portion of the corporate world to actually do right by the environment, then I’ll live with this alternative for the time being. While I’d prefer mandatory, government instituted reduction, reusing, and recycling, seeing where we came from in the 70’s, 80’s, and 90’s, at least some of the world’s population is finally getting the picture.

I probably came across as pretentious and self-righteous to some people, but this is what I believe and how I live my life, to reduce my footprint on the Earth. Do I look down on people who don’t make an effort? I’m not going to lie…yes! I work for the Government and we have been mandated to reduce paper by going digital, and we have recycling containers we are supposed to use for plastics, aluminum, and paper. Many people in my office will print out 100+ page documents, single-sided, so they can review it. The printer defaults to single-sided, but if you take the 10 seconds to change the settings to double-sided, you are at least reducing the waste in paper by half…although they should be reviewing the electronic copy. I actually print out less than 20 pages a year and either double-side things that have to be printed formally or, better yet, I use the second side of paper that was discarded by the lame fucktards in here and set the printer to manual paper and walk to the printer and insert the clear side of my own sheet of paper for the print job. In my particular building, no person is further than 15 feet from the recycling bins, yet half of the people in here throw their bottles, cans, and paper into their waste basket, which is tossed in the garbage dumpster by the cleaning crew. To me, this is just being a lazy, self-indulgent fucktard. Most of these fucktards are fat and could use the exercise for fuck’s sake. It makes me sick.

Over the past year I have been conducting experiments with my car to figure out ways to significantly reduce my emissions and gas consumption. I am not financially in a place to buy a full electric, or at least a hybrid to bridge the gap, but I do drive a manual transmission car that averages over 30 mph. Last Spring I came up with the idea of shutting the engine off at stop lights and in traffic conditions when my car was idle for at least a few seconds. Since I started this, the average mph for my car has gone up by over 3 mph. In addition, I have already saved 10x more money than it would cost me to replace both the battery and the starter should they fail due to their over use starting the car so many times.

So where am I going with all of this? Well, I believe everyone should make an effort, but I no longer push my ideals of what that effort should be on people. I still like to share my efforts in hopes someone else might institute them as well or, even better, come up with a superior alternative and share it with me.

I am an environmentalist. Have been and always will be one. I am proud to call myself one. But everybody else has to make their own decisions. My only responsibility is to raise my kids with the understanding of how they individually impact the planet and what they can do to reduce it. Hopefully they will make decisions later in life that will continue, and maybe expand, my efforts. They are the future, and I want them to have one.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2008, 12:59:50 PM by Trigger11 »
Crazy, I'm halfway to crazy
Suicide would waste me
Homicide would break me
Tongue tied and tied to the tongue
Tongue tied and tied to the tongue
Oh, is life as bad as dreams
I guess that's just the way it seems

Offline ALLDAYGLOWRANDY

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #17 on: September 25, 2008, 02:27:36 PM »
I have seen nutritionalist passing along bullshit to patients.  Mike and some other lady putting away vegetables was saying shit to me, people are stupid :laugh:

They don't knock, they just try and enter.
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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #18 on: September 25, 2008, 02:43:57 PM »
The way to make people more green in the true sense of the word not these fads is through their pocket books.  Tax credits for recycling, conservation and such.  Oil being so expensive is doing wonders for my business which is retrofitting older homes with cellulose insulation a real green product.  Not one of these green in name only things
"Eat it up.  Wear it out.  Make it do or do without." 

'People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.'
George Bernard Shaw

Offline Lucifer

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #19 on: September 25, 2008, 02:46:02 PM »
People are lazy, selfish fucks, so if there is any effort to “being green” the rest of us can fuck off.

fixed, and QFT.   :plus:

fucking excellent post, trig.   :plus:  i haven't got kids, and it incenses me to see people who do have kids being completely profligate, selfish, inconsiderate, or simply - and i suspect this is the main reason, which sickens me - just thoughtless.

the main cause of bullshit green is the consumer religion prevalent in the world today.  we shouldn't be buying better, we should be buying LESS.  so few people stop to think whether or not they actually need something.  a new mobile every six months?  why the fuck does anyone need a new phone every six months?  ditto with most consumer goods, especially technology.

i've hesitated before responding to this thread, dawg, beacuse i've so much to say, and most of it makes me so depressed and angry, and i'm still a bit ill, so i haven't the energy.  :(
« Last Edit: September 25, 2008, 02:50:19 PM by Lucifer »

Offline Lucifer

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #20 on: September 25, 2008, 02:46:27 PM »
The way to make people more green in the true sense of the word not these fads is through their pocket books.  Tax credits for recycling, conservation and such.  Oil being so expensive is doing wonders for my business which is retrofitting older homes with cellulose insulation a real green product.  Not one of these green in name only things

sad, but true.  see above.

Offline DirtDawg

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #21 on: September 25, 2008, 02:47:53 PM »
Trigger11,

You are to be commended for being so conscious of environmental concerns at such a young age. It's practically unheard of!
My interest began as a fairly young person, also. Trying to understand horticulture, which has always been an obsession, led me to discover environmental processes of which most people are unaware. Honestly, though, it is only in the past ten years or so have I begun to do more than simply garden responsibly.

Thanks for posting your thoughts. An excellent contribution!
We could all learn from your example, too.

My biggest frustration pertaining to this issue is that, as Parts and Ozy have touched upon, even seemingly intelligent adults have no clue whether they are being smart with nature or not.

I may have already posted about this elsewhere, but I had a bit of a falling out with my sister-in-law over her jumping on the Green bandwagon without thinking through what she was doing. She essentially filled up two semi-trailer sized dumpsters with her renovation garbage, without even recycling any of it. The worst part was that the two year old carpet and the five year old siding were still in great shape. She just wanted to Buy Green, but then she filled two dumpsters headed for the landfill!!
The laughable part was that she threw all that recyclable waste out and bought products made from recycled sources.
This shit has got to stop.

(AGAIN, my favorite smiley!!)

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Ghandi: Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.

The end result of life's daily pain and suffering, trials and failures, tears and laughter, readings and listenings is an accumulation of wisdom in its purest form.

Offline Lucifer

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #22 on: September 25, 2008, 02:50:06 PM »
exactly.   :thumbup:

and  :plus: for starting the discussion.

Offline DirtDawg

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #23 on: September 25, 2008, 03:04:09 PM »
exactly.   :thumbup:

and  :plus: for starting the discussion.

Ya know, even so-called, "uncivilised" American Indians had a better grasp of this issue, three or four hundred years ago, than most people today.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2008, 03:05:57 PM by DirtDawg »
Jimi Hendrix: When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. 

Ghandi: Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.

The end result of life's daily pain and suffering, trials and failures, tears and laughter, readings and listenings is an accumulation of wisdom in its purest form.

Offline Lucifer

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #24 on: September 25, 2008, 03:05:37 PM »
funny how we call the industrialised world "civilised", and tribal/indigenous peoples "savages" or "developing", isn't it?

Offline DirtDawg

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #25 on: September 25, 2008, 03:23:00 PM »
funny how we call the industrialised world "civilised", and tribal/indigenous peoples "savages" or "developing", isn't it?

... and in our smugness, refer to them as primitive, Stone Age proto-colonies.
 :wanker:
Jimi Hendrix: When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. 

Ghandi: Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.

The end result of life's daily pain and suffering, trials and failures, tears and laughter, readings and listenings is an accumulation of wisdom in its purest form.

Offline Trigger 11

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #26 on: September 25, 2008, 03:45:58 PM »
exactly.   :thumbup:

and  :plus: for starting the discussion.

Ya know, even so-called, "uncivilised" American Indians had a better grasp of this issue, three or four hundred years ago, than most people today.

When I was young I was inspired by much of what I learned about "Native Americans." By the same token I was completely disillusioned by the religious and corporate cultures in America.

Two of my favorite books are:

"The Wisdom Of The Native Americans" ebdited by Kent Nerburn

and

"Touch The Earth" by T.C. McLuhan

"Touch The Earth" was the inspiration for one of my favorite songs "Close To The Fires" by The Samples.

"Close To The Fires" by The Samples

The blue skies are turning brown
And trees fall without a sound
Jets crashing through the sky
The big sun is burning high

The oceans are turning black
Tuna nets are dolphin traps
Oil spills near a garbage barge
It's dumping needles and hospital jars

Mmmmmmmmmmmm

Mmmmmmmmmmmm

But close to the fires, and under a trance
The Indians sang and said with a dance
Take what you need and leave the rest
Take what you need and leave it alone

The landscape is full of holes
For private business or personal goals
Nevada's testing the nuclear sin
Designing wars that no one can win

The karma debts are out of control
They're bathing me inside my soul
Beauty pageants with glamorous furs
Can you believe what they once were?

Mmmmmmmmmmmm

Mmmmmmmmmmmm

But close to the fires, and under a trance
The Indians sang, and said with their dance
To take what you need and leave the rest
To take what you need and leave it alone

Leave it alone…
Leave it alone…
Leave it alone…
Leave it alone…
Leave it alone…

The blue skies are turning brown
The blue skies are turning brown
Our blue skies are turning brown
Our blue skies are turning brown



Crazy, I'm halfway to crazy
Suicide would waste me
Homicide would break me
Tongue tied and tied to the tongue
Tongue tied and tied to the tongue
Oh, is life as bad as dreams
I guess that's just the way it seems

ozymandias

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #27 on: September 25, 2008, 04:21:43 PM »
funny how we call the industrialised world "civilised", and tribal/indigenous peoples "savages" or "developing", isn't it?

... and in our smugness, refer to them as primitive, Stone Age proto-colonies.
 :wanker:

 :indeed:

Offline Parts

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #28 on: September 25, 2008, 04:54:14 PM »
Trigger11,

You are to be commended for being so conscious of environmental concerns at such a young age. It's practically unheard of!
My interest began as a fairly young person, also. Trying to understand horticulture, which has always been an obsession, led me to discover environmental processes of which most people are unaware. Honestly, though, it is only in the past ten years or so have I begun to do more than simply garden responsibly.

Thanks for posting your thoughts. An excellent contribution!
We could all learn from your example, too.

My biggest frustration pertaining to this issue is that, as Parts and Ozy have touched upon, even seemingly intelligent adults have no clue whether they are being smart with nature or not.

I may have already posted about this elsewhere, but I had a bit of a falling out with my sister-in-law over her jumping on the Green bandwagon without thinking through what she was doing. She essentially filled up two semi-trailer sized dumpsters with her renovation garbage, without even recycling any of it. The worst part was that the two year old carpet and the five year old siding were still in great shape. She just wanted to Buy Green, but then she filled two dumpsters headed for the landfill!!
The laughable part was that she threw all that recyclable waste out and bought products made from recycled sources.
This shit has got to stop.

(AGAIN, my favorite smiley!!)

:hair:

I see this all the time just south of where I live is called the Gold Coast  I see so much waste in the name of being green or just change it makes me sick.  My skylight in my house came form one of these places if I didn't take it is was destined for the dumpster it was only a year old and cost originally over $1000.  Two years ago on worked on a house that was beautiful all hand done woodwork by one of the best trim carpenters in town the people sold it and torn it down recycling almost nothing. The new peoples idea of going green was foam insulation for heat then they put mahogany and teek decks on it
« Last Edit: September 25, 2008, 04:56:12 PM by parts »
"Eat it up.  Wear it out.  Make it do or do without." 

'People who say it cannot be done should not interrupt those who are doing it.'
George Bernard Shaw

Offline DirtDawg

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Re: Green is good, but how do we RE-educate others about BULLSHIT GREEN!
« Reply #29 on: September 25, 2008, 05:06:06 PM »

Insanity!

Pyraxis made a really good point too about how so much of this type of issue is shoved down peoples' throat once something newsworthy happens, that most people react by tuning it out or becoming numb to the cause.
Jimi Hendrix: When the power of love overcomes the love of power the world will know peace. 

Ghandi: Live as if you were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.

The end result of life's daily pain and suffering, trials and failures, tears and laughter, readings and listenings is an accumulation of wisdom in its purest form.